I’m a Cover Supervisor and I just walked out.

[tellmesomethingtrue]

At the end of my tether. Pupils have been shouting at me, arguing with me for 3 hours straight today. I’ve told HR that I can’t cope with the final lesson and I’ve gone to sit in my car. I welcome the classes pleasantly, I am organised and the kids know me. Just because “I’m a sub” they are disrespectful and just awful. As soon as another teacher comes in to support me, the kids are fine. Today, I’ve sent 9 pupils to work elsewhere and called SLT three times. On the verge of (another) panic attack, enough is enough. I don’t think employment should be like this. Usually half the class are absolutely fine, do the right thing and work. Surely their parents would be mortified.

The type of people who are the parents to these brats aren't on Mumsnet. And if these particular parents received any communication from the school regarding their kids behaviour I shouldn't be think they'd give a toss

With knobs on!

Some of the parents are on Mumsnet judging by the complaining they do about their child's school. Some of the complaints are absolutely justified and lots are utterly ridiculous.

1970s……I told my mother the PE teacher had clipped me round the shoulder for rudeness and sulky behaviour. My mother asked what I’d said and done. I told her. Result…..a much harder clip round the other shoulder and an evening in my bedroom on my own. (No tv or phone or laptop then of course!).

The Christian fundamentalist ones?

I would only do this through heads of year or the senior management team.

With kindness, it may not be the job for you. Being challenging to the temp teacher was pretty standard when I was in school. The behaviour you are describing is a bit of the extreme end. I was one of the quiet kids and I never actually did or said anything but there was a feeling of "this isn't my proper teacher" every time so I didn't really care much about what they did or said.

It would be so tempting to put on your earphones, your feet on a chair and ignore them!!!! I had no idea that schools used untrained teachers for cover. What a dreadful thing to do. Supply cover should be paid at a higher rate in the first place! Give the children the choice of completing the set work to a satisfactory level or be in detention after school. I assume work is set for the pupils by the subject staff. Allow those who do not want to co-operate to go to the back of the room and leave the others to get on with their work. I'd rather work on a Supermarket till than do cover in a Secondary school.

I have to admit that I wouldn't have DARED misbehave at school. I got the ruler round the back of the legs for talking during choir practice at primary and my mother would have tanned my hide if school had got in touch with her and told her I'd been out of order. I have ADHD so I didn't always understand social norms and what was allowed and what not, but the fear of a good hiding meant I tried really hard not to overstep any lines and learned to behave in a socially acceptable way.

I see a lot of kids having their behaviour excused left right and centre and I find myself thinking that I wonder if having the fear of punishment put into them might not help a lot.

And yes, I know that beating is socially unacceptable, and children shouldn't live in fear. But we did and it worked on us.

You can't stay there as once they behave in this way towards you, there is no way back, I'm afraid. Try another school or another line of work.

Most schools - male teachers are respected more - they are taller and boys respect them more. Evidence is there toxic masculinity is a real thing and it starts in schools.

I don't disagree that children generally do better with firm boundaries and rules, and parents play a part in that. But bad behaviour has always existed. In the 60s there were schools in London that were essentially pens of violence. Kids threatening each other and staff; throwing tables and other heavy objects off balconies, deliberately aiming for staff and other kids below etc. The same was true of schools in Oz in the 80s, 90s, 2000's and so on. More than 1 teacher was stabbed in the high school near me. I'm not saying any of this is at all acceptable in the slightest, just that it's not only some of the youth of today that are "feral".

Some kids can be vile.
I think there should be CCTV in every classroom and hallway monitoring what goes on.

🤣🤣😂🤣😅

I'm only up to here, but this is absolutely not the case at my DTs school.

I've seen multiple commendations (their merit system) awarded to the whole class for exemplary behaviour, by a cover teacher. I thought the teacher must have very low standards or be a bit odd for rewarding good behaviour like that, but reading this, theyve clearly subbed elsewhere!! Not a private school but is a grammar school.

Poor cover teachers. I wonder how anyone can stand it if this is the case in most schools!

No, it's the Andrew Tate followers, obviously!!

I love teaching. But I couldn't do it in a school. I did try years ago and I have degrees in a shortage subject. But teenagers are hard work and so much more interested in showing off to their mates than listening. I realised quite quickly that to survive in school I'd have to morph into my least favourite teacher who was respected because she was mean and cruel and we were afraid of her (she regularly used to reduce the further maths A level students to tears). I couldn't do that to myself and switched to teaching university students instead. It has its own issues, but I'm immensely happier now.

