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Eve Appeal responds to criticism against TWAW

(171 Posts)
MoreSchnitzelPlease Thu 16-Jul-20 23:38:54

I follow Eve Appeal on Instagram. It is a charity that raises awareness for gynaecological cancers. I did not expect this kind of response from them, and I am so hurt by their comments. How is it possible that trans women would need the services of this charity? How can you be tested for a gynaecological cancer when you do not possess female organs?

www.instagram.com/p/CCt6HK6lehL/?igshid=1t693pbic6ouz

How can a charity for gynecological cancer say that TWAW? It feels like I'm living in The Twilight Zone. I can't support a charity that goes against science. This feels like such a betrayal. Women are not disgusting for going against TWAW.

OP’s posts: |
FlatCheese Thu 16-Jul-20 23:44:49

I read some of the comments down the side. They seem to have completely grasped the wrong end of the stick - they're upset because they think that "transphobes" are claiming that they're no longer women because they've had a hysterectomy and that only people with female reproductive organs are female and that they're still female because they "identify" as such.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 16-Jul-20 23:45:39

Which is a lie that TRAs put out there.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 16-Jul-20 23:47:16

My own mother had cervical cancer and an emergency hysterectomy. When I get a smear test they always mention it. My mother is female, was female before her hysterectomy, and will always be female.

DamsonDragon Thu 16-Jul-20 23:49:55

transwomen who have had gender confirmation surgery can get cervical cancer of the neo-vagina/cervix.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28217933/

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 16-Jul-20 23:53:36

That's not a cervix. It's not possible to build an actual cervix from a penis/colon. A cervix is the neck of the uterus, something MTF people don't have. Happy to help.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 16-Jul-20 23:55:09

There you go

https://www.stanfordchildrens.org/en/topic/default?id=anatomy-of-female-pelvic-area-85-P00547

PheasantPlucker1 Thu 16-Jul-20 23:55:48

I bled for 9 solid fucking months before a lovely locum doctor finally gave in to my demands and agreed I could have a smear.

Even when the results came back, it then took another 4 months to be seen at the hospital.

Yet this is the priority for a gynalogical cancer charity?

Never mind young mothers who cant get a diagnosis when they have cancer, its all about the poor menz feelz hmm

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 16-Jul-20 23:56:31

Penile and colon cancer are and will continue to be a risk for males.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 16-Jul-20 23:57:01

Pheasant thanks

NotBadConsidering Thu 16-Jul-20 23:59:36

DamsonDragon

transwomen who have had gender confirmation surgery can get cervical cancer of the neo-vagina/cervix.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28217933/

No they don’t. They get problems that may resemble the same findings under a microscope, but it’s not cervical cancer, and it’s not a gynaecological cancer.

It’s one of the many lifelong medicalisation issues that complicates affirmative medical treatment including hormones and surgery and doctors who perform these surgeries should also tidy up their own mess surveil for these issues, as well as fully consent young people to the risks.

But it is not in any way shape or form, cervical cancer.

DamsonDragon Thu 16-Jul-20 23:59:55

I'm sorry I better tell the scientists who wrote the article i linked that clearly there years of research are wrong because someone on the internet said so...

No one is claiming its a natural vagina, hence its refered to as a neo-vagina, however TW who have had surgery are at increased risk of abnormal lesions, and do require regular smears.. As the study I linked above clearly states... honestly, I'm just repeating what the science has found.

I'm sorry, but regardless of what your personal opinion is on the TWAW debate is, we as people should not be telling anyone they should not be accessing health services that medical science has identified they need (smear tests) as thats not far from wishing cancer on them, as your denying them the chance to identify abnormalities early.

WeeBisom Fri 17-Jul-20 00:00:32

@DamsonDragon, some sexual reassignment surgeries use the glans of the penis as a “neo clitoris”. Other surgeons want their patients to get pleasure from sexual penetration as well, so they will put a piece of the glans in the “neo vagina”. This is called a “neo cervix”. In no way is this structure similar to a cervix, however - it is just a piece of penis. It’s not a muscle. It’s not attached to the uterus. It doesn’t perform any analogous function to a cervix - it’s sole role is to increase the chance the patient has sexual feeling.

