Kids bedtimes, no adult down time

[OhDearWhyAmIFatterly]

I'm hoping parents with older kids can help me with this....
We have 3 children 6, 10 and 13. Obviously it's the summer holidays so bedtimes have slid a bit but I'm struggling as we are just not getting any down time with no kids in the evening!!!
I know we have kids and that's part and parcel but I need some time!
I'm dreading back to school and all the battles.
We get up early for the school childcare drop off, and are out of the house bu 7.15. Home by 6.
I just need a period of uninterrupted TV time in the evening after super stressful day at work....
Is it reasonable to say to older kids they have to be in their rooms by a certain time even if not asleep??
Even if we try to send them up to watch TV or read the constantly come back down for drinks or whatever so I can't watch anything!!
Are we destined to only watch family friendly TV and then go to bed for the next 5 years???
I miss 7pm bedtimes!!!!
Please tell me your routines.....

Loving these ideas thank you, especially Coast suggesting the idea of them thinking they have won!

The reading is a permanent problem. They both have to read for 30 mins a night, the STILL fuss EVERY SINGLE. NIGHT

Mine are 6,4 and 1. My 4yo could be dead on her feet and bedtime is always a battle.

She has just done a year of fulltime preschool and if she was in bed by 9pm, it was a miracle (up at 7am!)

I know some kids don't need as much sleep but the 4yo is in and out if bed, interrupting what little adult time we have, and she drives me potty. I often end up going to bed with her just to get her to sleep. And then if course I'm in bed myself so often just nod off.

The holidays have exacerbated the issues as later bedtime hasn't meant later rising time so 4yo is an utter grump.

One shit sleeper negates my other two wonderful sleepers

When I was 13 I loved being in my room of an evening. Had my own TV and video (those days!) and could watch whatever I wanted!

Why don't you just watch tv in your room?

We start bath time for the baby at 6pm then the older ones go in one after the other until they are all done.

I make them a drink and some supper (the only food they are allowed upstairs)

They then stay in their rooms and play/watch tv whatever as long as they are quiet because the baby is asleep.

Tv's odd for 8.30 and they can read until 9pm.

I know tv in the bedroom is frowned upon but it's the only way we get adult time and it hasn't disrupted their sleep at all as it's turned off 30 mins before they are going to sleep l

DS has just finished Year 6 and we are just feeling our way through these issues. We still read with/to DS at the moment (though I suspect this will stop very soon) and then he reads on his own. In term time it's been lights out at about 8.45, and in the holidays that's slipped to about 9.15. Until very recently we've always gone up to turn his light out and 'put him to bed', but just in the last week or two we've left him to do it himself - and actually, he has. Though at the moment he's responding better to 'lights out when you finish that chapter' rather than 'lights out at 9.15', as I think he gets engrossed in his book and genuinely forgets to look at the clock (and I would hate stopping in the middle of a chapter!). Once we've stopped reading with him, I'm envisaging doing the 'bedroom from 8pm' thing and then having a lights out time.

As to how you get there, I hate to say it but I do think you might need to enforce a no screens in bedrooms rule (or at least no screens in bedrooms after eg 8.30). My DS would be far harder to get to comply if he was on a screen up there - and you might find that a screen switch-off time really helps with your kids' reading as well - a book is much more tempting when there's nothing else to do!

I totally sympathise with how important you think this all is. It's not just about you as parents watching inappropriate TV (though I wouldn't want the kids walking in on GoT!) - like you, I don't really relax until the kids are 'down' for the night.

Gosh, I'm amazed the 10 and 13 year old don't need to be in bed by 9 if they are up at 6 every morning. They should be getting 9 hours a night I think?

Regards the reading, presumably if they just go upstairs to bed at e.g 8:30 and don't have anything to do (and you make sure they have a range of books - what do they like on TV, is there anything you can find relating to that? Remembering the local library for trying different stuff) then I would imagine reading will become pretty interesting pretty fast. Do they ever see you guys reading?

14 and 12_here. Devices must be charging downstairs by half eight. Upstairs by 9 for 12 yr old. 14 year old sometimes watched tv with us or will take himself up. We are used to it now and actually enjoy watching with ds, but it is an adjustment from when they were both up by 7 and we had an evening to ourselves.

We do earlier bed routines. They have to be in bedrooms with teeth brushed and water bottles filled for reading time. No screens, no toys, just reading. It gets them settled and sleepy (and made them excellent readers)

Thanks again everyone, your ideas are really helping.
I'm not too worried about the reading, I'm used to battle now. It fascinates me how the oldest DC in particular will make a fuss every night about the reading. They know they have to do it so I just don't get why they think kicking off will work when it never has
I think I need to sit them down and have a good talk about expectations and what they want too. It is hard and I get very anxious about being a "good mum" and doing the right thing!
I'm just glad I'm not a cow for wanting them gone for a bit. Sing explained it well when she said she couldn't fully relax until they were all down. That's exactly it!
And in answer to Nacreos they see us read, well me in particular alot. They know it's good for them they are just a pain in the arse!
Also, in the week we are usually going to bed at 10-11 at the latest as we both have long stressful jobs so need sleep!

