Talk me through this - male on placement with brownies

[nevernotstruggling]

The dds have been to the same brownie unit for around 4 years (dd1 waiting to move up to guides). I know the leaders quite well and there has been one staff changeover in that time. The communication with parents has been excellent. I have felt safe letting the dds go on sleepovers knowing that I know all the adults involved. It's actually been brilliant in terms of safeguarding. No surprises or anything parents haven't been informed of. The dds love it. Dd2 is thriving there because it's a small closed group where she feels safe and familiar.

I dropped the dds off this week and a man came up to dd1 touches her shoulder and said 'you're it' I said to brown owl - who is that?? She replied oh it's Dave (not his name obvs). Me - who is Dave??? BO - he's on work placement (something about youth work) . Me - Er is he DBS checked?? BO- yes. Me- Brownies is a girls group!! BO - we have dads helping! No they don't. Not once the whole time we have attended.

Apparently Dave will be there for 4 weeks.

My reaction has been negative. I'm quite annoyed there was no warning of Dave jointing the unit. There have never been 'work placements' before. I think it was be something to do with the church though.

I think parents should have been told. They use a private Facebook group to keep in touch with parents and this works really well so I'm a bit baffled by the surprise!

So what'd happen if a new man teacher started at primary school?

Nothing would happen

Just to keep people clued in, I suppose. Not particularly useful, I agree.

I am a governor and have sat on teacher/headteacher interview panels. As part of interview process they will either have to teach a class or observe a lesson. Again how would OP cope with that ( and they won’t have a DBS for that school, that will be sorted if they are the successful applicant)

There's also a difference between a new, permanent member of staff, who might possibly be introduced before starting and an ad hoc supply teacher brought in to cover short term absence, possibly with only a couple of hours notice - there is no way that school informs parents if this is happening.

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Also if a person is coming in for an interview for their first post as a teaching assistant they many not have a DBS in place anywhere at all. And they will be asked to do a task with a small group of children. Obviously they won't be on their own with the children as the interview panel will be watching them closely, but the likelihood of Dave being left on his own with children in the Brownie group is slim too.

yes of course I’m lying about it??? Seriously??? You think because my kids schools can make a reasonable adjustment yours would struggle to, I must be lying?

So your school phone all parents before supply teachers enter the school?

If not, then yes, you are lying.

There is absolutely no way this happens.

Of course they don't ring about supply teachers. You make get updates on long term staffing changes but no one has the time to ring parents about day to day supply, that's utter nonsense

So 5zeds if a teacher phones in sick early in the morning and they need to get a supply in, how do all the teachers and pupils get to know the supply teacher before they come into school.

The OP also needs to get know the adult well before she trusts them, so phoning her to let her know supply teacher Bob is going to be teaching her DD's class that morning probably isn't going to help her that much.

I’m not suggesting OP and BO do anything of the sort. I was saying that we’ve been helped in this way in the past.
OP should do what she thinks and ask for accommodations that she believes will help her child if she appropriate. BO should try and come to an outcome that works for everyone (which could easily be, this is how we do things take it or leave it).

5zeds do you get informed when governors are visiting the school?

I thought 5zeds merely stated the school made a reasonable adjustment for her child and kept their family informed of changes? Rather than every single family in the school.

Considering all the shouting about "equality" on this thread I'm not sure why posters have seemingly missed the significance of the reference to reasonable adjustments.

But I don't think OP was asking for reasonable adjustments in her opening post, she was annoyed there was a man there and the parents hadn't been informed on the facebook page. I would assume reasonable adjustment would be that she would have been informed separately so she could prepare her DD, as I assume the majority of other parents wouldn't care that Dave was going to be there for 4 weeks.

Not really a thread about school is it

Reasonable adjustments are made for disabilities, under the Equalty Act, how does that apply here?

Op, are you saying tbat you and your daughters are ok with strange men in other settings eg school, just not at Brownies?

School was brought up by a poster up thread. OP is talking about a club, for girls, that has been single sex for four years, which she had reasonable expectation would remain so. She didn’t do anything wrong. She asked who the young man playing with her daughter was and what capacity he was there in and if that role meant he was dbs checked. Good parenting and presumably to be expected.

OP are you going to let your DDs go to Brownies this week if Dave is still there?

5zeds the OP also said she doesn’t let her DDs go to activity centres as she doesn’t know the adults there, so her concerns must be more than Brownies being a single sex unit.

I was removed from GG for complaining about the safeguarding issues involved in allowing boys and men who identify as girls and women to join as regular members (not occasional or unit helpers).
The safeguarding around men and boys who do not think they are female, however, is robust. My son, aged four at the time, had to use a separate loo to me on camp and sleep in a separate tent compartment.
I understand this was a bit of a shock to you as it's not widely known that men can volunteer in Guiding. Indeed, as others have said, it might make it harder for some girls to join at all.
I'd have a word with Brown Owl and say you would have appreciated some notice as you know you aren't the only one who didn't know this was a thing.

I've written some more about the issue here

medium.com/4th-wave-feminism/a-year-ago-i-was-removed-from-girlguiding-d72f0e9f9692

I would also say that it's good practice to introduce all adults to all parents. So many of my own unit parents didn't know my name, let alone other helpers. I tried my best to avoid this by frequent introductions.

OP is talking about a club, for girls, that has been single sex for four years, which she had reasonable expectation would remain so. She didn’t do anything wrong.

It's a club which clearly states that it's single sex for children only (TG issues aside) but not for helpers. The fact that, until now, all helpers happen to have been female, is neither here nor there.

To date, it might happen that they've never have had a helper called Karen, or any helpers from Northern Ireland; but if Karen from Lisburn had moved to the area and came along to join them (having been DBS-checked,of course), you wouldn't go off on one and complain "But this is a Karen-and-NI-free club - it has been for four years!"

Don’t be ridiculous @WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll Her dd isn’t phased by Irish-Karen’s. Stop trying to build a case and think about the child who this club is set up to nurture.