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Transgender child rapist moved to women's prison during his sentence

(91 Posts)
DickToPhone Tue 21-Mar-17 02:03:11

Another day, another fucked up absurd transgender story.

www.thesun.co.uk/news/3137217/victims-fury-as-double-rapist-who-attacked-two-young-girls-is-moved-to-a-women-only-jail-after-10k-nhs-sex-change-op/

"A DOUBLE rapist who had a £10,000 NHS sex change in prison has been moved to a women’s jail.

Jessica Winfield, born Martin Ponting, attacked two girls and is now in HMP Bronzefield, Surrey."

"But prison bosses have been hit with a backlash from female inmates — with one even threatening to self-harm to get away from Winfield."

"The woman bravely visited her abuser five years ago in prison as part of a bid to get closure. But she was stunned to see the man who attacked her dressed as a woman. She said: “I had no idea what was going on. He was sat there wearing a wig and make-up. He had boobs.”"

Winfield’s brother Nigel, 49, told The Sun: “The best they could do is throw away the key. He is a menace to the public and people need to be warned about him.”

DickToPhone Tue 21-Mar-17 02:18:58

it's front page of The Sun.

Any chance BBC will report?

DickToPhone Tue 21-Mar-17 02:19:09

Sun front page: suttonnick.tumblr.com/image/158642626641

Datun Tue 21-Mar-17 07:33:02

"In the letter to Inside Time, Winfield wrote: "Unfortunately there is a minority of staff and inmates that give me a hard time because of my sexuality, possibly through lack of understanding and empathy."

"I feel like a female trapped in a male body."

"...prison bosses have been hit with a backlash from female inmates — with one even threatening to self-harm to get away from Winfield."

But no one will ever take advantage of gender identity legislation. Course not.

And who's to say he isn't transgender. He fits the (non-existent) criteria.

It never ceases to amaze me that people like Maria Miller either didn't see this coming, or did see it coming and didn't care.

I tend to think it's the former and it's very worrying that the representative supposedly for women, knows so little about them or sexual politics in general.

UnmentionedElephantDildo Tue 21-Mar-17 07:35:43

She's post-surgery, so yes she needs to move.

She'll probably need to go into a high security wing, for her own protection.

fakenamefornow Tue 21-Mar-17 07:39:32

We need a trans prison, it's the obvious solution.

CaoNiMartacus Tue 21-Mar-17 07:44:42

Isn't the more obvious solution to continue sex-segregating in prisons, with the freedom of gender expression left at the door along with other liberties that incarceration removes?

fakenamefornow Tue 21-Mar-17 07:45:50

There seem so many of these cases, although I may just be living in an echo chamber and noticing them all. I wish somebody would do a proper academic study into propensity to commit crime, particularly sex crime and trans women. If crimes committed by MtF trans are being recorded as being committed by women I don't see how it would be possible to study. That's another thing, we need proper recording.

fakenamefornow Tue 21-Mar-17 07:48:18

Isn't the more obvious solution to continue sex-segregating in prisons, with the freedom of gender expression left at the door along with other liberties that incarceration removes?

And then what do you do with post-op people who pass easily? I think we need a trans prison.

Fairyflaps Tue 21-Mar-17 07:51:16

Maria Miller was warned of this. By the British Psychological Society, no less.

"Conversely, psychologists working with forensic patients are aware of a number of cases where men convicted of sex crimes have falsely claimed to be transgender females for a number of reasons:
As a means of demonstrating reduced risk and so gaining parole;
As a means of explaining their sex offending aside from sexual gratification (e.g. wanting to ‘examine’ young females);
Or as a means of separating their sex offending self (male) from their future self (female).
In rare cases it has been thought that the person is seeking better access to females and young children through presenting in an apparently female way.

"Such strategies in no way affect risk an indeed may increase it. Some people falsely believe that taking oestrogen and blocking androgen in males will reduce risk of offending, however this is not necessarily the case.

"Consequently the Society recommends that the Government give appropriate assistance to transgender people within the criminal justice system; while being extremely cautious of setting law and policy such that some of the most dangerous people in society have greater latitude to offend".

Autumntactics Tue 21-Mar-17 07:52:27

It feels weird the juxtaposition of "I feel like a woman" and being a rapist, because that feels just about as far away as you can get from feeling like a woman. Or am I too playing into gender stereotypes about men's and women's behaviour? I have interviewed women who have been in prison for some research and many have been deeply traumatised by unimaginable abuse, it's obvious why they would feel unsafe; much of this is an unconscious or subconscious response to the body identifying threat, which is why it might trigger self harm in someone who had started responding that way as a result of past trauma.

