Wife name forgotten in title

[musicislife]

Does anyone else find it really backward that in the 21st century a married couple should be addressed as ‘Mr and Mrs Frederick John X’, which makes it sound as if the wife is barely an after thought, being blessed as she is with a mere three letters in the whole title?

Well, stop changing your names on marriage then

I did not. I'm still Ms Carrots. I get Mrs Wilfred NotMyName from my husband's family, my weird auntie and on wedding invitations. Wilfred says it's probably their parents, but the (early 30s) couples must have provided the parents with -our- his name

Strike out fail

YearOfYouRemember Yes, counties aren't part of official addresses and haven't been for years. It annoys me when I receive post with Kent included more than it does to have my name written not as I'd like it.

"Not as annoying as having the county included. That's my real bugbear"

Eh? Dare I ask what's wrong with putting a county in someone's address??

I don't like it. Look at these engagement announcements, the mother's names are completely erased. When you look back at newspaper records etc, no trace of them accept as the 'Mrs' and interchangeable with any other woman the man might marry.

flowery X post. It's not of the official address according to Royal Mail and it annoys me when people don't know that.

Almost as annoying as people who wrote London phone numbers as 0208 XXX XXXX instead of 020 8XXX XXXX.

Think I might be getting off the point of this thread though!

Counties are not part of addresses ??

Nope. Check any address on Royal Mail's Find An Address and you'll see they are not included.

I always include my county. Town I live in has a namesake in a completely different county! Yes the postal system knows where my postcode is but ordinary people don’t....

Wow, i didn’t know about counties no longer being official. However, I think it’s still practical to include them when putting your address.

For example, there’s two Rainhams, one in Kent and one in Essex, so not actually that far from each other. You need the county if you are visiting so you know which one you are going to.

I was looking through an anthology of old recipes lately and noticed all the contributors were named as Mrs. Husbandfirstname Husbandsurname.

Have a look at the very top- the woman obviously wrote an eponymous cookery book, but was still given her husband’s name on the excerpt.

You need the county if you are visiting so you know which one you are going to.

The postcode does that! Whether you're using sat nav or looking it up on a map to find your way by public transport surely you enter the postcode and it shows you where you're going?

I still address letters to Mr and Mrs J Jones, where J is the husband’s first name. How else do you address the envelope if you’re sending joint Christmas cards?

The postcode does that! Whether you're using sat nav or looking it up on a map to find your way by public transport surely you enter the postcode and it shows you where you're going?

You don’t give a postcode when buying train tickets to Rainham Station!

Isn’t it easier to say “I live in Rainham, Essex” than “I live in Rainham, RM19....”

RSPB Rainham definitely include the county in their address details....

Ah yes BuggerOff I am talking specifically about postal addresses. As in what you write on an envelope. Just mentioning a town and confirming which town it is is different and county definitely useful/required.

I still address letters to Mr and Mrs J Jones, where J is the husband’s first name. How else do you address the envelope if you’re sending joint Christmas cards?

If the couple share a surname, it’s-
Jane and Tom Smith

If they don’t, it’s-
Jane Smith & Tom Johnson

Simple really.

Debretts has a fabulous list of examples of correct forms of address:

Joint Forms of Address
The following examples of names on envelopes may be useful.

The Duke and Duchess of Somerset
The Marquess and Marchioness of Salisbury
The Earl and Countess of Radnor
The Viscount and Viscountess Slim
The Lord and Lady Maclay
Lord and Lady John Manners
Mr Simon and Lady Victoria Leatham
Lt-Colonel the Hon John and Mrs Smith
Major James and the Hon Mrs Smith
The Reverend John and Mrs May
The Hon Guy and Lady Moira Black
The Hon William and Mrs White
Mr Donald Home and the Countess of Blackadder
The Rt Hon John and Mrs Brown
Mr John and the Hon Mrs Green
Mr and Mrs Thomas Grey
Dr John and Dr Jane Watkins
Mr Mark and the Reverend Hazel Pugh

Basically pretty much anything goes now, including Mr and Mrs John Smith and Mr John and Mrs Jane Smith. So if anyone has been sticking rigidly to Mr and Mrs John Smith then perhaps it’s time for a rethink.

... though there do seem to be a lot more men’s names than women’s in that list. That’s a bit depressing.

Wow, I'm a pretty staunch feminist, and this doesn't bother me in the slightest. It's only letter writing convention, I've never been addressed as Mrs DH and surname in person. I think I address my Xmas cards this way...

I find this attitude really strange... how on earth can you be a 'staunch feminist' and also see nothing wrong in addressing Christmas cards in this way?

I find this attitude really strange... how on earth can you be a 'staunch feminist' and also see nothing wrong in addressing Christmas cards in this way? confused

The way I see it a feminist is about equal RIGHTS for women. I have equal rights, my DH and I are totally equals, I exercised my right to CHOOSE to get married, to CHOOSE to use my DHs name and I CHOOSE to like the traditional form of address. It doesn’t mean I’m not a feminist.

We still use that style of address on formal written materials but never in spoken context (unless being announced - which is rare). It is only used when from both of us.

So, wedding invitations will go out as Mr and Mrs James Pavlova request the pleasure of your company at the marriage of their daughter Freda to Mr Edward Blank.

”I exercised my right to CHOOSE to get married, to CHOOSE to use my DHs name and I CHOOSE to like the traditional form of address. It doesn’t mean I’m not a feminist.”

But just because you CHOOSE to be addressed by DH’s first name as well as surname doesn’t mean all the people you write to also CHOOSE that, and it’s a bit of a weird assumption for a “staunch feminist” to make.

But the thing about Mrs John Smith is that the woman doesn’t choose it, it’s imposed on her by traditionalists who tell her it’s ‘correct’. No one asks, they just assume because of a convention from previous generations. Maybe women did accept it then, but times have moved on.

CherryPavlova I don’t mind if the couple sending out the invite uses Mr and Mrs James Pavlova (great names!) but I would grit my teeth if they assumed I was happy to be addressed the same way on the invitation.

Not really sure why this is an issue or a chat thread!