Renee Zellweger. Is this really her?

[BatsCantTwerk]

Here

How different does she look!

She could walk past me in the street and I wouldn't bat an eye

Yes, I don't doubt she's had loads of work done as well. I don't thnk there is anyone at all in Hollywood who hasn't.

It's as common as having a haircut, in that culture.

River-you're right, and very common among non celebs too.

I think she had the same surgery that other Hollywood actresses have, but because of her heavily lidded eyes it has drastically changed her appearance. She doesn't look bad, just very different to the way she looked before.

Also, if you look at the number of parts there are for women in their late 40's compared to men (and the fact that there are few good parts for any women at all), it's not surprising that, sadly, having surgery is seen as part of the job.

My mum might have to have eye lid surgery, hers over hang badly and when she's tired or cries or they're swollen they actually force her lashes into her eyes. Do not a vanity thing but could be necessary if it gets worse.

Courteney Cox is a good example of someone who has totally ruined her looks with bad surgery

www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2805367/Courteney-Cox-shows-beehive-hairdo-la-Audrey-Hepburn-cycling-break-Cougar-Town.html

Oh yes, I can hardly look at Courtney Cox anymore and I loved her in Friends. It's really sad to think she must like looking this way. I cannot fathom what is attractive about it. Do you think they look in the mirror and just see individual features rather than how they look as a whole? So she sees a smooth forehead and plump lips and is happy with that whereas we look at the complete image and think "Oh pour Courtney, what have you done?"

Yet despite having a ton of surgery, Courtney Cox still looks like her (in a weird way, but she's recognisable). I think that's why the Renee pics are shocking - she doesn't actually have a weird puffy pillow face, but just such totally different eyes that it could be someone else.

It is weird how Cox prefers to look that way - in the before / after pics you see, she just looks real and healthy before in a way that means a few wrinkles really don't matter. But I reckon the slebs see signs of ageing and think "Heeeeeellpp! ANYTHING to make me not look wrinkly/saggy!" Maybe it doesn't matter to them that they look kind of alien, as long as they don't look OLD. Also maybe they get pressure put on them to do it.

I think they have a little bit of Botox and see a lovely smooth patch of skin so they have another area done until they end up having a very unnaturally smooth, waxy face.

I think the same happens with the fillers. A little in the laughter lines works wonders but then they have it injected under the eyes to smooth out eye bags and then a bit in their cheeks to replace volume lost by ageing and/or dieting and before you know it... Pillow face! Look at LuLu, Sharon Osbourne and Courtney Cox. For a while they all seemed to be defying the ageing process now they all have that big cheeks, small eyes look.

Courtney cox is 50 and has her own tv series. I suppose she would argue that you need to have the work to get the work.

Its a bit like dying your hair black forever though - at a certain point it makes you look worse.

Doesn't Courtney have her own production company though? Lisa Kudrow's new series is due out...she's not botoxed.

I think people need to leave Renee alone. Women can't win.

Woman does not get plastic surgery "SHE'S OLD!!!"

Woman gets plastic surgery "SHE'S A WAXWORK!!!"

It's like school...kiss and fool about with boys and you're a slag...don't and you're frigid.

I think people in a certain section of society have a distorted idea of appearance. Taut forehead, mini-lift, trout pout is definitely a look amongst women in the 50+ multi-millionaire WAG bracket. I see it all the time in places where newly rich middle aged people gather. Peer pressure. Once your friends are all doing a particular look, you think it's normal. It's just the facial equivalent of boyfriend jeans.

My guess is that they all see Jean Sebagh. His partner Amanda Eliasch has that look and he has a formidable PR company who claim he's the best injectibles man in the world. No matter that he makes everyone look like a Riddler.

I think people need to leave Renee alone. Women can't win.

Woman does not get plastic surgery "SHE'S OLD!!!"

Woman gets plastic surgery "SHE'S A WAXWORK!!!"

The problem here is not that she looks weird. She simply doesn't look like the same person, at least to many.

Lweki so what? Her looking weird is only a result of the massive pressure on women to look a certain way. She's famous and that pressure is worse...if people stopped commenting, bitching and writing shit articles about actors' lines and wrinkles and if the media in general stopped flogging perpetual youth as the be all and end all then it wouldn't MATTER how she looked.

But this thread is largely about why women feel the need to look a certain way and the often unsettling or alarming results of that. I don't think there's a lot of Renee-bashing, there's a lot of wondering how it is that she looks so different, discussion of what might have made her do it, and discussion of cosmetic surgery in general and why people (not just women) do it. Are you saying we're not allowed to discuss that?