Hmmm, I think you’re going to have a battle on your hands if you insist on the 13 year old going to bed the same time as the younger ones! Some of the suggested bedtime routines mentioned here are really only meant for younger kids, not teens!

As a guide, Lights out/quiet time on school trips for that age (13 plus) tends to be 10pm. Seems reasonable to me for the school holidays.

It always amazes me how the British culture seems to want to get shut of kids after a certain time in the evening. It was never like that in my and DH’s respective family homes and we are operating the same way with our teens. Yes, choice of telly viewing is sometimes a bit restricted (we don’t allow any screens in any bedrooms including ours!) but we are having great fun as a family in the evenings rediscovering shows such as Red Dwarf and the IT Crowd as well as stuff like Task Master. We also all like to watch documentaries like all the recent moon landing anniversary stuff.

The teens LIKE spending time with us and the feeling is mutual. DH and I get to be together when we go to bed.

I admit it must be harder when there is a large age gap between the youngest and oldest child. DS2 probably goes to bed slightly later than the oldest woukd have at the same age but there is only 2 years between them so they can now watch similar things and both enjoy them with us.

If DH and I want to watch something like Peaky Blinders we tend to watch when they have gone to bed. Yes I sometimes miss the long evenings together just me and him when they woukd both be fast asleep by 8pm but I think there is a time when you have to accept that your kids are at an age when you can’t banish them to their rooms every evening just because you want them out of the way, you might even find you find it fun to watch stuff with them!!

I agree Curly - we took the decision some tine ago that if they wanted to spend the evening watching telly with us we'd view that as a positive and compromise on what we watch, there is nothing nicer than all piling on the sofa together to watch an old comedy or Bake-off or similar. We also get out the board games sometimes. We'll have enough evenings on our own when they've left home. When I said that it's adult choices after 9 it means we're not watching cartoons or youtube clips, but we will go through the channels and try to find something we'd all like to watch, adults get the final say though.

It's not that I don't enjoy the kids' company, but I think there's a balance. We're a very close knit family so we spend lots and lots of time together as a family during the day - loads of board games, walks, outings, hanging about. We've just been on holiday for a fortnight so we've spent all day every day together. And we always read with the children every night for a good half an hour, so that's really important family time. But we need our own time too. DH is up for work at 6am so he tries to go to sleep by around 10pm in the week, and we're both early risers so we tend to go to bed around 11pm at weekends. We do watch films with the kids, and occasionally something else, but they tend to be more interested in gaming than TV when they're on a screen. We do enjoy the odd nature programme or comedy or something together, and we listen to a few podcasts, but we've never found much in the way of TV to watch together (DH and I don't watch much TV either, we're more into films, and most of the TV I like is definitely not child friendly! Currently watching The Wire, for example. We don't watch things like Strictly or any of the Saturday evening light entertainment type stuff, though DH and the kids were glued to Lego Masters ). Plus I don't really find the timings work - at holidata/weekends we tend to eat around 7pm, then by the time the kids have had a bath and got ready for bed, they tend to have at least half an hour reading time, maybe an hour, and that doesn't leave a lot of time to sit down and watch something together.

I think it's fine that at 9pm, kids go to their bedrooms but they get to do what they want including screens.

My dd is 15, goes upstairs around 9.30/10 ish which I find means we get no down time. I need to go to bed earlier than I currently do. We've already said that from September it will be 9.30 in her room, 10.00 lights off and phone outside the door. Which has been met with much huffing and puffing. Over the summer it's really apparent that she is catching up on her sleep in the mornings, whereas Dh and I are up for work/younger children at 6.30 and I'm exhausted now after weeks of it.

Sometimes we do say she needs to go up earlier to give us some space or sometimes we'll choose to watch something she doesn't like so she goes up earlier of her own accord, but that does feel a bit mean!

He new avenger and wings have it spot on. Its not that I don't want to spend time with them, we do loads of family stuff and watch plenty of films etc. It just needs to be a balance.
I'm going to aim for an adult only downstairs from 9 on weekdays, middle DC up to room at 8.30.
Then screen off for 8.30 and 9.30 then lights off 9 and 10....

Argh! We had this problem, and to be honest we were way too soft for way too long about it. I got so tired. In the end, I set them up with everything they needed: water, snack, book, nightlight etc then said: No it's grown up time. If I don't get grown up time I get very grumpy. You can call me if you feel ill or have a problem, but not for drinks, snacks, chats and questions.

