Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think it’s crazy that National Minimum wage is £27k

663 replies

Butterflyfluff · 09/10/2026 20:08

Yet it’s not really enough to live on 😢

My first job paid £7.5k per year and I thought I was loaded! And I’m not ancient.

Now 2 people on NMW earn over £50k between them yet it’s really not enough these days.

OP posts:
Boreded · 13/10/2026 12:55

rainingsnoring · 13/10/2026 10:26

If that is true, it doesn't actually prove anything. It's just an anecdote.
On a population level, Millennials are far less financially advantaged that their parents.

Can I ask how you are attempting to compare your wealth with your children's at a comparable age? Are you comparing the percentile you think you were in vs the percentile you think they are in on a population level? Are you comparing incomes, not wealth? Have they acquired this 'wealth' via their incomes alone or have they already benefitted from parental/other family gifts/inheritance?
It's really unclear when people make these sort of statements.

This…

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:57

Boreded · 13/10/2026 12:53

I’m not talking about my own personal experience…do you read my responses before replying?

I’ve repeatedly told you that the evidence is available, I’ve provided you with website links, suggested you google it to educate yourself, and yet you continue to disagree without actually ever looking and considering things around you.

You can argue until you are blue in the face that the grass is yellow because it is scorched in your part of the world, but it doesn’t change the fact that it is green everywhere else.

But like I said, you could even ask your children and they’ll tell you that I’m right.

You keep sending me English stuff which has nothing to do with anything as we don't live there.

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:58

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:57

You keep sending me English stuff which has nothing to do with anything as we don't live there.

Honestly? My children would wonder why someone their age was on mumsnet.

FirmSnake · 13/10/2026 12:59

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:46

I am not going to argue with you about people who are in dire poverty. Does it bloody matter what age they are?

You're talking about them as if they are specimens in a Petri dish.

So only you can talk about age? Noted.

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:00

FirmSnake · 13/10/2026 12:59

So only you can talk about age? Noted.

Good, strange though.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:01

rainingsnoring · 13/10/2026 12:09

I'm really struggling to believe this. I can't recall seeing people in their later years on the streets. Boomers are 60-80 now. That is not the age group that are on the streets. There are lots of officially homeless families though (in temporary accommodation) and lots of people in their 20s-40s approx on the streets.
It may be different in the US but not in the UK.

And they’d die younger so being on the streets at that age isn’t exactly what you’d see much of is it.

But this is just the new stance being taken since they can’t argue about pensions given the overwhelming evidence that’s available.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:02

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:58

Honestly? My children would wonder why someone their age was on mumsnet.

What a bizarre, childish, and actually quite rude response. Mumsnet is for everyone.

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:03

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:02

What a bizarre, childish, and actually quite rude response. Mumsnet is for everyone.

It's not rude. If you have taken offence, that's on you. I just posted MY reality.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:04

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:57

You keep sending me English stuff which has nothing to do with anything as we don't live there.

I keep sending you stuff about the UK actually. You don’t actually believe that Scotland is any different surely 😂

Here are some uk stats for you though:

Wealth — millennials vs previous generations

  • £27,000 vs £53,000: Early millennials had median household wealth of £27,000 per adult in their early thirties, compared with £53,000 for people born in the 1970s at the same age.
  • 20 percentage points: UK homeownership among households headed by 30–34-year-olds fell by more than 20 percentage points between 1986 and 2021.
  • 55% vs 20%: Real public spending per pensioner increased 55% between 2004–05 and 2023–24, compared with 20% per child.
  • £31,000 vs £18,000: Total annual government spending per pensioner was £31,000 in 2023–24, compared with £18,000 per child. This includes age-related services, not just cash benefits.
  • 28% → 16%: Pensioner poverty fell from 28% in 1995 to 16% in 2023, while child poverty remained around 30%.
Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:05

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:04

I keep sending you stuff about the UK actually. You don’t actually believe that Scotland is any different surely 😂

Here are some uk stats for you though:

Wealth — millennials vs previous generations

  • £27,000 vs £53,000: Early millennials had median household wealth of £27,000 per adult in their early thirties, compared with £53,000 for people born in the 1970s at the same age.
  • 20 percentage points: UK homeownership among households headed by 30–34-year-olds fell by more than 20 percentage points between 1986 and 2021.
  • 55% vs 20%: Real public spending per pensioner increased 55% between 2004–05 and 2023–24, compared with 20% per child.
  • £31,000 vs £18,000: Total annual government spending per pensioner was £31,000 in 2023–24, compared with £18,000 per child. This includes age-related services, not just cash benefits.
  • 28% → 16%: Pensioner poverty fell from 28% in 1995 to 16% in 2023, while child poverty remained around 30%.

