I think I've just been fired

[CinnamonVanilla]

Boss found out that I applied for a job with our parent company. Supposed to be anonymous; but I'd have said when it was appropriate. Our HR director beat me to it; in front of a lot of people, apparently.

He took me into a room to say that it was humiliating; and means he no longer trusts me, so how do we move forward. He said my work is excellent but this is a big issue.

He's given me some time to think. Presumably he's expecting my notice this evening. I've been here just under two years so there's nothing I can do.

This has made my anxiety rocket and I don't know want to do.

'they won't discuss a settlement until a proper grievance has been raised and we've found a way to work together.'

I don't know about this. Granted, I'm not an expert and I only have my own experience to go by, but what happened with me was that my solicitor and I negotiated and agreed a settlement instead of having to go to a grievance (no one ever said the word 'grievance' out loud but the implication was that that was the alternative).

Maybe talk to ACAS again.

Maybe I'm being a bit thick, but why would HR tell anyone to talk to the person who is targeting them?

The manager is not discrimination against the OP, he is bullying her, clear and simple.

Agree discrimination seems an odd accusation. HR should be managing the meeting and you can have a supporter with you. Can you speak to your manager's manager as they are responsible for implementing any disciplinary process against him.

Agree discrimination seems an odd accusation. HR should be managing the meeting and you can have a supporter with you. Can you speak to your manager's manager as they are responsible for implementing any disciplinary process against him.

It seems my contract is a mess and that's why HR think I should go the grievance route.

HR allege that I started here in October 2017 but my contract didn't shift to them until mid Feb; making me short of two years. ACAS are looking into this. They tried to explain it but my mind is shot.

I am sat at my desk and I keep randomly bursting into tears. I feel numb inside. I can't concentrate; I'm stupidly forgetful. I'm dizzy and nauseous. I still can't sleep.

I just want to go home. I cannot bear the thought of coming back. The grievance process sounds awful; he's never going to admit things, and I've found him so intimidating. I know it should be better with HR there but what about after?

I can't even tell if I feel "okay" anymore; or if this is a spiral and I should see my psychiatrist. I haven't had to go in so long. I'm so disappointed in myself.

Where is your contract supposed to have shifted from, OP?

He does n't have to admit things. Did he not shout at you in front of others? He has frozen you out of team activities. A grievance process really is not as scary as it seems and is pretty detached.

A grievance process won't be your word against his; they will take witness accounts, so that if he has shouted at you, or undermined you in front of others, they will be asked about it. in addition any emails or letters will also be taken into account.

If you need to go off sick because of this, I think you should see your GP to sign you off; you being in this state is all evidence of your bullying manager, even with your preexisting condition you were able to function perfectly well until your manager started bullying you.

I have no practical advice for you, I'm just reading this and thinking "that's me in 2010". I couldn't go down the grievance route as I was mentally pummelled into the ground and scared of my own shadow. My organisation, through the illegal / malicious actions of two individuals, had me off work for 4 years. At the end when I was exonerated I thought I'd go back to work and it would be fine and I had the huge support of my colleagues (huge organisation so think 2,000 colleagues ) and I mean HUGE support, yet because I had embarrassed them publicly my life was a misery and I was just waiting on the next 'tap on the shoulder'.

I couldn't cope and I (retired ill health) left a 22 year career and went into something totally different. I still suffer from PTSD and am on lots of medication to manage it but I know that grievance procedures would have tipped me over the edge, I know exactly how you are feeling and I send my love and positive thoughts.

Oh Cinnamon I feel for you. I would hate for your dick of a boss to be able to bully you out of your job, and woukd normally say sit tight and let him make a mess of it. But I can see you're focused on your health, rightly so.

I hope you have someone in RL supporting you?

I thick it would be appropriate to request reasonable adjustments based on your disability - having a colleague or union rep attend relevant meetings with you, or making adjustments to the arbitration / mediation process to avoid stressful confrontation. I suggest you think about what reasonable adjustments would work and ask your HR in email. Then you have evidence of how they have responded to managing your disability.

Also you don't need 2 years service for a discrimination claim, which this might be given your disability and their lack of active management. You might want to mention to HR that you see our could be considered disability discrimination (again in writing) - then they're more inclined to get more seriously involved.

First I think you have to see your GP/psychiatrist and get signed off long enough to sort your meds out and get back on a stable track. HR have effectively told you to do the same, and since you plainly cannot continue in this vein it is good advice.

Before you go off, make sure you’ve printed all the shit-mails from your manager.

Whilst you are off, and able to distance yourself, you might be able to have clearer conversations with ACAS or your lawyers.

I would want:

Clarity on this contract nonsense. If they started paying you in the October is it just an admin glitch that meant the contract didn’t get transferred?

