Who else would really appreciate a polite discussion of gender issues and the concerns of women at the jess Philips webchat on Monday?

[StealthPolarBear]

I posted on the webchat thread:
Since the questions have already been asked I am not allowed to repeat similar but I want on record that self ID, its potential abuse, protection of vulnerable young people from those who promote transition which can sometimes include puberty blockers, the protection of natal women's rights and the importance of teaching biological facts in schools are big concerns to me.

MNHQ have said they don't want any more comments or questions about gender issues on the Web chat thread which I can understand. However what I do want to make clear is the number of people who may share some or all of my concerns. Otherwise any questions about gender issues are of an equal weight to all others and in fact others, which can be repeated in a different form, may seem to gain more weight.

That was written just before the election and explains the issues.
This is JP's recent tweet on the subject:

twitter.com/jessphillips/status/1213887262414581761?s=20

Would it be worth someone on twitter (I'm not, sorry) tweeting Jess Phillips a link to this thread? Am sure MNHQ won't be going out of their way to show her, and while we can't make her read it, we can at least say we've brought it to her attention.

Add my name to the list of people who would like this discussed. Not just by Jess Phillips of course but by every politician in the land, whether running for leadership or not.

I was just reading Pencils posts earlier - from the report she quotes, I wonder what exactly is meant by ‘acquired or affirmed gender’? How exactly does one acquire a gender? If you replace gender with sex, the edifice crumbles.

But it also makes no sense, if domestic violence is gender-based, for example, does that mean I am at less risk if I call myself the masculine diminutive of my name and wear boy jeans and trainers, and cut my hair short? No, of course not - so what does ‘gender-based’ even mean?

What do politicians mean when they talk about ‘gender’? Can we not even ask Jess Phillips how she understands gender? Bonkers.

And my name too. Like others, I'm vastly disappointed that JP isn't actually aware of the damage that is being done to women's rights - or if she is aware, doesn't care.

I actually get quite annoyed with the assumption that the tens of thousands of pounds I had to spend in litigation costs in leaving a controlling marriage to have the child arrangements sorted, many months in rape crisis counselling and so on, that this could all have been avoided if I had simply realised wearing boy jeans and trainers, having short hair and calling myself Bob would have stopped it all. Nothing to do with sex-based social power hierarchies and inequalities facing women, just my ‘gender’. Maybe if I had been less feminine, not worn nail varnish and short skirts, not been nicely socialised to be kind, maybe all of those ‘gender-based’ things, none of the last ten years of my life would have happened. Maybe if I had been just a bit more masculine in my clothing, demeanour and name, this ‘gender-based’ situation would not have happened.

Bollocks to that.

Thank you tinsel, I will add it
By my count that's three mners with direct experience on this thread alone
I plan to summarise this thread, count the people who've said yes and also categorise the full list of issue some time on Sunday night.

Have you got me on the list, Stealth?

Tinsel & I have been talking to MN about replacing my question with hers & they're hopefully going to do it.

Maybe the screenshotted deletions should be posted DURING the live web chat?

This thread could be linked to, and she could be @ during the discussion? (Presuming this thread doesn’t disappear)

Empress I will do a count of posts and try to remove from the count duplicates plus the few who have disagreed

I definitely want it discussed. She’s flip flopping all over the place on this issue and voters deserve to know where she stands

Maybe the screenshotted deletions should be posted DURING the live web chat?

I’m just going to say be careful.

HQ scatter suspensions & bans liberally during webchats & often without warning.

Yes I too think that's inflammatory. I'd be keen to send a link and a summary (hoping it will be something like 60 separate posters confirmed they felt strongly about these issues... Also hoping it will be more than is on the Web chat thread :o) to JP on twitter as a pp has suggested

(Copying over what I put on the FWR thread.)

If you think about it, we can't mention...

free speech and Art 10 rights
child safeguarding in schools
police creating criminal records for citizens who haven't committed a crime
safe NHS general wards
safe NHS locked psych wards
whether or not the DV women's sector is fit for purpose
RSE in schools
women's prisons
the integrity of women's sport
the ability of minors to give medical consent
women's rights in cases of spousal abuse
misogyny on social media
why the Labour party is losing women's votes
the damaging nature of sex stereotypes
societal lesbophobia
regulatory capture and policy laundering

... all of these things because genderists have managed to get themselves at least obliquely associated with them (and not in a good way).

And this list is off the top of my head in ten seconds flat. If it doesn't make you shit yourself in shock, I don't know what will.

Yes. I would like a polite discussion of these very important issues.

I agree that this needs discussing.

The need for open discussion is becoming urgent if there is to be any chance of a backlash against lesbian rights, gay rights and women's rights being avoided.

Bintrested put it much better than I can

Also look what happens when you suppress voices. Arguably Brexit was a result of people not being able to express legitimate concerns without being closed down as a bigot (cf Gordon Brown). Look at what happened to those girls in Rochdale and elsewhere - people (especially women) spoke up but were consistently silenced because “racism”. Nothing good comes of suppressing opinions. Nothing.

I’ve added some questions - I expect they’ll be deleted

I would like it discussed
It is the reason I am not a labour voter currently, I’m very concerned about the current situation for rights for women and girls.
I felt that I understood Jeremy corbyn’s stance on this based on his interview with pink news just before the election.
I would like to know Jess Phillips’s views...and if she is even open to hearing women’s views on this.
I’m not hopeful based on her recent tweet.
I hope she will see that a discussion is needed for this topic and people are not necessarily just bigots for putting concerns across about the impact on women and girls with proposed changes to legislation for self id of gender.

Please add my name to your list. How bloody dare MNHQ delete for ever questions women are asking about our rights, safeguarding and protecting children?

I also have a vote in the leadership election. I rejoined the Labour Party for this issue alone so I really care about Jess’ views.

I’m in this as well. I feel like the valid concerns of women are just not being listened to.

When 86,000 women are raped or sexually assaulted every year segregated spaces are absolutely key. I’m also worried about young women dealing with periods in shared bathrooms. If I have a smear I want to be seen by a woman and I feel like my rights are being eroded.

I just discovered I did get an email about my question being deleted I just found it in my spam folder. Same paragraph re. Haranguing. Also threatened to suspend me if I don't follow the webchat rules (which I don't think I've broken).

Tinsel, thanks for the link to JP's tweet. I didn't want to believe it until I read it in her own words.

I'm a bit shaken, to be honest. I'd always thought of JP as tough and honest. But she must know there isn't a spousal "veto".

If a woman refuses to stay married to a man who wishes to change gender, she can't stop him getting a GRA. She is merely delaying the process a bit, giving her time to leave the marriage. Why is his impatience more important?

But my question to JP would be "Do you seriously believe sex predators (transgender or not) would not use self-ID to gain access to vulnerable women and children?"

Screenshot in case the tweet disappears.

With regards to did she know it's not a veto- possibly not at the time of making the tweet as many MP's only hear one side of the story and seem woefully unable to think critically.

She should know now though as umpteen people replied to the tweet telling her.

How are politicians going to know how many of the electorate have concerns if they block people, or tweets, questions and posts are removed.

Exactly. One post per topic means the first person to ask a question has their question heard, which is not necessarily representative of what people want to know and also means each topic is given equal weight. So if I go and ask her if she thinks we'll ever live on pluto, that's something mners want to know about only slightly less (because they will mention 'multiple' poster have asked) than gender issues and the impact on women's rights.