Should I tell DB that he shouldn't marry his girlfriend?

[whatwereyouthinkinof]

My very lovely 'knight in shining armour' type brother has just announced today that he and hisbitchofa girlfriend are going to get married.

This girlfriend is selfish, self aggrandising, appallingly (aggressively) rude, profligate, demanding, manipulative, and loudmouthed opinionated ... I will not bore you by going into detail, (unless you want me to) but I am not using any of those words lightly.

My brother may not be a young lad but is quite naive where relationships are concerned and it breaks my heart to see him being used as he is by her...he has aged 10 years in the last 24 months...I dont believe he has actually 'asked' her, but as she has been telling him for months that he needs to set a date and I think he has finally caved because they have a baby together.

Our poor Mum is in despair...she cannot abide the woman...and is already in a state about how to tell her son that she cannot in all concience attend his wedding.

I love my DB and DN and don't want to lose them...Should I tell him to throw off his rose coloured spectacles and see her for what she is?.... or keep biting my tongue and dreading family gatherings (and taking to cope) for the rest of my life?

ooops that last line should read "taking Rescue Remedy or Vallium to cope"

hmmm there could be two sides to this, if he's such a "knight in shining armour" type he might actually like having someone a bit selfish around to say no on his behalf if he can't if that makes sense

I think there's a reason why people who are "too nice" pick stroppy partners.. the partners sometimes do their dirty work for them IYKWIM

Absolutely not.

You might not like her but he does.

All you will achieve is pushing your brother away and making your relationship really awkward with him. Its not like you telling him to see her for what she is will make him say 'Oh yes you are so right I won't marry her now'.

Why do you hate her so much?

Why is she so bad?
Can he not decide for himself who he marries?

I think you need to be the adult and keep your nose out of his business.

I think if they have a child together, the jig is up anyway. She is always going to be a part of your family whether they marry or not.

I'm afraid your mum needs to suck it up and attend the wedding. I very much doubt that telling him to choose between her and you will result in him calling the wedding off, it will probably just cause them to feel more united against the world.

I would take a look at the ONS' latest figures on divorce rates for some comfort :)

I think you have to let him get on with it, unless she's cheated on him/murdered someone.

They have a child - she will always be in his life and yours too to a certain degree.

I think you keep out of it. I am sure she knows you cannot stand her.

Blimey, she sounds identical to my brothers ex gf.

Unfortunatly though, it is not your desicion to make, and so you cannot tell him not to marry her.

You just need to be there for him.

Unless you have proof positive of a specific 'crime' - like video of her shagging his best friend or hitting their child or something - then all you can do is buy yourself a nice outfit for the day and sit at the back with a big fake smile on your face. If she's that bad and he's still with her, well, what light are you going to shed on this??

No, too risky. You will very likely lose him if you do. Keep quiet so that you can be there for him if it goes pear shaped.

I hear you.

Not a lot you can do. He loves her, has a child with her and sounds like he plans to spend a long time with her.

More useful would be to be a good sis, and keep friendly with him /them.

My family rarely see my DB as his wife is in charge.

What's she done?

Unless she's torturing puppies or something awful then you need to slap on a smile and be happy for them.

SIL used to hate me, possibly still does, but tbh she had issues about her brother and wasn't always very nice or reasonable. Dh was hurt but objective and we're still together.

He loves her. he has a child with her. He chose to be with her. Unless she held a gun to his head, he willingly had sex with her, and unless he is extremely naive he must know how babies are made.
You want to destroy his happiness because you don't like her? Leave well alone. He will resent you.

Agree that it's too late. They already have a baby, that's for life and I can't see why the wedding is relevant. She is the mother of his child and if you or your dm say anything you will compromise your relationship with db and dn. There isn't anything to be done - go to the wedding and say nothing. Be there if/when it goes bad.

You need to keep schtum.

