Ex-Mormon /Latter-day saint (LDS) AMA

[Someonesayroadtrip]

I was born into the pretty much Mormon faith (parents converted when I was tiny) and I was fully converted and fully believed. Myself and family had "leadership" positions etc. Feel free to ask me anything.

This is really interesting, thank you for this thread.

I read a book called The 19th Wife en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_19th_Wife. It's two parallel stories - one about Ann Eliza Young and one about a modern Fundamental sect. Very dramatised of course but very interesting. I'd recommend it to anyone with an interest - it's historical fiction of course but the history of the founding of the church is interesting, although I don't know the truth of it.

What was your highest calling? Do you feel that influenced your bishop/branch president's behaviour towards you in any way?

I follow a Utah morman as she is a successful business woman. Her son went on a mission to Japan and her daughter has just gone on hers to ..... Houston. I feel really indignant on her behalf that she didn’t get an overseas experience like her brother. I suppose that like most religions if not all, men take first place and women are subservient.

I also did realise these were self funded! I thought at least expenses would be paid by the church. So does that mean families need to be well off for their children to do a mission or can the missionaries work a job as well? (Which May be difficult depending where they are sent with visa’s and language barriers)

did not realise

@WouldBeGood

Do Mormons drink tea, coffee or alcohol?

Is divorce permitted?

No, they abstain from tea, coffee and alcohol.

They can get divorced, they would very much encourage them to try and work it out. They also have civil marriage and temple marriage and whole civil marriages are permitted you have to gate permission from the prophet (or first presidency) to get your sealing (Temple marriage) dissolved which is much harder and they actively try and encourage people to keep that.

Divorce used to be mean you couldn't do certain things, like being a bishop or serve in certain positions within the temple.

@TheFormerPorpentinaScamander

Thank you for answering. I have faith, although just common or garden Christian . I've always bought my dc up with options too. So they know that I believe xyz, but they don't have to. Regarding everything else, I've always answered when they asked in an age appropriate way. So when ds1 asked, age 4 "where do babies come from? I know its got something to do with my willy and balls" I answered in a basic way. As they've got older I went into more detail. There's no right or wrong as to what and when you tell them. My teens have seen me drunk and hungover. Some people think thats wrong, but it works for us. They know that some people think homosexuality is wrong, but we don't etc etc. Parenting is a minefield!

Thanks, I actually feel like one of mine may be gay, it's difficult because we sometimes talk about if they crushes on certain people and I always say boy or girl but my husband says we shouldn't. But we have no issues either way if he is or isn't. Of course that would be very different if we were still in the church.

I'm pretty factual with mine, two of mine have autism and my eldest likes things as they are. So I just say things as they are. It seems to work being really blunt with mine and just answering questions etc.

But I don't know when to allow alcohol and when to discuss safe sex, still really young yet though.

@HoneysuckIejasmine

This is really interesting, thank you for this thread.

I read a book called The 19th Wife en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_19th_Wife. It's two parallel stories - one about Ann Eliza Young and one about a modern Fundamental sect. Very dramatised of course but very interesting. I'd recommend it to anyone with an interest - it's historical fiction of course but the history of the founding of the church is interesting, although I don't know the truth of it.

Thanks, I'll have a look. I would always have argued that it's the breakaway sects that practiced and still practice polygamy. The truth is it was a major part of their history, they stayed practicing it long after they said they did, and only stopped when government threatened to seize buildings.

They didn't just marry single women, they married wives and children of 14.

Even today, In the temple men are permitted to be married to more than one woman (through divorce or death) and they believe that in the next life that they will live has polygamists.

I knew some things but I had been told a very different story to what the reality was. I knew Brigham Young had many wives but was told it was to support them and especially those widowed. I didn't know about Jospeh Smith and many others though.

Thank you, @Someonesayroadtrip

@AnnieOH1

What was your highest calling? Do you feel that influenced your bishop/branch president's behaviour towards you in any way?

