I need to call social services about my friend - now what?

[bumblebrambles]

I have been worried about her for a while, and uneasy about her 5yo dd.

Last night I had a serious chat with a couple other mutual friends, and we are concerned that her dd is being put into very unsafe and inappropriate situations.

• Friend has loud sex with her boyfriend while her DD is awake in the house. Sex happens in random rooms like the kitchen, where anyone can walk in on them.

• Friend leaves her DD with a male friend overnight while she works night shifts. Male friend is older and lives alone, DD has mentioned seeing him naked.

• Friend gets falling-down, vomiting drunk while her DD is awake in the house, drinks during day and evening.

• DD has severe night-time anxiety, scared of sleeping alone, and has recently started wetting the bed after years of being fully dry at night.

• DD has been complaining of feeling sore around her vulva area, Friend claims she's taken her to the GP about it and was told this was due to her touching/scratching herself with dirty hands.

• Friend has become severely depressed after a recent abortion; she didn't have any therapy before or after the procedure.

• DD's life is very chaotic, Friend passes her off to whatever friend will have her, for hours - sometimes days - at a time. Gets other people to pick her up from school, leaves her to her own devices while Friend catches up on sleep due to working nights.

Typing it all out in a list really shows how bad it is. I didn't really understand the full picture until I spoke to our other friends last night - she lies about details and situations so things don't appear as bad as they are. I think she's going through a severe mental health crisis and needs support. I think her daughter may be being abused and needs to be protected. I have tried to give her advice, to help look after her DD, to be an example of stability, etc. But what she really needs is far beyond what I can give.

What details do I need to give SS when I call them?

You could also call her school anonymously and tell them you know she is being abused even if you're not certain. They won't listen otherwise.

That's silly advice.

Do not lie to the school. Just phone them and tell them about your report to SS.

As a previous poster said, it may be that she's already been reported and it'll add extra weight to it.

Just call and tell them what you know, OP. It's their job to worry about whether there is enough information. If they need more, they will ask questions and investigate further.

You are doing the right thing in helping this little girl, no matter how hard it might feel to report your friend. It's the only option. So take a deep breath, pick up the phone and do it.

My point is really that you need to be 100% sure of your facts and not just be relying on gossip and hearsay.
No she doesn't, that is the job of SS to investigate.

I would call the police as well as SS. You don't know how long it will take social services to act but you can call the police and report the suspected sexual abuse. They have trained officers for handling children in those situations and it may get a faster response.

I have called before with far less info than that and the family were already under social services but hadn’t known of the particular issues that I called about. You have an absolute ton of information there. Have you heard it all first hand? If your friends have seen or heard other things themselves then it might be better coming directly from them in their own report as it is second hand from you.

I also tried to phone a child’s school about concerns but was told that they are not allowed to take reports and I needed to report it directly myself. Not sure if that was just their policy or all

Can you really not imagine what sort of information SS will ask? You’ve got a huge amount of detail it must’ve taken longer to type out then the phone call will

I get the impression there is maybe something else you’re worried about?

it isnt suspected sexual abuse, it is emotional abuse/neglect

@OpheIiaBaIIs
If everyone had to be 100% sure then nothing would ever be reported and no child would ever be saved.

It's the job of social services and the police to investigate abuse and potential crimes. It is the job of the public to report strong suspicions of abuse so that they child can be saved if an investigations shows it to be true. The public wouldn't be able to investigate and be sure, but that doesn't mean we just watch silently whilst thinking "I'm 70% sure... But that means I shouldn't report".

OP you might find it quicker to call the NPSCC reporting line and they'll go through it with you and make the report:

www.nspcc.org.uk/what-you-can-do/report-abuse/

This is the best thing you can do for your friend's dd AND for your friend. Your friend's life is careering into the abyss - and she's taking her dd with her.

That little girl is totally helpless and is totally dependent on adults to care for her. You absolutely must report this - go through the school because they have the structure to escalate concerns to maximum effect for the little girl. Bless her.

@EleanorReally

The girl has spoken about seeing an older male naked and has complained about pain around her genitals. And you don't suspect anything nefarious there at all?

How do you know all this?