Actually Pancakeflipper...I'm not sure she does know I cannot stand her, she thinks that telling me that I'm a much better cook than my mother..in my mothers presence after my mother has provided a weekly Sunday dinner for her and her brood for 18 months...puts me on 'her' side.

Whistlestop-I have spent the last 18 holding my tongue and nodding...giving her plenty of rope to hang herself over and over again but he just smiles wearily.

MissMoo - We know that saying something outright will force him to choose and we know we cant 'win' but keeping quiet when all you can see is disaster ahead is very very difficult.

Aiming- He has a track record of 'bunny boilers' and this one takes the biscuit. Our first introduction was at the Comedy store, she was draped round his neck, I went up to greet my brother, she didnt move, so I couldnt give my usual peck on the cheek, so I just grinned and said Hi, I was introduced, she looked over her shoulder, looked me up and down, ignored my proffered hand and said 'hmmm, hello" and turned her back on me...Not a great introduction. I hasnt improved and believe me I tried to find things to like about her.
Why dont I like her. She is downright rude and disrespectful to our mother and actually encourages her older children to be rude to her and defy the rules of her house too. She walks into our home without greeting, talks incessantly, with a loud and overbearing manner, wont listen to anyone elses point of view (it is like white noise after a while)..she cant bear it when we talk about anything that happened before she came on the scene (like mentioning my late father) or about anything she doesnt have any knowledge about and changes the subject rudely and abruptly..She eats our food and then tells that she hates cooking but comments on how well or not you did it (she never invites us to my brothers house, in fact makes us feel most unwelcome when we go) She tells me how to lose weight, how to dress and how badly my dog smells. She never says thank you for any meal, or for any birthday or christmas gifts for her or her children.
She has just got out of one 'violent' marriage, telling us how she had to sleep downstairs with her children when babies to stop their crying from rousing her exs temper...yet she still went ahead and married him when they were 6 and 4 .... and recently told me that my brother has a 'dreadful temper' when he certainly didnt have in all the years before her, and when I said so she told me I didnt "know" him !!!!
She spent her 18k divorce settlement in 3 months on Botox and shoes, and then told my brother he had to buy a bigger house because his is too small now 'they' have 3 kids!
She thinks it ok for her children to swear and physically fight in my home in front of my 4yr old and their baby and not ok for me to stop them and send them to different rooms!
She thinks it is the schools job to make her children behave, not hers!
She thought it great when my brother got made redundant because they could claim x,yand z on the 'social' if they hid the money (he didnt)!
She insisted my brother did half the night shift with the non sleeping baby, napping downstairs on the sofa so they didnt disturb the older children, when she was on maternity leave and he had a 20 mile rush hour drive and an 8 hour work shift to do...only to come home to find the house in chaos. the older kids fighting while the baby lay on the play mat under their feet and she was chatting on facebook!...
Oh and one classic was when the baby was discovered to have a cleft palate and severely impaired hearing we were discussing babysign classes, she said "Oh I dont have time for that rubbish! Besides you should see the size of his willy, he wont have anything to worry about when he grows up!"

The list could go on and on

Ilovesalad - sadly I think you may have hit the nail on the head but equally I feel I cant stand by and watch my poor mother being so insulted by the bitch and heartbroken seeing her precious son being so used...only today as the little one was fighting being put in his car seat and Db was struggling a little..the GF said "oh poor baby!! Is nasty daddy fastening you down? What a horrible Daddy doing that to you!" She may have though it amusing but she is undermining him all the time!

The though of having to socialise with her for the rest of my life fills me with dread.

Eeek she sounds like Americans would call trailer trash.

You'll have to let him get on with it sadly. He won't listen. He may even like being the martyr? some do.

I think you and your DMum need to establish some boundaries about acceptable behaviour in your homes, rather than trying to get your DB to end the relationship.

And if she is undermining your DB and his parenting, then try to find ways to support him in his choices. Don't leave him even more isolated and dependant on her than he is.