My husband served several times as counsel to the bishop, elders quorum (men's leader) and on the high council as a high council man (assisting the stake president which is above a bishop), both is us taught seminary which in the US is a paid teaching calling and the young people who take it, it is part of their curriculum and is accredited.

I serviced as primary president a lot, like a lot, 😂 who is in charge of the children's organisation, I have served as councillor and president of the young women and I taught Sunday school (to the adults). I have service lots of other little callings but those are my main leadership callings.

I think we were friendly, we were actually neighbours and I think he expected me to just do what he said because he has recently been called as a bishop. It was a tiny thing, I didn't think anything of it. I just said, "no that's not what happen, I asked x and they agree you said ..." I hadn't expected his reaction.

He didn't like being undermined. His actions I sort of understood I guess, but the further up leadership it went it was harder to understand . My husband was serving on the high council go advisor to the stake president so naturally raised it and his reaction was what shocked us.

One of the requirements of worthiness is "sustaining" your leaders, which means agreeing without question. I had learnt to be assertive because two of my children have some additional needs, if that hadn't been the case I would have kept quiet.

@HerRoyalNotness

I follow a Utah morman as she is a successful business woman. Her son went on a mission to Japan and her daughter has just gone on hers to ..... Houston. I feel really indignant on her behalf that she didn’t get an overseas experience like her brother. I suppose that like most religions if not all, men take first place and women are subservient.

I also did realise these were self funded! I thought at least expenses would be paid by the church. So does that mean families need to be well off for their children to do a mission or can the missionaries work a job as well? (Which May be difficult depending where they are sent with visa’s and language barriers)

The church will pay for their actual accommodation, car (if they are lucky enough to get one) etc, but they pay around $12,000 to go on their mission which they get some back monthly to live off of. Of course they tend to need more than that and clothes etc, so they are fairly expensive.

Children are encouraged to save from a young age and ward members are often asked to donate via the missionary fund to help other families out.

As for where people can go, most do end up serving in their own counties, in the UK lots of women end up serving on temple square (salt lake temple) as glorified tour guides. I think women tend to be less likely to serve exotic missions though. So yes, on the whole men are more likely go serve somewhere exotic but it's random.

I'm really conflicted on the LDS stuff. On one hand, I think they are cult-ish and quite alarming as a whole. On the other hand, I'm a genealogist and their website is a massive bonus to anyone researching their history. I quality control some of the transcription and the Mormon project managers I have spoken to in the US have been unfailingly polite, charming and super-friendly.

So what do you think of the belief that everyone in the LDS has the duty to research their history, and retrospectively "save" all their long-dead ancestors?

@museumum

I live near a church (not sure if that’s the right word?) and find the young American students charming but so naive. Do they all survive the mission thing? I can imagine it’s very tough and they must get abuse at times.

Realise I missed answering what they are called. Yes church is fine, Mormons use church, in fact they proclaim to be they only true church.

The buildings I guess are called chapels or maybe that's just my area, we would say "it's my turn to clean the chapel" (because even with £150 billion dollars in the bank they decided the members donating significant portions of their time and money wasn't enough and they took away paid cleaners and told the members to do it).

Each congregation is called a ward or branch (wards are usually bigger) and for every 6-10 wards it's makes up a stake. Typically one of the ward buildings/chapels will be bigger and be the stake centre where members gather for conferences twice a year.

My question is about garments. I appreciate that is is a personal question, so please feel free to answer as much or as little as you feel comfortable to.

I have fallen down the Mormon Blogger black hole a number of times and find them utterly fascinating. So, my understanding is that Mormons should wear their garments all the time. But, when I read these blogs, these women are often in bikinis and work out gear etc, so can't be wearing them. Do Mormons generally wear garments all the time?

Other quick question. Do Mormons really wear this in the Church?

@purpledagger

My question is about garments. I appreciate that is is a personal question, so please feel free to answer as much or as little as you feel comfortable to.