Datun Tue 21-Mar-17 07:57:47

We need a trans prison, it's the obvious solution

There aren't enough transpeople to warrant more than one prison. So you could be in a situation where you are 300 miles away from your family.

I'm not sure whether that would impinge on any other rights?

He's a rapist, sentenced to life , had surgery on the NHS, and now wants to move to a female prison.

As someone said on a previous thread, if you're going to use your penis to rape somebody, it's unlikely that you have gender dysphoria.

So he would fit the profile of an autogynephile. An autogynephile who has had his surgery paid for and now is demanding to be sent to a female prison, which is the ultimate goal of that fetish.

So many decisions have been made and just accepted at face value.

ChocChocPorridge Tue 21-Mar-17 08:03:26

No Autumn - I can't see how there's anything female about using your penis to rape a woman either.

As to the idea that once someone's got a neovagina, they should be moved - the question would be why? Men have 2 orifices of their own that can be raped, why is adding a third suddenly such a huge issue? Shouldn't the question be why is such rape allowed to happen? Or if consensual, why is it different in a neovagina?

Datun Tue 21-Mar-17 08:05:24

Isn't the more obvious solution to continue sex-segregating in prisons, with the freedom of gender expression left at the door along with other liberties that incarceration removes?

This is the way I lean. Sexual assault is rife in male prisons. Male violence again. So instead of the overhaul of prisons bending over backwards to take into account abuse of trans people (the symptom) the overhaul should address male violence (the problem).

BigDeskBob Tue 21-Mar-17 08:22:25

I thought someone had to live as a women for years before NHS treatment is given. How can someone live as a women in a male prison?

DramaQueenofHighCs Tue 21-Mar-17 08:34:33

To be fair, I'm all for prisoners being allowed into the prison of the sex they identify with in many respects however in the case of a rapist - no, no, no and NO!

Of course one idea would be to have small "Trans" wings in prisons where they are with their own 'gender' but separate from the others. It wouldn't have to be completely segregated, but segregated enough that other prisoners wouldn't have to be around them unless they chose to.

pombal Tue 21-Mar-17 08:35:40

Convicted rapists should not be eligible for gender reassignment surgery.

Surely raping women and girls with your penis demonstrates clearly that you are a man.
How can it be otherwise?

Datun Tue 21-Mar-17 08:40:01

Convicted rapists should not be eligible for gender reassignment surgery.

Completely agree.

BetsyM00 Tue 21-Mar-17 08:52:13

One might think it is a good thing to cut a rapist's penis off.

Fairyflaps Tue 21-Mar-17 08:53:50

2014 stats: 1 in 6 of the male prison population had been convicted of a sexual offence (it is possibly higher now).
2016 stats: 42% of male prisoners over the age of 50 are convicted of a sexual offence.
Sex offenders can be held in any of 120 prisons. Only 21 prisons offer sex offenders treatment programmes. It is estimated only 1 in 6 convicted sex offenders has access to a treatment programme.
Just think how many treatment programmes could have been funded by £10,000. "Some people falsely believe that taking oestrogen and blocking androgen in males will reduce risk of offending, however this is not necessarily the case".

Compare this with the women's prison estate.
Most women entering prison under sentence (85%) have committed a non-violent offence. (42% entered custody under sentence in 2015 for theft and handling stolen goods).
53% of women in prison reported experiencing emotional, physical or sexual abuse as a child, compared to 27% of men.
46% of women in prison report having suffered a history of domestic abuse.

Datun Tue 21-Mar-17 08:59:09

BetsyM00

One might think it is a good thing to cut a rapist's penis off.

There's always a silver lining!

ageingrunner Tue 21-Mar-17 09:05:23

They might have cut his penis off, but if he still has the desire to be sexually violent towards women, he'll use an object of some sort, unfortunately. I really can't understand why, with the NHS in crisis, we're funding this surgery for this person?! Like with children, men need to be told 'no' sometimes

fakenamefornow Tue 21-Mar-17 09:06:55

Fairyflaps

Do you know how offences committed by trans people are recorded? Are the recorded by biological sex or self reported gender identity?

Datun Tue 21-Mar-17 09:11:55

fake

As far as I know, if they are legally a woman it gets reported as a female crime. But they have to go through the process and have their sex legally changed.

Fairyflaps Tue 21-Mar-17 09:30:00

Fakename CPS Guidelines are that:
"Prosecutors should address suspects according to their presented gender by using the correct gender and pronouns in all documentation". and this is the same in reporting.
Media guidelines are that an offender's transgender status should not be referred to unless it is relevant to the crime cf. Lauren Jeska.

Gender of defendants (and victims) is not always recorded.

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