*Woman does not get plastic surgery "SHE'S OLD!!!"

Woman gets plastic surgery "SHE'S A WAXWORK!!!"*

In some DM sectors, yes, but I think this is also a massive oversimplification that underestimates people's intelligence. There are actually plenty of older female public figures who do not look obviously or unnaturally injected/botoxed, who also do not get slagged off for looking old. Charlotte Rampling is one, Helen Mirren, the Queen, Mia Farrow, etc etc. (I'm not saying they've had nothing done as you can't tell, but they don't have that weird non-human look) Lauren Bacall went on into old age looking good in a clearly older, wrinkled way. All of these women are lauded for their achievements and their looks. I think that happens when someone knows they have talent and doesn't succumb to fears of ageing.

It's like saying young female pop stars have to look a certain way, be skinny and strip off. In general, there are many who fall into that samey category, but actually, no, you can be massively successful looking like Adele (for example) and not stripping off at all, if you have the talent and the guts to be who you are.

I think it's an impossible situation. Ageing ruins your looks, cosmetic surgery can ruin your looks. Some women have amazing bone structure so can waft into old age with cheekbones in place looking elegant abd graceful. Mere mortals however, once the collagen leaves our faces, are left with jowls and deep lines where fat once resided.

RZ has rosacea so I am not sure if that has impacted on her face. She definitely looks different but I don't think she deserves quite the criticism she has received in the media. Courtney Cox is an example of horrible work but her face was very 'pretty' and I think once her youth had gone she was probably in a position of having to do something or else her career might have ended. Jennifer Aniston has had some nice work done, she looks lovely in most things.

People that really piss me off are the likes of Katie Price. I think she looks in the mirror of a morn with a static face and thinks she looks amaze balls. Little does she know or seem to care that directly she tries to talk on camera she looks like a stroke victim. It's very disturbing abd also totally unnecessary given her age.

There must be a cosmetic surgery tipping point after a few years. Madonna looked great in her 40's (despite obviously having something) done. But she hit her 50's and it's all gone Wildenstein .

Jennifer Aniston and Kate Moss both look great, for now, but I bet they've had some tweaks done already. Might not look as natural in 10yrs time though. can you tell I bought grazia last week.

I think people like Helen Mirren were lucky enough to be 30/40 when botox and fillers and collagen weren't really a thing. However, it is just fact that women tend to disappear from view when they reach menopause. (see also TV presenters). It's hardly surprising that they try to remove the signs of ageing.

Ageing does not ruin people's looks. It just stops them from looking young. Once people accept that it is OK to be a 50 year old woman, it will be OK to look like a 50 year old woman.

Oh please, Helen Mirren - who i do love by the way - has had her share of surgery and fillers too.

Ageing just isn't isn't seen as being compatible in any way with still being seen as 'desirable'. So people like Maggie Smith, and poss Judy Dench can age as they were never considered the ingenues or the sex symbols. Obvs their rare, immense talent also comes play here too. But come to think of it, they didn't really have a Hollywood career when they were middle aged nor ageing, just when they had aged, IYSWIM.

Sorry merry that sounds like I am arguing with you, when I'm not. I'm agreeing with you!

I don't think ageing ruins your looks but you just change and a lot of it is genetic. I had a big pumpkin RZ face in my 20s and now I don't looking at pictures its like I have had surgery but I haven't

This is seleb twaddle, what are we meant to talk about if not who's had surgery?

Helen Mirren has had at least 2 face lifts.

Jennifer Anniston has had lots of procedures if not full blown surgery yet.

Both of those look good if they have.

Oh please, Helen Mirren - who i do love by the way - has had her share of surgery and fillers too.

As I said, I'm not saying she hasn't. I haven't a clue if there's any sleb who has actually had no work at all.

I'm talking about that weird line-free, immobile, pumped-up pillow look that so many slebs seem to have, and why that is seen as preferable to a few wrinkles. I don't know what work Mirren has had done, but my point is she's 70ish and she looks 70ish. A very glamorous, good-looking 70ish blessed with lovely bone structure, but not devoid of lines, facial movement or features that look like they could have occurred naturally.

And generally she doesn't get slagged off for looking old - she's widely admired for her beauty, style and career. It's not true that you have to have loads of surgery to be a sleb/actor. So I'm interested as to why so many slebs seem to think it is.