I have fallen down the Mormon Blogger black hole a number of times and find them utterly fascinating. So, my understanding is that Mormons should wear their garments all the time. But, when I read these blogs, these women are often in bikinis and work out gear etc, so can't be wearing them. Do Mormons generally wear garments all the time?

Yes, so there are temples and in the temple they practice sacred (secret) things. Two of those are the initiatory and endowment, although the go together. During initiatory you get endowed with the garments.

Not all members go that far, but it's kind of a big part of it. You rewound go "through" the temple before a mission, or before you get a temple marriage. So my husband got his when he went on his mission and I got mine when I was going to marry him in the temple.

Garments are while long Johns, usually cut off at the knee, but some people wear longer one and a top, for men it's looks like a t shirt and when it's a smaller top with cap sleeves. Try have markings on them that Mormons believe are scared.

Mormons are instructed to wear the garment night and day and to not remove it, obviously you change it daily or more like usual underwear. There is an unwritten rule that they come from for sex, swimming and sports 😂 "the three S's". The garments must be covered and not adjusted.

However within the culture there is vast differences between how people interpret that. Some never take them off, some take them off on holiday. Some will wear bikinis or crop tops for sports and others will keep their clothing in reflection of the garment. Some don't take them off for the 3 s's 🙈

Not all Mormons are endowed either, so if you didn't marry a member or get married at all you might might not get endowed or at least not until you are much older.

Definitely a lot of contention and gossiping within the religion about it. For example people will point out to others if a women is wearing a skirt and they don't see the garment or men in white shirts, people will talk.

Pretty pricy too, think between £6-8 for a top and bottom. Which is paid to the church.

@purpledagger

Other quick question. Do Mormons really wear this in the Church?

Oops sent a reply and lost it.

This is the endowment part of the Temple. You wouldn't wear this in church and it's highly scared to their faith and not talked about.

During the endowment you watch a video and put on these items of clothing (over white clothing) at various times during the session. They are supposed to represent the priesthood.

This so what you would wear when you get married in the temple too. It's very off and yet I thought it was normal and did I regularly (for the dead).

You also get a name, it's the name at which god knows you by , except everyone at that temple that day gets the same name. You must never reveal you name to anyone (other than your husband when you marry him in the temple), you don't know your husbands name.

You also learn signs and symbols, which were taken form the masons.

The temple changes a lot over the years though. The signs they are using I don't recognise but think represent being disembowelled if they reveal the secrets of the temple. They took all the threats away, so it's not part of the Endowment I have experienced.

Were your parents born into the sector and if not how did it come about that they converted?

Also, has your leaving affected yours and your DH’s relationships with your parents?

@AlternativePerspective

Were your parents born into the sector and if not how did it come about that they converted?

Also, has your leaving affected yours and your DH’s relationships with your parents?

No, my parents were converts. I think I was around 3, so no recollection outside the Church. My parents neighbours were Mormon, and I guess they stuck up a friendship and the it developed from there.

It amazes me why they and other converted, my dad was an atheist so it's a big jump. I guess the community is the biggest factor, but it has some interesting perspectives too and it very much pushes the agenda of family although in reality is is basically saying if you dint do what we tell you you won't see your family in the eternities 😂

My relationship with my Parents is pretty much the same. My dad gets offended sometimes, like when I refused to pray for the first time etc but it's really not talked about with him. I think my mum sees the cracks but refuses to acknowledge them became transitioning out is difficult.

We don't live near my in laws and they are much closer to their daughters than they are us. My husbands dad isn't a member and never has been. His mother makes little comments but it's mostly ignored. She has said things like her sister moved counties to be near her daughter as she was the only one still active. Which is often what you see, they are disappointed in us for "being led astray".

How has your relationship with your husband changed since leaving the faith?

