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To hate the "let it go" Frozen song and its sexist attitude?

(88 Posts)
Inboxer Sun 09-Nov-14 04:23:41

It's played to death and not even that good! Also hate Elsa's "makeover" which abruptly occurs when she's singing about being true to herself. Clearly nothing depicts female emancipation to children as clearly as high heels and a glitzy slashed-to-the-thigh dress!! I suppose it's to much to ask for Disney to really allow Elsa to "let it go" i.e. sprout some armpit hair, stick on a pair of trackies and watch a bit of X Factor with a large bag of Doritos! grin

quietlysuggests Sun 09-Nov-14 04:47:45

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MsAspreyDiamonds Sun 09-Nov-14 04:53:18

My children love it but watch it at my sisters' house because I refuse to let Disney dvds darken my doorstep.

I am fighting a losing battle aren't I? I can see me being bulldozed into buying a copy.

pearpotter Sun 09-Nov-14 05:09:09

What??? It's totally about female emancipation and self-actualisation for me, about finding your true self and stopping living by the expectations of others.

All the glam and sparkles are for herself - she isn't doing it to attract a man, what with shutting herself away in a big old ice castle while she discovers the full extent of her powers!

It's an absolutely brilliant, uplifting song, and seriously if you want to find a target there is misogyny and sexism all around without looking for it in completely the wrong places.

Hurr1cane Sun 09-Nov-14 06:08:11

Do you have to be hairy to be a feminist? I would be completely uncomfortable in a track suit with hairy pits.

I don't shave and dress up for anyone else either because DP is rarely around and it's usually just me and my disabled DS. I do it because it makes me happy.

When I'm poorly I try to have a bath and put my face on otherwise I would feel worse.

I thought feminism and that was about respecting whatever women wanted? If someone wants to wear track suits and not shave I wouldn't even notice to be honest because I don't really care what other people do.

My friend is gender neutral and sometimes dresses as a man, sometimes neutral, sometimes she dresses womanly. I can't say I notice until she points it out. She's just her to me.

bigkidsdidit Sun 09-Nov-14 06:14:01

I agree with pear - it's practically the only Disney film that isn't sexist from start to finish

pearpotter Sun 09-Nov-14 06:18:54

Exactly.

If you aren't fat, sweaty, hairy, badly dressed and have appalling taste in Saturday night viewing then you aren't doing feminism correctly, apparently. smile

X-Factor, that shining example of female emancipation and daring rejection of the patriarchal norms in the pop industry and wider society. Or...er, not.

Inboxer Sun 09-Nov-14 06:23:55

No you don't have to be hairy to be a feminist!!! Not what I said at all!!! Was just a humourous take on what it might truely be like to "let if go!" Lighten up folks!

Rinkydinkypink Sun 09-Nov-14 06:25:16

Well it's the most female inspiring film they've made yet. At least all the women aren't waiting to be rescued by the handsome man and live happily ever after (as if!)

I'm a feminist and pleased to say I'm not hairy (all the time wink). I like a bit of sparkle and I wear dresses and skirts. I bother to look nice because I want to feel good about myself and feel like I've taken care of me. I actually quite like some men as well gasp.

Inboxer Sun 09-Nov-14 06:35:19

Just seems a very male perception of female liberation. Rather like Sandy in Grease. Her new born confidence is marked by tight leather trousers and heels!! Such a narrow view and a weird message!!

Romeyroo Sun 09-Nov-14 06:41:55

I really like it. To me, it is about the weight of expectations to do things right, indeed suppress your real self, being damaging.

I mean, the film shows what Elsa can do at the end when she is happy and using her powers positively. How many women don't get to use their unique talents positively because the weight of societal or parental or indeed later, spousal, expectations channels them a certain way?

I think the bit you mean, inboxer, where Elsa starts sashaying across the floor in full seductress mode is precisely because she is, at that point, untouchable. I agree that it totally plays on ideas of socially acceptable beauty and female desirability, but if she can conjure herself such an amazing palace, why should she not have the amazing dress to go with it? The cold doesn't bother her, anyway. I think the real message is that the totally free, ice princess life is not sustainable anyway, because it is not just her it effects. So, it is about finding a balance between being herself, but not doing that to the exclusion of all else (which would be narcisstic), and in the end, having a situation she can be herself in, whilst not shutting herself off from social relationships.

I am a single parent, I have no intention of having a man in my life but I do my hair and make up because it's fun to do different things and see what it looks like. I always got negative comments about wearing make-up when I was growing up (apparently my favoured shade of lipstick made me look like a prostitute hmm), and I never really ventured beyond a very neutral palette for twenty years. So, when my DD wants to buy and wear different shades, I encourage her to think about what suits her. She knows she doesn't have to wear anything but if she wants to, why not?

