Being asked to get to work before start time

[TooBored1]

I'm being asked to get to work earlier than my start time, to set up for the day. Is this legal?

I'm salaried, with set working hours, eg 8.30 to 4.30 with 30 mins for lunch. I work physically in an office.

We hot desk and, at our managers insistance, have to take our laptops home every night.

Our line manager is expecting us to arrive at 8.15 every day, to set up desk, turn laptop on etc before 8.30. This isn't about taking off coats/putting lunch in fridge/ making coffee, literally about physically setting up for work

And ditto re going home. We should pack up our desk in our own time.

Does anyone else's boss make them do this?

I worked in a dept with a guy like that. Used to come in and clock on go to the loo (for a while) and spend 10 minutes in the kitchen making breakfast, chatting and generally taking the piss. He used to leave bang on 4pm every single day. His (female) manager was totally ineffectual and intimidated by him and refused to deal with it. Poor management is an epidemic in this country.

I think what the ‘it’s normal’ people on thread fail to recognise is that setting up your equipment is work. If it’s a requirement of the job and therefore it should be paid time. Getting a cup of tea beforehand is not. But having to set up, and take down the laptop everyday - even if it adds up to 10 mins - is almost an hour of unpaid labour a week the company is getting.

The mindless idiots who don’t question this work practice are the reason employers get away with exploiting people and their time which is unethical and poor management.

Mine can take 40 mins, it took 5 reboots today, I’m getting a new one. 🤣

I agree with this, they need to have their own systems ready for operation, so need to pay more, for more hours.
I don’t imagine the bosses on their £4m pay, arrive early to set up

Had this in a department I worked in.

Reception desk opened at 08.45, and that was when staffs hours started.

Now most, without really thinking, came in at 08.30, switched their PC's on, stocked up any leaflet holders, made a drink etc. ready to put the shutters up at 08.45 .

A couple of new starters joined, and would arrive at 08.45 and start doing that stuff, with shutters opening at 08.50 -08.55 , or one of the old schoolers getting annoyed as they were on their own for the first 10 minutes ( often a couple of people waiting).

I think it went all the way to the union as technically the new starters were right. Their hours were 08.45..not their fault that it coincided with opening time so it left no morning prep time.

The bosses were not happy, and couldn't see to open up and be ready to serve the customer , they needed an hour and 15 mins unpaid work from staff. It was the same in reverse at the end of the day.

There's always an answer though, and they reluctantly moved the opening time to 09.00.

' contact hours' or ' opening hours' in a job should never be the same as your contracted hours . It just doesn't work. There should always be a 15 mins start up and shut down either side of the contact hours. I think they do that at call centres now.

You should be sat at your desk ready to work at 8.30 not just walking through the door at that time and putting food in the fridge, taking off your coat and making a coffee etc.

In my example I did manage the one person because no one else was taking the piss - we had a large team and that meant a range of humans who all had different preferences - those who liked being in 15-20 mins early to ‘get settled’ or do their makeup at work, those who slid into their seats bang on time, and those who were occasionally 5 mins late etc.

All evened out with no issues apart from Mr 30 mins. He was also out of the door the second the shift was over so was clearly logging off and packing up early.

But in the OPs case perhaps there’s wider issue - as they’ve been very specific with the time 15 minutes might be being lost across several people - and as PP have pointed out it really shouldn’t take that long to get set up and log in.

Although I don’t understand why the mouse and keyboard can’t stay on the desk for the next person - seems like an unnecessary extra step.

I used to work as a receptionist 9/5 but was expected to be on the desk for 8.45 pc booted up, visitor list printed etc ready for when the clinic opened at 9.00. Really does all depend on your line of work, but it doesn't take 15 mins to turn on a laptop and plug in, 5 mins max.

You should start work at 8.30, which means, setting your desk up and turning computer on at 8.30, not 8.15 or 8.40. Same at the end of the day. Switch computer off at 4.30, slip it in your bag and leave.
To start work at 8.30 you need to determine when you need to arrive at work not your manager.

I think it’s fair to be ready to start at 8.30 on the dot, however, I’d be therefore reversing that and ready to log off bang on finish time. I can’t imagine anyone starts bang on time (bar my vet/dentist, but even then I guess they get in before the official opening times of the phone lines in order to make coffee/take off coats etc.

Can you suggest a better way of them setting up the office?