Hope today was a better day, @tellmesomethingtrue . I didn't even get all the way through teacher training before cracking due my inability to control students' poor behaviour and the total lack of support I had from my college and my placement school. Anyone who stays in teaching is a hero in my eyes, it's a thankless task.

So much depends on the SLT and the school ethos though: my first placement school was much more rough, objectively speaking, but the staff were wonderfully supportive to me and I learned a lot. My second placement school was in a naice middle class area with much better funding, and support was basically nil. My mentor went on long-term sick leave a couple of weeks into my placement and a replacement was never appointed. No wonder I sank like a stone.

I used to enjoy teaching year seven and sixth formers, it was Y8-10 who were the worst. Absolutely chancing their arm every minute of the day. "Low-level disruption" is only low-level when it's no more than two incidents per lesson. More than that is a huge problem.

Kids are so disrespectful towards teachers nowadays because they know there will be no repercussions. IMO it should be far easier for schools to expel bad kids and they should look to do this at the first possible opportunity, in order to protect the education of well-behaved children who actually want to learn and get on in life.

I don't mean to pick on your post, but why on earth was your child singing or doing pratfalls in class? What made them think that was remotely appropriate?

As disruption goes I'd say it's a stretch to describe that as low-level. Low level to me is a quick whispered comment or borrowing a pencil from a friend, not bursting into song in the middle of a lesson.

I am so sorry that you're experiencing this. But I'm not shocked.

In my childrens', 'Outstanding' school, this is fairly typical and not limited to cover supervisors, it happens in plenty of standard teacher's Classes too. We have two levels too, proper subs, rare and covered supervisors in £12.25 er hour.
My kids are extremely well behaved, I think they've had three ready to learn warnings between them and they're years 9 and 11.
But there is a core, and it's growing, if very disruptive children. What this means is a huge disparity in their grades between subjects which are steamed. Or the harder/selective choice subjects.
They start their choices in year 9 not year 10, my son has gone from strong to outstanding in his grades.
This unruly and often toxic behaviour is having an enormous impact.

I know someone who is earning £13 an hour working in a coffee shop. I know which I would prefer.

Depends what type of school you were in and the nature of the catchment area.
In mid-1970s I did a final teaching practice in Year 6 in a tough inner city primary school. I was mentored by a very wonderful class teacher (gay man in his mid/late-fifties). He had returned to teaching, after a substantial sick-leave due to nervous breakdown brought on by pupils throwing milk-bottles at him in the playground (probably the last straw. Sorry.).

I don't know how he had the guts to return, but he did.

He taught me a lot. He was one of the unsung heroes. Looking back 50+yrs, my heart still warms when I think of him.
Only to say: pupil behaviour could be, and was, awful in the '50s, '60s,'70s. There were no 'good old days' when all pupils kowtowed to good disciplinarians.
(For example, in that particular school, during Assembly, the (male) HT would walk up and down between rows of children standing to recite aloud The Lords Prayer, and he would randomly cuff them round the head. In Assembly. While they were praying. Honestly! It didn't improve behaviour. Obviously, they hated him.)
Actually, as far as my experience reaches (from 1950 as a pupil till early 2000s as a teacher) there is always a core of "troublesomes" and whether SLT / HT have the backbone to deal with it effectively is a matter of happenstance, luck, commitment and talent, and backup from school governors & LEAs. I'm not sanguine about support for teachers in Academy school-chains - that's a 'for profit' model, so God knows what goes on there.

I hope you are ok O.P.

It's in a slightly similar vein but I ended up shouting at a child earlier (I had been pushed to the end of my tether) and the headteacher was standing behind me. She was understanding to me but I have felt so stressed and now upset about it all.

People have no idea what us teachers have to deal with. I even have a colleague who regularly jokes about hoping she will be sacked as she can't take it anymore. I am primary.

Offering solidarity and understanding. All us teachers are behind you.

This is awful OP.
My teen told me that they had a sub to cover a class. A small minority of the class were really misbehaved with the sub. DC said the sub looked like she was going to cry. At the end of the class, my teen and a few of the others went to the teacher and apologised for the other's behaviour.

Its a strict school and I was disappointed to hear it had happened. I know if my DC was involved, I would want to know.

Literally the hardest role. I’m not surprised you’ve had enough. I say this as a exteacher.

personally unless you want out I would do bare minimum. You will be paid the bare minimum. On call every single episode. Do not put up with shit behaviour. Move awful kids to back. Sit nice kids at the front and just teach the ones that want to be taught. No progress figures are going against your name. Have a lovely time with the lovely kids. I honestly take my hat off to you