Besides, the film has taught DD that true love is not always what it seems and men can play on your vulnerabilities to get what they want (Prince Hans). The line where he says 'but you were so desperate for love, you would believe anything' really hit home. That is what happens if you grow up emotionally neglected. Either that, or you shut yourself in an ice palace (metaphorically speaking).

OhFrabjousDay Sun 09-Nov-14 07:02:11

YABU, for all the reasons Romeyroo says, but also because I currently have "It's time to see what I can do, to test the limits and break through" as my personal mantra.

TheRealAmandaClarke Sun 09-Nov-14 07:11:27

I like the song. Its the best part imho of an otherwise quite dull film (although the icy scenery is pretty)
But I agree with you in many ways. There's a pretence in the film being about strong women and emancipation but the reality is a stereotype we're so familiar with. The adventuring, independent character (really the heroine of the story) falls quite desperate.y in love with any man who she spends more than five minutes with (forgivable, don't we all want love?) and is overshadowed by her sulking sister Because Elsa is blonde, more conventionally attractive and wears a sexy dress.
Girly power!

itispronouncedpenguin Sun 09-Nov-14 07:40:06

I think Merida's outfit is far more 'feminist' than Elsa's. No thigh flash and long thick sleeves. I dont see much of a feminist message in Frozen besides 'kiss who you like' but everyone keeps saying its really feminist. No more so than Disney films like Pocahontas and thats been around for yeara.

itispronouncedpenguin Sun 09-Nov-14 07:40:24

Years sorry.

TheRealAmandaClarke Sun 09-Nov-14 07:47:17

Who is Merida?

DuchessofBuffonia Sun 09-Nov-14 07:52:18

Penguin, I was just thinking of Pocahontas. She is portrayed as incredibly strong and independent. She makes her own decisions, saves the hero's life and then chooses to stay behind (obviously just looking at the film, not the historical accuracy).

Romeyroo Sun 09-Nov-14 07:52:21

I don't think there is a pretence in the film, though. It is about sibling dynamics and the effect of growing up in a dysfunctional family. The 'Let it go' song is Elsa's song, it is how she deals with the consequences of who she is and having been emotionally neglected because of it. Anna has been treated differently, but no less emotionally neglected. The point about it taking less than five minutes for her to fall in love is because she has no healthy boundaries and no idea what a functioning relationship looks like.

To be honest, DD's view on making it a more feminist film would be to make the leading characters men. And have them helped out by a female version of Christoph and a female reindeer. But that is not what we have got socially, it is very hard to conceive that alternate film. So I think the film takes what we do have socially, takes it apart and rearranges it so it works for the characters. It is kind of second wave feminism (recognition of structual barriers, and indeed, separatism) combined with third wave (female agency within said structural barriers) which if you think about it is really where we are at in women's position. I think it is a pretty appropriate reflection of what girls and young women have to deal with, on many levels.

<over-analysing>

LovleyRitaMeterMaid Sun 09-Nov-14 07:54:16

I think The Princess and the Frog had a good message. She,did meet a man but she was busy working hard to reach her goal of getting a restaurant. The man didn't sweep in and sort it all for her.

Romeyroo Sun 09-Nov-14 07:54:26

Agree that Brave was more obviously feminist, though. Have not seen Pocahontas.

TheRealAmandaClarke Sun 09-Nov-14 08:02:51

Good points romeyroo

LetticeKnollys Sun 09-Nov-14 08:06:09

Are we all forgetting Mulan? Trumps the lot! grin

DuchessofBuffonia Sun 09-Nov-14 08:06:18

Agree with both Princess & Frog and Brave. Also:

The Lion King - Nala is portrayed as a stronger character than Simba

Mulan - to protect her father, she disguises herself as a man to fight the Hun in war.

Beauty & the Beast - Belle is intelligent, loves reading, is brave and saves her father (twice) and goes back to rescue Beast

DuchessofBuffonia Sun 09-Nov-14 08:14:38

(I'm on a roll now)

The Rescuers - Miss Bianca is far more cool an collected than Bernard

Lilo & Stitch

Sally in The Nightmare Before Christmas freeing herself from the control of her 'creator'

You could make the case for Ariel and Jasmine as well - knowing their own minds and refusing to comply with their fathers' orders.

Scrumbled Sun 09-Nov-14 08:18:50

I've never watched the film but that song hurst my ears.

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