How would you punish DD?

[Seasonalanxiety]

DD is 14. Yesterday she was supposed to meet friends in central London for the afternoon, shop, have dinner and be back at her friend's house for a sleepover by 9.30.

I am a strict parent according to DD. I still track her phone, check with parents if she's having a sleepover, remove devices at 10pm. Her friends are all lovely but seem less supervised which makes me anxious. They are all very privileged but seemingly have a lot more freedom than I allow DD. However DD has been very depressed recently due to other issues and had been self harming. These friends are kind, super supportive and have done wonders for her state of mind.

So this morning I check her tracker. She only got home at midnight! I'm furious about this but at least they were travelling in a big group (6 girls). However the worst thing is that they then went out again at 2.30 to the McDonalds at the end of the road whilst the mother slept on a different floor. They got home at 3.00am.
I'm so angry I don't know what to do with myself. DD has admitted it all, not lied or made excuses, apologised and said she knew it was a bad choice but she didn't want to be the only one not going. She's begging me not to tell friends mum.

I'm thinking no more sleepovers with friends and limiting her interactions with them as I need to keep her safe. However we've only just been confident enough in her mental health to return the sharp knives back to the kitchen and these girls are a big reason why. And they are nice girls. They have been kind and inclusive and they are clever and play sport and participate in life- they are just allowed more freedom than I'm comfortable with.

Dd upstairs sobbing. Please no one tell me to ban her from seeing them entirely until you've gone round your house removing all the sharp objects because your daughter is so miserable.

I just have no idea how to handle it.

I've made it clear how upset and angry I am. I've explained why. Now what?

OP I feel for you. It's hard to watch your child suffering mental health issues and you sound a loving parent.

I would focus on the mental health. If she's found a group of kind, decent, supportive girls that have helped her to feel better about herself .... that's everything. I don't think this calls for punishment. To me it calls for a chat about how you understand that she wants to keep these friends, and why. And I would explain that you want that too. And that you both also want DD to be safe. So how do you, together, work out the best thing to have done, and to do in the future ? That's the conversation I would have. Support her, stand with her, don't punish her. I think it's the best way to keep her safe - self harming is at least as great a threat as going out late. When she is this vulnerable, support anything that promotes her mental health.

HTH. And I hope it goes well for you and your dd.

I don't think she made a bad choice at all in the circumstances, I think she made a very difficult choice but ultimately the right one. A group of 6 14yr olds is a reasonably safe place to be, not to mention fun and happy and supported. The alternative was to either ruin the whole group's evening and lose the friendships altogether or at least not be invited out with them again - with resultant impact on her fragile mental health (this would be devastating to a 14yo, especially with her previous issues), or leaving all her friends and travelling home so late alone, which you admit you'd have been livid about, even though that's effectively what you asked her to do!
She made a reasonable and sensible choice, and I would tell her so. And I also think you need to give her a bit more freedom to make the choices she needs to make when you're not there.

I think you need to relax and trust her. Teenager do lots of things that adults don't like, it's part of growing up. I don't think punishing her will make the situation better. It sounds like you have a good relationship if she's able to talk to you about it so I'd leave it.

MarySidney tf, I was beginning to think it was only me that thought Maccys at 2.30am sounded fun. I remember clearly that feeling at 14 the thrill of doing something different, nothing illegal just that first taste of freedom.
Agree with the majority of posters. I do think you shouldn't be tracking her unless you are genuinely worried. Tell her you won't use the tracking feature to check up on her just in a real emergency.

I would go and give her a big hug and tell her you have calmed down now, let's sit down with a cup of tea and have a proper conversation about it.

Tell her that this is all new for you as well, and you are more anxious than usual as well because you've been so worried about her - this isn't guilt-tripping, it's being honest about the fact that a child's mental health and self-harm affects everyone.

Say what you've said to us - that you want her to be safe as well as happy, that you think overall these friends are very good for her. She needs to know that you understand that she needs her friends and that your ultimate goal isn't to reduce her freedom and isolate her in the name of keeping her safe.

I think you should stop with the phone tracker. I understand that it will be difficult for you when you're used to having it there, but I think measures like this erode trust, and it's more important to have a relationship where the child doesn't resent you or view you as Big Brother, and will come to you when they fuck up, or something happens that frightens them.

I've been there with a self-harming unpredictable teenager who wanted more licence than I felt comfortable giving. It's a knife-edge you're living on, you never feel as though you're getting it right. It gets better

If this is the worst thing your dd ever does you will have got off light. Ease up, just have a chat and explain the dangers at that hour off night..her and her friends sound like a good bunch. If you daughter has got support from them i wouldnt put any restrictions on this time. Good lecture end of..