I had a Mormon friend in school and knew another large Mormon family in my village and the wives were quite subservient. I was shocked when my usually outspoken and independent friend got married to a Mormon man at only 21 after just nine months of knowing him. Is this normal or was it a bit rushed/early even by Mormon standards?

Yes, it's quite normal for things to happen quickly. It's because of the no sex before marriage.

So I met my husband in August at an event. We started messaging (MSM back then) and it's got to text and calls everyday. We lived 600 miles away from each other so he came to visit in Nov, he stayed a week and then I visited him in December and on Jan 1st we got engaged and in October we were married. So super fast compared to normal relationships and I had to pack up my life and move to be together.

There is definitely a level is subservience even if you don't admit it. Men are heads of the home, they have the priesthood, they have more leadership Callings. They church does talk about partnership but they don't really get what that concept means.

However, I didn't feel subservient but in that same breath I pulled the breaks on my career so we could have children (4 of them) and stay at home. He would serve in callings and be out a lot serving and I would be home with the children and there were a lot of times that was very difficult. I had 3 children in less than 2 years (twins in the mix) and two have additional needs and it was really really difficult and I expressed that to others and was rebuked a lot because it was my duty was to support my husband and "allow" and encourage him to do his leadership responsibilities. I resented that and so did he did.

We both left together but I lost all faith much quicker than he did. But I supported whatever he wanted to do, we have a lot of respect for each other and we are way happier now. It's like a cloud was lifted and life is so much more enjoyable. We don't have the restrictions and demands we once did, we are accepting of others rather than just tolerating them 😂

Our relationship has significantly improved although it was never bad at all. I struggled a lot with, I guess, the pressure of the religion and even maybe some depression (which is very common in the church). Now we are so much happier and mentally robust but like I have mentioned previously the transition out was difficult for me and frankly that nearly killed me as I was so torn I couldn't deal with it.

My husband this year decided to look at the religion properly, he used mostly their own approved material and researched different aspects and even when he didn't use church approved he checked all the sources. He was absolutely appalled by it all. It makes him/us angry that we have been lied to all our lives. As we both studied studied stuff together it was like a episode of making a Murder where you have to pause it to discuss 😂

I think we are much closer now, definitely feel much more equal in the relationship and I think we would have lived our lives very differently if we hadn't had the church in it. But on the other hand, without the church we wouldn't have found each other, so I'm happy we did.

The church isn't all bad, there are good aspects of it, but there are lots of aspects that are bad, things I didn't see or understand when I was a member.

@Hopefulhen

How has your relationship with your husband changed since leaving the faith?

I had a Mormon friend in school and knew another large Mormon family in my village and the wives were quite subservient. I was shocked when my usually outspoken and independent friend got married to a Mormon man at only 21 after just nine months of knowing him. Is this normal or was it a bit rushed/early even by Mormon standards?

I've know members who have got married after a couple of weeks literally and then others who have dates 2 years or more. However, I would say within the year was probably quite typical even here in the UK. Least it was when I was married.

There seems to be a lot of similarities to Jehovah’s Witnesses, do you know what the relationship is between them and Mormons?

@Rainbowshine

There seems to be a lot of similarities to Jehovah’s Witnesses, do you know what the relationship is between them and Mormons?

I think they are quite similar in many many ways. Both of course think each other is bonkers and bizarre.

I think JW are more encouraged to shun those who leave or sin, they have the blood thing and the 144,000 I think that will go to heaven, and they don't encourage getting an education.

Mormons believe in multiple heavens and the ability to become gods, they believe in a pre existence, they have health laws which prohibit alcohol, tea, coffee and cigarettes, and have a massive fortune that which they could make huge differences in the world but instead buy malls, investments and shares.

@Someonesayroadtrip thank you, that’s very helpful for my understanding of the two and that they are not related but as you have identified have their own idiosyncrasies (if that’s the best word to describe the insular and very prescribed, not to mention patriarchal or even misogynistic practices of the JW’s at least).