This is very normal in my experience...you are ready to start working at the given time. So I'd go in 15 mins early or whatever, turn on computer, head to kitchen, make coffee, lunch in the fridge, go to the loo, say morning to people, back to desk for 0825 say, faff around putting stuff away, getting various things open on computer and start working around 0830. Unofficial but absolutely the norm.

If we were walking into the office at our start time, we would be starting late surely?

It takes me less than two minutes to take my laptop out of my rucksack, switch it on and log on. I would expect to be ready to start work at 8.30 if that was my start time.

No they can’t expect you to come in early. Time for devices to boot up is a paid activity. TUC have guidance on it.

I dont think it's wrong for your manager to expect you in prior to your start time and ready to get to work at 8.30, but it doesn't take 15 minutes to do this! Have people been bad for turning up late or taking their sweet time in getting coat off, coffee made, laptop booted up?
I used to work with a guy who would leave home at his start time, thought his commute counted as his day at work, I mean, who even?!

I used to work for a company like this. You had to be at your desk, head down and working at 9am, even a minute over and I got a bollocking for being late, insufficiently committed to my job etc, despite the fact that I was a lowly admin support earning fuck all AND I often ended up taking work home in the evening sometimes because the workload was very heavy at certain times of the month (sales dept).

I took great pleasure in telling her to shove her job in the end and since then I've only ever worked in roles where my managers couldn't give a toss what time I start as long as a) I'm not taking the proverbial and b) I'm getting the work done. I'm a manager now and I wouldn't dream of clock watching people who work for me unless there's a blatant problem, it's piss poor people management.

When I was going in the office, my start time would be from getting in through the door. Any activity after that was on work's time and recorded as such. I wouldn't be expected to turn up earlier just to turn on the laptop.

Think some pp haven’t read the OP’s posts: she has to get everything out of a box in a central area, lug it all to a desk, plug in mouse etc, plug in and boot up her laptop. It’s not about taking her sweet time to take off her coat etc.

For a fortnight I would agree amongst yourselves that you all finish on the dot at the end time. If work doesn’t get done so be it. When management pull you up on it then you can point out that this thing swings both ways.

Some people do take the piss where it comes to what are working hours.

Our boss was pretty lienent and this reminds me of my early working days where you had to clock in/out, working hours were 8-5...given 10 minutes grace but once past 8.10, unless a valid reason you'd lose wages to match time for being late which workers would complain about yet those same workers would have cleaned their work stations down and be queuing at the clock ready to clock off before 5pm.

In my old office job I would get there at 5 to my start time, turn my laptop on and login in and answer my first call at 9. Which was my start time. 15 minutes a day is far too much-it’s an extra hour and a quarter on your working week unpaid which they can’t enforce. And is not needed unless your tech is rubbish.

Stop any and all overtime of any kind.
Two can play that game.

Good grief! Your employer is anal about hot-desking. We just leave the keyboards and mice on the desk at the end of the day and the next person will use them. Sometimes there is even personal stuff on a desk. Nobody cares. If it's in the way, you just move it over.

I can only see the issue with paperwork. If it has sensitive information on it, it should be locked away.

I wouldn't say 15 mins but absolutely, yes. At your desk, ready to go on the dot of start time. No waiting for your computer to warm up or find a pen, but at the start line, good to go.

Agreed - setting up isn't my hobby, so I expect to be paid for it.

I used to be the first person into my office - unlocked, switched off the alarms, etc. I did an extra 10m every day, and everyone else just arrived and started work.

I didn't mind, but I was fucking fuming about the fact that I wanted to leave promptly, because if I missed the 5.37 train, the 5.50 was always late and I'd lose an hour of evening. But my boss would note me doing a rapid shutdown and ask me "just one thing" as I left the door, as a little punctilious reminder that I shouldn't be whizzing off on the dot.

Those little things can add up in a bad culture.

This is incorrect if looked at for national minimum wage purposes. Any time you are required to be at work, eg to set up your workstation, counts as working time. There is an example with these facts in the HMRC guidance:

Example scenario
You employ a 30-year old worker to work on the shop floor for 7.5 hours per day, 5 days a week.
However, you also ask the worker to come to a 1-hour team meeting once a week, and to come in 30 minutes early each day to prepare for the shift ahead.

This all counts as working time per minimum wage rules, so the workers minimum wage pay is based on this.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/calculating-the-minimum-wage/working-hours-for-which-the-minimum-wage-must-be-paid