DH and ‘I thought it was obvious’. Is it?

[BiscuitDrama]

DH does this all the time.

Tonight at dinner, eldest DD, 10 says she thinks DH doesn’t like her as much as the other children. (I have told DH recently that she thinks this as I overheard her telling sibling.) DH says in a slightly jokey way ‘that’s true. In fact the only reason I’m taking you to xx tonight is because you’re the only one technically allowed to go’ (this is true). DD puts head on table and hides in her arms.

I say to DH he needs to tell her he does care about her.

He then says he thought it was obvious he doesn’t not like her because he was joking.

So while I can see I shouldn’t undermine him in front of the children, and yes, was then only joking, but with something that’s a really big deal, it’s nice to hear the actual words. I mean it would have been good for him to actually say ‘I love you as much as the others’.

This happens all the time.
I might be massively over sensitive though?

Are we just totally mismatched?

Wow. He needs to face up to the fact that SHE'S TEN and doesn't 'get' the joke. He is damaging not only her self-esteem, but also the relationship between the two of them.

"So while I can see I shouldn’t undermine him in front of the children, and yes, was then only joking, but with something that’s a really big deal, it’s nice to hear the actual words. I mean it would have been good for him to actually say ‘I love you as much as the others’."
I actually think this is one of the very rare occasions where you should undermine the other parent, because what he is saying really really needs to be blown out of the water. I would actually be willing to go for a full-blown 'what the hell, do you actually think this joke of yours is making anyone laugh?' shouty argument in front of the children. They need to know that one parent at least has their back, and they need to know that their dad is WRONG. I'm all for united fronts normally; but this is an abnormal situation calling for an abnormal solution.

I would be so angry with him.

Oh, my stbxh accused me of undermining him all the time. Damn straight I'll undermine his dickheaded behaviour. Gah.

Your daughter needs explicit reassurance and should receive it.

Perhaps make frequent jokes to your DH about his ridiculously tiny appendage, poor sexual technique and body odour. As an adult rather than a child, he should be even better placed than your DD to cope when 'it's obvious you're joking'.

Sorry haven’t read the whole thread but your husband is an arse.

At 10 she doesn’t get that’s he is joking, his dismissal just confirms her suspicions that what she thinks is true.

When I was about this age I told my gran in confidence that I thought my parents preferred my brother. She told them and my mum told me that I was being ridiculous and of course they didn’t.
To me that was confirmation that they did, otherwise I thought they would’ve taken more interest and tried to find out why I felt like that.

He shouldn’t underestimate how I child can feel rejected even if it’s seems unreasonable to him. It’s not about how he feels.

It's so easy to say something nice instead. Why not make that choice?

These are not jokes we make in our family and we have had to stop GPs doing it. If he is going to keep doing it no then he should say at least 10 nice things for every such "joke".

I was seven when my father told me a "joke" which I still remember. He said "close your eyes .... what can you see?" I replied "nothing" and he said "that's what you're worth".

He never held a conversation with any of his children and when he died last year, none of us really grieved for him, because we didn't know him. He wrote his experiences as a POW in a document which my mother delivered to each of us, and that was as personal as it got.

This might be extreme but it was normal. Your DH needs to tread carefully. Children remember words that hurt and it can have a disastrous effect on their own relationships.

I had a jokey dad who would say stuff like that. It damaged our relationship for a really long time.

My experience was this, too, just like Fuckyou's.

It destroyed my confidence and quite frankly I ended up hating my dad - really hating him - because he hurt me so much. To him it was a "joke". To me he chewed my heart up and spat it into the gutter! I turned away from him in self-defence because I couldn't take the "joking".

Years later, he tried to "make it up to me" but I'm afraid it was too late. I could be civil to him but nothing more - the pain was too deep for too long.

Please don't let your DH destroy your DD's confidence, and his relationship with her. It's cruel to her and he will regret it.

RedPandaFluff my dad also told me I was bottom heavy. Agree re the long term consequences.

He also told me my sister was his favourite - only he was not joking.

Oh and my mum said I was a millstone around her neck and she wasn’t joking either.

I have had a difficult relationship with my parents as an adult - although to be fair, they have done many more bonkers and bizarre things than that. But it did lead me to walk into fairly disastrous adult relationships. I am however blessed with two gorgeous DC, who I would not ever put down not let anyone else put down.

I agree with all the other posters that you were not undermining your husband Biscuit - that kind of behaviour really needs pulled up and at the time.

Hope this doesn’t offend anyone, but for a ten year old to feel that way, I don’t think his “joking” or sarcasm is enough for her. She might not like silly comments.
He needs to speak with her 1:1 and tell her meaningfully that he adores her and that he only “jokes” because what she’s thinking is beyond what is true.
He needs to tell her how he feels. No more jokes that she (only 10) might not get.

Having established that he's behaving like a knob, he needs to find out WHY she feels like that. If he just tells her it's not true, all she'll hear is 'I think so little of you that your opinion is dismissed'.

The most charitable interpretation of this is that he's really misread the situation. This man loves his daughter, and he thinks that's completely obvious, so her comments about feeling excluded are either a) part of a jokey banter thing and of course not to be taken seriously, b) a bit attention-seeking or dramatic (so he's going to keep it light and not pander), or c) almost insulting, because OF COURSE he loves her, and she shouldn't be insinuating he's a crap parent or requiring constant outright statements of devotion.