Sorry. Not reading it.

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:06

Unless you post the source.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:17

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 12:21

Yes I know. We had one. Don't be so patronising by the way.

Almost, but actually what you were seeing there was condescension.

This…is being patronising.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:20

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:06

Unless you post the source.

There you go…

  1. £27,000 vs £53,000 — Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS), The economic circumstances of different generations (2016). _https://ifs.org.uk/publications/economic-circumstances-different-generations-latest-picture_
  2. 20 percentage-point decline in homeownership — Resolution Foundation, An intergenerational audit for the UK (2023). _https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/publications/an-intergenerational-audit-for-the-uk-2023/_
  3. 55% vs 20% increase in public spending — Intergenerational Foundation, A Growing Divide. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_
  4. £31,000 vs £18,000 government spending — Same Intergenerational Foundation report. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_
  5. Pensioner poverty 28% → 16% — Same Intergenerational Foundation report. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_

Enjoy 👍

An intergenerational audit for the UK • Resolution Foundation

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/publications/an-intergenerational-audit-for-the-uk-2023/

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:21

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:03

It's not rude. If you have taken offence, that's on you. I just posted MY reality.

Nah no offense taken, why would I take offense to something you said to someone else. Or that was said online by someone I do not know 🤷‍♀️

Life is too short to be upset my strangers, especially those who reply to their own comments with a comment saying they shouldn’t be on mumsnet

Constantrunner · 13/10/2026 13:23

Just to say spending on pensioners outside of pensions is largely on care for those with no savings and little income. Most other age related services for older people funded by government have closed.

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:27

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:20

There you go…

  1. £27,000 vs £53,000 — Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS), The economic circumstances of different generations (2016). _https://ifs.org.uk/publications/economic-circumstances-different-generations-latest-picture_
  2. 20 percentage-point decline in homeownership — Resolution Foundation, An intergenerational audit for the UK (2023). _https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/publications/an-intergenerational-audit-for-the-uk-2023/_
  3. 55% vs 20% increase in public spending — Intergenerational Foundation, A Growing Divide. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_
  4. £31,000 vs £18,000 government spending — Same Intergenerational Foundation report. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_
  5. Pensioner poverty 28% → 16% — Same Intergenerational Foundation report. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_

Enjoy 👍

Read them. No country mentioned 👍

ACynicalDad · 13/10/2026 13:39

From an employer’s perspective, it’s hard to justify paying that much for someone’s first job when AI can do some of the work for less. It’s awful that £27k still isn’t enough to live on, but the minimum wage should protect people from exploitation—not price inexperienced workers out of a job. If employers can’t make the numbers work, some people will miss out on that first job and end up relying on benefits instead.
Minimum wages have risen at roughly the pace other wages should have risen, but that doesn’t automatically make those increases affordable for every employer.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:40

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 13:27

Read them. No country mentioned 👍

You saw what you wanted to see then…

  1. The IFS document it refers to the UK 15 times. When you open it, click on the website address bar, type UK and then it shows ‘on this page’ you can then locate each one.

For reference:
The Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS) is the UK's leading independent, non-profit microeconomic research institute based in Bloomsbury, London.

Their research is UK based.

  • The title of the second document is:
An intergenerational audit for the UK 2023
  • The 3rd document (which covers points 3/4/5) is titled: A growing divide: Two decades of intergenerational unfairness

First paragraph in the introduction before even opening the document says:
IF’s latest report provides a comprehensive assessment of how conditions for young people in the UK have evolved over the past two decades.

You’re making yourself look silly

nearlylovemyusername · 13/10/2026 13:55

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:20

There you go…

  1. £27,000 vs £53,000 — Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS), The economic circumstances of different generations (2016). _https://ifs.org.uk/publications/economic-circumstances-different-generations-latest-picture_
  2. 20 percentage-point decline in homeownership — Resolution Foundation, An intergenerational audit for the UK (2023). _https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/publications/an-intergenerational-audit-for-the-uk-2023/_
  3. 55% vs 20% increase in public spending — Intergenerational Foundation, A Growing Divide. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_
  4. £31,000 vs £18,000 government spending — Same Intergenerational Foundation report. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_
  5. Pensioner poverty 28% → 16% — Same Intergenerational Foundation report. _https://if.org.uk/research/a-growing-divide-two-decades-of-intergenerational-unfairness-2/_

Enjoy 👍

I opened a few links.

It's interesting that they compare age group situation now and 10-20 years ago but don't do the same analysis for other age groups. Talking about Resolutionfoundation here. The same real decline is seen across all generations, not just 30-34 yo. This "omission" discredits the entire research.