Look...there is nothing you can say that win your brother over. He will choose her, so don't isolate him by letting rip about his harridan of a gf.

Somehow I don't think this will last. She will chew him up and spit him out in bubbles.

You just have to be there to pick up the pieces sadly.

I do sympathise with you though.

I feel for you :(

Not sure what you can do though :( Except maybe say to your brother that it would be wise to wait a while and see how things go because once they are married she'd be entitled to half his house if they divorce.

That, and as someone else suggested, look at divorce rates and pray!

Shit isn't it. My SIL is a twat too - but they have 4 kids now, so I grin & try to bear it for their sake.

sorry but your brother has a baby with her and has been seeing her 2 years. he knows what she's like. you keep your beak out. if he's making a mistake (and tbh he's already made a far bigger commitment to her than marriage by having a child with her) then it's his mistake and he has to make the decision. do you honestly think if you tell him not to marry her he will say "oh wow, i never thought of that option, thanks sis"?

if you dont like her, dont have her in your home.

Thank you to all you sympathetic ladies for your understanding responses... and sympathies in return for those of you in similar situations.

I knew the answer before I wrote the question last night, after all I have been 'sucking it up' "being an adult"and tolerating her to the best of my ability for over 2 years now... but when that "we are going to get married" blow finally fell last night and I was laying in bed unable to get it out of my head...well, you start looking anywhere and everywhere for straws to grasp to try to stop the impending disaster.

To those who say 'they already have the biggest commitment'...yes...four months of 'dating' and saying how glad she was that her childbearing duties were over and how stupid women who have a baby later in life are (I had my son a lot later than average) and the second my brother mentions that he would like a child of his own one day, she 'forgets' her pill! moves her family from her (social security) rented house into my brothers home ...to which she has contributed not a penny (so atm she has no claim on anything at the moment)... and now she wants a new house (with her name on the mortgage) and a marriage certificate...It is just so obvious that she wants to bleed my dh of everything she can when things go wrong...she freely admits that she stayed in her former marriage far too long (apparently she and the children were in serious danger from her drug taking ex) because she was "holding out for the house"

Booyhoo- I dont like her in my house but I DO want to see my brother and nephew and it is almost impossible to manage to see them for our usual Sunday family dinners without her ...though her children have recently chosen to stay with a neighbour rather than join us because of our ridiculous rules about not swearing and fighting and the effrontery of expecting them to sit at the table to eat...[thanking heavens for small mercies]

As to attending the wedding ...well that is a moral dilemma I will face when and if I get invited...In faith will not be able to promise 'to support them in their marriage' when asked to in church.

And yes, to those lovely ladies who suggested I look at the divorce statistics and take hope ...thanks, I will.

Oh, and as to being there for him when the pieces need picking up...I have had the spare room prepared for him (and the baby) since the day DN was born.

Erm ... you do know that you brother is a grown up?

Do sisters actually get to give their approval in the marriage ceremony by the way? Or are you thinking of the speak now or forever hold your piece bit ? Because objecting there is just going to mark you down as a spiteful attention seeker - if you don't approve, don't go.

Given that they have a child together, wouldn't it be kinder to hope that your brother helps his wife-to-be and stepchildren to learn appropriate social behaviour, rather than hoping a family goes through another divorce?

I agree that her behaviour sounds rude , thoughtless, and often down right irresponsible. I don't think it's fair for you to minimise the effects of DV when you don't know the full story - wanting to avoid making her children homeless is understandable. The behaviour of the children sounds appalling and you are right to insist on no swearing or fighting in your home.

Your brother made a permanent link with this woman when he had a child with her. Any man having sex has to face up to the reality that a child may result from that. He was equally responsible for contraception, and for understanding that no contraception is 100% effective. His girlfriend left secure social housing to be with him, and she has his baby to care for - it's understandable that she needs security.

You clearly don't like this woman. But these are choices your brother has made.