They got better. (A bit.) Bedtimes is as aspect of parenting I just never mastered. But that helped a bit.

My older 2 are 13 and 15, youngest is 7.
I’m at home with all 3 of them this summer and when I need some space I will go to my bedroom.
They don’t really have ‘bedtimes’ in the holidays although youngest is pretty much in bed by 9. Because we’ve got older ones too, everything is done later, particularly eating.
Last night the teens and dp made dinner together which wasn’t ready until 9pm (late even for them, it’s usually 7-7:30).
They like cooking with their dad. We have a kitchen with a sofa/tv etc but we had the music on and it was a sociable evening.
Sometimes they take themselves off to their rooms but dd2 has been suffering with poor mental health at the moment so we are actively encouraging them to want to spend time with us (even when I’d like some time alone after spending all day with the dc).
They do like being with us, I don’t ever send them to bed. For us it’s part and parcel of having them - I’m not saying everyone should feel like this by the way, my mum certainly used to send me out of a room by a particular time and we all understood.
It’s hard not having much downtime but they don’t get up early so I have some quiet time in the morning and I don’t watch telly so don’t need to worry about anything inappropriate being on.
If dp wants to watch something that the dc shouldn’t see he will go up to bed and watch it there.
Works for us but your dc sound more ‘fussy’ for want of a better word, maybe a frank discussion about expectations is in order.
I don’t think you’d be out of order asking them to stay out of your way from 10pm or whatever, they do need their sleep!!

At 13-16 my DD would be in her room by 9 on a school night..
Tv off at 9 increasing to 11 by the time she was 16.
We would often go to bed at the same time but we'd watch TV in bed.

Sometimes we do say she needs to go up earlier to give us some space or sometimes we'll choose to watch something she doesn't like so she goes up earlier of her own accord, but that does feel a bit mean!

Well you’re allowed to watch your choice of programmes, but to tell her to go to her room to give you some space DOES seem a bit mean, yes. it won’t exactly help her to feel like she’s a valued part of the family, will it?!

No it's grown up time. If I don't get grown up time I get very grumpy. You can call me if you feel ill or have a problem, but not for drinks, snacks, chats and questions.

And at what age do you consider them grown up enough to join the adults? “Grown up time” is all very well in the pre-teen stage, but once they are old enough to watch and enjoy 15 films etc or to enjoy things like Have I Got News for You or to watch political affairs programmes WITH YOU, are you really going to tell them to go away and let you be? Surely not......

I think once your kids gets to a certain age, you don't necessarily get much time when you're awake and they're not. It's part of having kids for us. I wouldn't make them stay in their rooms before it was time for bed as it doesn't feel right to me.

Also, Growlingbear, the “chats and questions” that you seem to find so annoying in an evening are often some of the only times that children will volunteer information about things that are playing on their mind. Family life IS busy during the day, sometimes a chat with each child separately when they’re calm and settled in bed is the ONLY chance they have to tell you worries about school or friendships etc. I’ve had my son burst into tears in bed in the evenings because of not settling into secondary. He had kept it all bottled up for a week or two and I guess the “busyness” of life during the daytime had taken his mind off it all once home with everyone around him. I’ve always made it an essential part of their bedtime routine that we will “chat about the day”, even from being young. When they were little it was usually a recap of what lovely things they had done during the day which made them nice and settled for going to sleep. Now they are teens it’s a chance for them to tell me any worries, away from the other one and not while I’m busy making dinner or rushing off to the supermarket etc so can’t give my full attention.

I would hate to think that that avenue of communication is gone, just because I didn’t want them to interrupt my evening viewing.

Parenting teens is very different to parenting pre-teens. Of course it is. You can’t keep them children for ever. At some time you have to adjust your expectations as to how much offspring-free time you should get. Mine at 15 and 13 only seem to need marginally more sleep than I do these days. So they are in bed by 10, and I follow straight after, when I’m at work. This is totally different to what we did 5 years ago.

I wouldn't make them stay in their rooms before it was time for bed as it doesn't feel right to me.

MonChat, i quite agree. That feels like something you’d expect a lodger to do, not a much loved member of the family who wants to spend time with you!

The other thing is, I think it’s valuable learning time for them when you’re around to discuss science and political and social issues with them when you’re watching something together. Even last night, on an episode of the IT crowd, to explain a particular scene to my teen boys, there followed a discussion about PMT! Now, I’m pretty sure this would never have come up in biology at school. They had never really heard of it so it did teach them something.

DH loves explaining to them about political history and the like while all watching certain things. If they don’t understand something they will ask. They can’t do that if they’re shoved into a room on their own