I'd treat it as a growing up and learning experience for her. As she gets older it's going to be hardr to be that involved in where she goes and when.

I think I'd focus on teaching her what to do if she finds herself in a situation that she isn't comfortable with or if something goes wrong. ie if she got split up from the group for some reason. Who to call, where to wait, etc strategies.

It is all part of growing up and risk assessing but also learning when the risk is going too high. She's got to experience some risk to learn that skill.

It is hard though as a parent to get used to that though, especially when it's a new situation. I'm not sure I'm going to be particularly good at it myself! 😂

I don’t think you need to do anything,other than tell her ,Thankyou for being honest
Seriously what else was she supposed to do when the all the other girls were heading to McDonald’s ?
You say yourself they are a nice group ,no one was left out ,they all went home together.no harm done ,chill

tell her friends that you found out and are agreeing not to tell the other Mum on the proviso that they all observe your rules in future.

That's really unfair. They can't all be expected to live by your rules!

Has she had counselling? It's great her friends are supportive but that's not their role.

How long so you plan to keep up your surveillance of her?

I'd ground her for a week and take her phone for two days. If she's upstairs sobbing sounds like she's got the message.

Phone tracker is a tad stalkerish
I’ve raised 4 kids ,and never needed a phone tracker .

@DukeChatsworth

In my house we have a deal. She tells the truth and whilst there might be a consequence there is no anger.

What a wise parent. Reminds me of my own DF all those years ago!

Oh this is such a tough age - my mum was so strict (I wouldn’t have been allowed on a sleepover in the first place) but it’s really hard to be the person saying no to something at this age - not least because you’ll likely end up going home alone etc.

Given that the MacDonald’s is at the end of the road and that you were happy for them to be out at 9pm, I can’t really work out what you thought might happen to them. I am genuinely asking, not being snippy.

I agree with DukeChatsworth that keeping communications open is the most important thing.

I also think what they did wasn’t actually that dangerous, if they were in a big group and sober. I’d be far more concerned about self harming than staying out late and 2.30am trips to McDonalds.

My only concerns would be - 1) where were they till midnight? If in a restaurant/travelling back then fine. But if they stopped off somewhere else I’d want to know where. 2) the fact she didn’t feel she could argue with the group - that could lead to her doing something genuinely daft to follow the herd in future. Although, I suspect in this case she was having fun and didn’t want to argue

I don't think you can impose a curfew when she's at someone's house.

Given your update I think you need to talk to your DD honestly. Explain why past events have scared you and have made you too cautious. Tell her how you have realized this was a mistake and you will try to manage your anxiety levels. Tell her that breaking the rules was wrong but you can see why she did itin the context. Maybe the best thing is to draw a line under this, revise your rules, relax a bit and give her space to make decisions, including the decision to call you for help if she ever needs it.

I also think you need to relax, in the grand scheme of things your DD hasn't actually done anything wrong. She came home a little later than planned and walked down to the end of rd for some food with her friends. It isn't ideal, but she wasn't really in any kind of danger.

I would talk to her about being safe and leave it at that!

I think you need to really think about your boundaries and which ones you expect her to prioritise. For me, the most important boundary when out at night with friends is to stay with your friends. There's no way I'd want her breaking off and heading home alone because she has a curfew.

Punish is a strong word. Ease off or it could get a lot worse.

Why did she tell you they popped out at 2:30?
Surely she and her friends wanted to keep it amongst themselves.
Naughty and risky , ye, but why own up to it?

But the midnight curlew was presumably imposed by the other parent?

I think you need to think about what the safest options for her were. It was safer for her to stay out with her friends than return back on her own surely?

Sorry, just realised you track her phone.
Please back off OP, and give her some space to grow and develop and trust her instinct in these situations. She was with a large group so , actually quite safe.
I know she has suffered a trauma and had MH issues as a result.
But you being on top of her constantly will not help her recovery.

Stop tracking her. It’s completely unacceptable

I think the problem is that if she does things without telling you, if she gets into trouble (eg stuck somewhere on her own in the middle of the night) she'll feel she can't call you - that is the dangerous thing. You need to keep her on-side. It's so hard when you're that age and in a group, to say to the group that you need to obey your mum's rules, when your mum isn't even there.

Totally get it BUT if it weren’t for modern technology you’d be none the wiser. What did you do at 14? They weren’t hell raising and I get that she didn’t want to be left out. I think a big chat about what she could do in that situation in future. put on a sudden migraine /tiredness, go to bed? That way she pleases you, keeps safe but doesn’t lose face with the group.