So when these patients get cancer due to hpv, this is not cervical cancer but rather cancer of the penis glans. To call this structure a neo cervix is just as nonsensical as saying that trans women can get periods.

So now we women don’t just “weaponise” sexual assault and domestic violence, but also cancer!

Ereshkigalangcleg Fri 17-Jul-20 00:01:18

Yes it's a neovagina, which is a polite way of saying it's a simulation. So any "cervix" is also, and therefore nothing to do with actual cervical cancer.

StuffThem Fri 17-Jul-20 00:03:03

I don't have a problem with most of their post. They're saying that trans men (biological women) still need access to smear tests. That's true. They're not saying TWAW and TW need smears confused

Ereshkigalangcleg Fri 17-Jul-20 00:03:50

The amount of males who have had this surgery is vanishingly small, so one would hope their health would be regularly monitored for all sorts of reasons, given that they had had such a massively life changing surgery.

StuffThem Fri 17-Jul-20 00:06:00

@DamsonDragon thanks for posting that.

Do you happen to have a ny idea if a standard cervical smear test would pick up what was needed? The paper doesn't seem to say, and I just wondered because obviously the cells in question would be different in a neovagina to a cervix.

Ereshkigalangcleg Fri 17-Jul-20 00:06:03

I don't have a problem with most of their post. They're saying that trans men (biological women) still need access to smear tests. That's true. They're not saying TWAW and TW need smears

DamsonDragon is. And Eve Appeal have fallen for the TRAs' stupid argument that unless you agree with gender identity ideology you think women who have had a hysterectomy are male hmm

FloralBunting Fri 17-Jul-20 00:07:10

And yet here ont' thread is a TWAW zealot claiming that male people do indeed get cervical cancer of the inverted penis.

This isn't about 'including' TM for the zealots. This is about focusing on TW.

Griefmonster Fri 17-Jul-20 00:07:57

@DamsonDragon that is not cervical cancer. It is cancer in a part of the body that is roughly the same location as a cervix would be on a female body.

That said, I don't see what there is to be upset about in the response. They talk about needing to use the word "woman" but also recognise trans men and non binary people face barriers to seeking health care for their bodies (that are female). There's nothing there that is claiming TWAW. If anything , it's saying TMAW.

Interested to know what others see on that response.

PheasantPlucker1 Fri 17-Jul-20 00:08:17

Side effects of a surgery someone chose to have are hardly the same thing as cancer.

Its amazing the things people like to identify as having. Just when you think they cant stoop any lower...

AnneBullen Fri 17-Jul-20 00:08:22

About three or four years ago I was working a night shift on labour ward and our SHO got bleeped from A and E (they carry the gynae and thy Enron’s bleep at night). A trans woman has presented with a problem with her neo vagina, I don’t know exactly what but PG not cancer.

Anyway, she answered the bleep and asked how the neo vagina had been constructed. From a penis, please bleep urology. From a colon, please bleep gastro. Either way, she really sternly informed the A and E SHO, this had absolutely nothing to do with obs and gynae.

I’ve often thought of her certainty and, in retrospect, bravery. I wonder what would happen if she got that bleep today.

AnneBullen Fri 17-Jul-20 00:09:35

Not that Enron’s! Obs

Ereshkigalangcleg Fri 17-Jul-20 00:10:11

Cheers to her AnneBullen (and fellow Anne Boleyn fan)? wine

DamsonDragon Fri 17-Jul-20 00:12:16

They get problems that may resemble the same findings under a microscope, but it’s not cervical cancer, and it’s not a gynaecological cancer.

if it barks like a dog, and looks like a dog... hmm

If it has the same cellular structure as something then it is that something, regardless of personal belief. Thats the beauty of science, its often rather easy to identify if something is the same on a factual, definitive basis, as much of science can be measured in absolutes.

Regardless of whether its cervical cancer or not, it strongly supports that transwomen post surgery require regular smears as in a ideal world women would be getting periodically.

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