Unless you’ve seen or heard it first hand I would tread carefully. Yes I would speak to SS but I would also make it clear that you have heard this talk via the local gossip mill if you haven’t seen it first hand, because while of course there is likely no smoke without fire, I find it somewhat distasteful that a group of women are gossiping about another woman’s conduct and spreading the story so to speak, while, if it’s all true, none of them have actually done anything about it.

If the originator of this gossip was any kind of friend they would have reported to SS already and that in turn makes them a pretty unpleasant individual.

So yes, speak to SS and tell them what you’ve heard and let them take it from there. But don’t engage in any more discussion with third parties about this woman. If she’s having problems then she needs help not judgement or to be gossiped about in the local pub while the gossipers sit back and do nothing.

I think it's very dangerous to tell people that they must be 100% sure or not report. That's exactly the attitude that means neglected and abused children don't get the help they need. And neither do their parents.

You could just phone the NSPCC right now OP. They will advise you and make the referral.

SS will need as much information as you can give- full names of all involved (mum, DD, boyfriend, friend she stays overnight with) DOB of DD and mum, address and name of school. Don't worry if you don't have those though, just give them what you do have.

Best would be dates you've seen/ heard this has happened.

If you're 100% sure of your facts, report it.

Even if you're not 100% sure, you should report it. It's far better for an innocent parent to be investigated than for an innocent child to be left in an abusive situation. I appreciate how stressful an investigation would be for the parent, but that's a price worth paying in order to keep our children safe.

As for the suggestion that you should lie to the school and say that the child is definitely being abused, otherwise they'll ignore it...do you have any idea about what safeguarding procedures in a school look like? There is no need to lie. They will take all reports seriously.

no i dont @Lulualla, but it is not place nor yours

If everyone had to be 100% sure then nothing would ever be reported and no child would ever be saved.

Exactly.

The general public are not social workers. We all have a duty to flag any serious concerns we may have about vulnerable children and let the professionals look into it.

I made a social referral about a friend recently. They really needed to intervene for many reasons including domestic abuse in front of children and excessive drug taking in front of children.

They did absolutely nothing. Didn't even go and do a welfare check. No assessment, nothing.

I had very little faith in social services before so that was a last resort for me after several attempts to help and support her myself.

I wouldn't get your hopes up on them actually doing anything.

@AlternativePerspective

It sounds like they are a group of friends who have all seen little parts of this, but that this woman has given them all different excuses and stories. Once the friends talked to each other, the true size of the problem has come to light. They all knew little bits which didn't ring as many alarms, now they know all the other bits too. They all had different excuses from her, and now they know that those excuses are different. Talking helps. It's not gossip down the pub; it's concerned friends finally going "this is a problem. Have you seen it too?". That's exactly what should happen, so everythint comes out.

@EleanorReally

Then let's hope a child never tells you that they saw a man naked and now have genital pain. All they'll get is "no sign of abuse here and it's not my place".

It's everyone's place.

Yes I thought the accusations of 'gossip' and the 'gossip mill' was a bit strange tbh.

The OP has made it clear she had a serious chat with some mutual friends.

Quite how that equates to 'gossip', I don't know.

Mind you, I am genuinely surprised the OP and her friends haven't reported to SS before now, but that may be because until last night, they didn't realise the severity.

OpheIiaBaIIs I totally appreciate that you went through something awful, but in this situation it is vital to consider what would happen if the OP did not report, but simply suggested to her friend that she went to the GP.

Worst case senario - either the friend doesn't go or does go to the GP and reassures that everything is fine. Friend's DD continues to be neglected, palmed off on others, sees her mum drinking and vomiting day and night, be subject to listening to loud sex, and continues to be left alone with this man at night, whom she has already said she has seen naked.

This child has already been extremely traumatised (as the anxiety and bedwetting indicates) and this is likely to escalate.

OP, you do not have to be 100% certain to raise a safeguarding alert, you simply have to have concerns. Your friend is risking losing her DD, and needs support immediately. Please call SS today, you're doing the right thing.

well @Lulualla, they didnt tell me, and I dont work for child protection, show some sense

You're doing the right thing by contacting SS. It will benefit both of them and make sure DD is protected from now on.

I would recommend the NSPCC too.
They will guide you and are very good judge of what is and isn’t an issue (plenty there that is an issue).