Those really are the charitable interpretations, though, and if he's still not listening after your DD was visibly upset and you've tried to talk to him, then he's being a dick.

Just because you want to be the cool parent who has this edgy, unsentimental dynamic with their kids (no soppiness here!) doesn't mean your kids have to play along. Most children fail to grasp sarcasm, irony or whatever the whole 'nope, can't stand you little rugrats!' hilarity is called. They are unashamedly happy to be told they're loved.

The one positive here is that your DD just went ahead and expressed her honest feelings. I think there are probably lots of kids dutifully laughing to some parental comment that's actually hurtful, because the alternative is being told you can't take a joke, you're being a baby, can't you SEE this is all great FUN?

Good on your daughter for basically saying: no, this is making me unhappy. Sometimes laying your head on the table is more mature than smiling along.

What DNA said

Sums it up perfectly

DNA that's a very good point.

The audience, not the comedian, decides if something is a joke. Him thinking or saying he's joking doesn't make it so.

He's hurting her and unless he deals with it, it will have long-term consequences as previous posters have talked about. I don't think you or your DD are being overly sensitive at all.

Poor child, get him to sort this out.

Thank you so much everyone. I’ll talk to him and I’ll see where I get.

I grew up in a very ‘teasing:sarcastic’ family and I had no issue with it. Probably though because I was very secure in my Dad’s love (and teasing extended family’s) plus everyone was teased not just me!

Your DH teasing your DD about something she’s already insecure about isn’t nice he needs to be made to understand she doesn’t see it as a joke, but as confirmation that she’s right- he doesn’t love her like the others he needs to be doing all he can to make sure she feels as loved as the others!

Yes to an adult or even a secure child it might be ‘obvious’ he was just joking but to HER it’s not and who is important here?! The small 10 yo feeling insecure in her Dad’s love- that’s who (not randoms who might agree with him or his dented ego)

As others have said, point out to the duffus that he doesn’t need to understand why it’s not obvious to her, he just needs to accept she doesn’t feel as loved and doesn’t find the teasing funny and if he does love her he needs to sort his shit out & make her believe he loves her as much as the others

It’s really not rocket science is it.its emotional
Intelligence for dummies.

Apart from this event today, do you know why she doesn’t think he loves her as much as the others?

Oh & you need to stick up for her when he’s riding rough shot over her feelings. It’s not undermining him! Undermining him would be letting her watch TV when he’s said she can’t because she was in trouble Standing up for her when he’s being a twat isn’t undermining him. She needs you to speak up, she needs you to show her that you think it’s unacceptable and she doesn’t need to pretend it’s ok.

Good luck talking to him.

This is the sort of thing people spend a long term working through in therapy.
Your husband needs to get his parenting act together

Bastard.
Poor child. Start her in therapy now - don’t leave her to deal with this alone.

He is destroying your DDs emotional and mental health with his barbaric jokes. What kind of father does this whilst knowing his DD is struggling emotionally. (Answer: an abusive one). And make no mistake this kind of behaviour is abuse and can result in effects deep into adulthood. You need to resolve this now, and your husband needs to work extremely hard to repair his relationship with his daughter, if it's not too late already,

My dad thought it was hilarious to tell everyone he could that me getting married wasn't him gaining a son but offloading a daughter. Hilarious. He made lots of "jokes" like that when I was growing up. If I reacted badly then he'd shout at me & insist I was being too sensitive & it was his job as my parent to toughen me up because if I couldn't take it from him, how would I deal with it when not if the rest of the world did it.

I try to limit interactions with him as much as possible now. I can't quite bring myself to go full NC - it would just be yet more drama & hurt all round. It makes me really sad that this is something that will affect our relationship forever. He's in his early 60s now, no major health concerns, but I often worry about him dying because I'm not going to deal well with everyone expecting me to grieve - I suspect there's a part of me that will feel relieved when he's gone. I worry more about my mother dying & him expecting me to be there for him & not having her as a go-between.

Another lasting effect of his treatment of me is that I expect other people to treat me the same. I don't make friends easily because it takes me years to trust that someone actually wants to be my friend & it's not all some elaborate trick that's going to result in them publicly humiliating me for daring to think they actually liked me.

My mother always kept out of it. Please don't be like her.

My parents are like this and we have a shit relationship now and I dread telling them anything.

I literally cried before telling them I was pregnant and lo and behold the "God don't leave it out a shop" and "You? A mum?" comments flowed.

My PIL on the other hand - so lovely, kind, excited.

It's horrible to hear that stuff as an adult, let alone as a child.

That's nasty. It will stick with her and make her feel very sad.

Your eldest DD is 10, and this man is reaffirming her idea that he doesn't like her? Are your other DC boys, or is it that this prick likes 'children' up until the point where they start being 'people'? Sometimes abusive men can pass for good fathers, because the unquestioning adoration little children mostly have for their parents feeds the abusive man's need to be big and important; when the child gets old enough to expect and want some respect in return - or just to rebel a bit in the way children do - then the abusive man is likely to become more abusive.

I ONCE joked that DD2 was my favourite daughter today when she did something special for me. DD2 burst into tears. I felt horrible and apologized profusely and have kept that in my head ever since. I should have known better as my Dad was "jokey", also calling me 'bottom heavy' as I was in my teens. Who needs anyone commenting negatively on their physical appearance? Can't imagine the response if I'd commented on his large gut. My mom said stuff that I will always remember, but she wasn't joking. I strive to be a better parent than mine.