And surely the spend on pensioners (the group which has little if any capacity to change their circumstances once they reach this stage of life) is expected to be higher than on younger people who are supposed to be net contributors, generally healthier and should provide for own children?

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:57

nearlylovemyusername · 13/10/2026 13:55

I opened a few links.

It's interesting that they compare age group situation now and 10-20 years ago but don't do the same analysis for other age groups. Talking about Resolutionfoundation here. The same real decline is seen across all generations, not just 30-34 yo. This "omission" discredits the entire research.

And surely the spend on pensioners (the group which has little if any capacity to change their circumstances once they reach this stage of life) is expected to be higher than on younger people who are supposed to be net contributors, generally healthier and should provide for own children?

Because the primary focus of this research is those age groups. There will be other studies looking at the contrast between other age groups. One study can’t look at everything.

nearlylovemyusername · 13/10/2026 14:05

So we'll have to look at findings about pensioners living in poverty as well then.

The problem in UK (and much across developed West) is not wages as such, but high house prices. We can't keep increasing NMW and giving ever more protection to employees to a point when hiring cannot be sustained. We need to ensure that housing prices are of such level that a person on NMW can afford some basic accommodation in all areas of the country. The only way of doing this in UK is massive program of social housebuilding and this should be flats, not private homes.

FirmSnake · 13/10/2026 14:41

nearlylovemyusername · 13/10/2026 13:55

I opened a few links.

It's interesting that they compare age group situation now and 10-20 years ago but don't do the same analysis for other age groups. Talking about Resolutionfoundation here. The same real decline is seen across all generations, not just 30-34 yo. This "omission" discredits the entire research.

And surely the spend on pensioners (the group which has little if any capacity to change their circumstances once they reach this stage of life) is expected to be higher than on younger people who are supposed to be net contributors, generally healthier and should provide for own children?

Why is it expected that the spend be higher on the group with the most? Its not as if children can change their circumstances either. And they tend to have no assets or income at all.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 14:45

nearlylovemyusername · 13/10/2026 14:05

So we'll have to look at findings about pensioners living in poverty as well then.

The problem in UK (and much across developed West) is not wages as such, but high house prices. We can't keep increasing NMW and giving ever more protection to employees to a point when hiring cannot be sustained. We need to ensure that housing prices are of such level that a person on NMW can afford some basic accommodation in all areas of the country. The only way of doing this in UK is massive program of social housebuilding and this should be flats, not private homes.

A Growing Divide: Two Decades of Intergenerational Unfairness – Intergenerational Foundation
Under Key findings, it states:

  • Pensioner poverty fell from 28% in 1995 to 16% in 2023.
  • Child poverty remained at 30%, nearly double the pensioner rate.

Again this is research for the UK.

You can also look at this source too:
Joseph Rowntree Foundation’s UK poverty statistics .

Overall poverty rates for children, working-age adults and pensioners

Our latest data charts show clear differences in poverty rates across age groups, with children and people in lone-parent families at highest risk.

https://www.jrf.org.uk/uk-poverty-statistics/overall-poverty-rates-for-children-working-age-adults-and-pensioners

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 15:53

Boreded · 13/10/2026 13:40

You saw what you wanted to see then…

  1. The IFS document it refers to the UK 15 times. When you open it, click on the website address bar, type UK and then it shows ‘on this page’ you can then locate each one.

For reference:
The Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS) is the UK's leading independent, non-profit microeconomic research institute based in Bloomsbury, London.

Their research is UK based.

  • The title of the second document is:
An intergenerational audit for the UK 2023
  • The 3rd document (which covers points 3/4/5) is titled: A growing divide: Two decades of intergenerational unfairness

First paragraph in the introduction before even opening the document says:
IF’s latest report provides a comprehensive assessment of how conditions for young people in the UK have evolved over the past two decades.

You’re making yourself look silly

The UK isn't a country.

Boreded · 13/10/2026 15:59

Differentforgirls · 13/10/2026 15:53

The UK isn't a country.

Oh dear…

The UK is a sovereign country. Its full name is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. It consists of four constituent countries:

  • England
  • Scotland
  • Wales
  • Northern Ireland
The distinction is that the UK is an independent sovereign state, recognised internationally, while its four constituent countries are not individually sovereign states. Both the UK and England can correctly be called countries, but they are countries in different constitutional senses.

Are you trying to be funny? Seriously though? Because if you are I won’t bother to reply…I genuinely just thought you were oblivious to pensioner wealth because you lived in a bubble, now I’m not so sure you aren’t having a laugh at my expense.