Understanding of what happens if you go the grievance route vs. Discrimination. What is most appropriate in your circumstances.

If grievance is the correct way, do it. It is just a process. When you are feeling stronger you’ll be more able to see that. HR, cannot simply hand over a cheque because two employees are unable to work together and, in the nicest way, there are two sides to every story.

Of course, it could be the upside of the grievance is your boss is exposed for being a dick; something HR have suspected but been unable to prove before.

It’s easy for us all to give advice from our keyboards. I have been in your shoes and chose to fight, and won, but I don’t have MH issues. You have to address these first or you’ll be flattened by over-thinking every single point when if you were well you’d be better able to see the end game and how the process gets you there.

Great advice from TSS.

Take care OP

Maybe they want you to start the grievance because they want the manager out of the company.

Can you get signed off work from your doctor?

IMHO the lowly employee never gets treated fairly and management always sweep any complaint about someone higher up the foodchain under the carpet, no matter how much evidence they have been given.
Sympathies.
Get out of there as soon as you can.

Are you ok OP?

Keeping my head down and waiting for a psychiatric referral, thanks @rainbowquack.

HR lady is off sick but has emailed asking for me to get recommendations from my psychiatrist. I'd love to, but my urgent referral isn't through yet, so I can't even see her for new meds... otherwise she's adamant that I must raise my grievance with my boss directly.

I've been trying to get my project delivered. It's hard. Manager had a formal meeting with me today which worries me all morning but then avoided all mention of how I was; made a few odd references to friends being paid off or going off sick and then tried to get me to do my 2019 project planning 

I'm suffering migraines all the time now, my anxiety is in full flow and I'm always on edge. I can't even sleep. Hoping I'll get some rest soon, but one day at a time in the meantime.

Oh goodness, that just isn't good. I'm sorry. Talk to your doctor, maybe he can help.

HR lady is off sick Is she the only member of HR staff?

she's adamant that I must raise my grievance with my boss directly.

I just don't know about this. Can you get some impartial advice?

Really feel for you OP, this has escalated beyond reasonableness and has been managed very badly by your Manager and HR. On the service point, if you started work in October 16 (I assume you meant 16 not 17 in your post) and have worked continuously since then, you have over 2 years' service, regardless of how the administration was handled within the company. If you feel unable to continue in the role you have 3 options:

1. Resign and just walk away (please don't do this!)
2. Raise a grievance and then, if the issue cannot be resolved, resign and lodge a claim for constructive dismissal and disability discrimination - you need to raise a grievance first or any award you receive would be reduced because of your failure to try and resolve using company process first.
3. Approach your Manager / HR and let them know of your intention (2 above) but state that in light of the exacerbating affect on your mental health condition, you would like to enter into discussion as to whether they would consider offering you a settlement agreement to walk away.

If you go for option 3, request 3 month's pay plus your bonus, plus PILON. You can then request that you go on garden leave until the matter is agreed, and you can get ACAS to do the negotiation on your behalf. They may not go to 3 months, but at least it's a good starting point and would give you a number of months to find something else (I'm assuming your notice period is 1 month so PILON would be another months' pay on top of the settlement.). Settlement monies are also tax free up to £30k although you'd pay tax on the PILON. Chin up - and don't feel that you HAVE to leave - genuinely, grievances can be an excellent tool to resolve issues and depending on size of your company there may be an option to move to another team or department.

How are you @CinnamonVanilla? I really hope it has improved in some way .

Op, TSS has it right, and also keep talking to ACAS. Don't take any decisions without professional advice. Maybe you should take the advice to get signed off sick...
You're getting a mix of good and bad advice here, so be careful. Good luck!

@CinnamonVanilla, I do hope you took the advice of TSSDNCOP 2/11/2018 @ 16:51. You need to recoup yourself.

Hope things are better today?

Morning all. I had a bit of a breakdown on Thursday night after work - DP was so worried he called the out of hours crisis team. I made it through Friday at work to deliver my part of the project but cried in every meeting and call; and people noticed the cracks, I think.

I've not gone in today. The GP has offered to sign me off for a while and I'm waiting for an urgent referral to a more senior psychiatrist. My boss is being a bit odd - texting me to try and get back ASAP and send some emails this morning - but I'm trying to ignore that for now.

I'll call ACAS soon and talk through. I'm torn between starting a grievance with HR now; whilst I'm off, or trying again to talk to my manager. He's not making life easy.

Thank you for all the advice. I'm going to read through it all again.

@CinnamonVanilla. Suggest you get signed off ASAP. Then log every bit of contact with this 'manager'! He is harrowing you now. Add that to the list.
Thanks for your update.
Been following your progress. God, what a lot of shit managers there are out there!