slow quiet one, and the micromanager

[snoopsy]

I manage a large team, all remote. We have a new admin person who hasn't been with us long (7 weeks). The new admin is pleasant, but has a very quiet personality. I have done some of her training and she is slow and methodical. The manager who manages the admin is a hard-worker but known to be difficult - likes control, gives little leeway on methods used - its her way or nothing, expects people to operate at 100% all the time etc. calls people outside of working hours (I have put a stop to this one).

The previous admin only lasted 8 months before handing in their notice as they felt the pace the manager was setting was too fast, and there was too much to juggle. As a result, I simplified some processes, and automated others to make the workload more manageable and less hectic. I removed a small area of responsibility too so I am confident the job spec is do-able.

I wonder if the admin potentially has some health issues which means she's having to go to the bathroom. She has mentioned some auto-immune/allergy issues, but has not been specific. I am thinking a side-effect of her health issues may be IBS or a more serious digestive issue, but this is me guessing. We are all remote so its difficult to know what people are doing.

I suppose I have 2 questions:
I have no problem with the admin being methodical, but she is taking nearly 3 hours to do a 30-45 minute admin task that I know she can do competently. After 7 weeks I know she has mastered how to do it as I have done some of her training. I need to work out if the admin a) has health issues she is too shy to disclose, or b) is actually this slow, or c) is doing something else with her time.

If during those 3 hours she was in the bathroom for some time then I don't mind, but I do need to know. There are ways to work around her health issues as we are all remote, but I can't put anything in place unless I know. I have a reputation for being kind and understanding (or so I am told). How do I approach this? I do not want to say "it took you 3 hours to do this. what's the problem?" It would come across that I am monitoring her, which is wrong.

The second issue is how I deal with the "difficult" manager. Their manager skills only work with the kind of employee who works like a robot and has perfect attention to detail. I need to speak to this person about how we onboard new people and make sure we are doing everything possible to help them learn their job. The manager has talked about "testing" the new admin (eg setting them up to fail) and won't entertain the idea that there could be another issue. They are convinced this person is doing something else with their time (eg watching TV). They are frustrated and don't have the patience to realise that after 7 weeks, if its not working they need to employ different methods to solve the problem of slowness (a shared things to do list, for example) before we judge or jump to conclusions.

I think you are trying too hard to be nice rather than admit she's not up to speed .
You are speculating she has a medical condition that's affecting her output .
You need to step up as a manager and tell her the timeframe for doing the tasks . You aren't helping her by not telling her she needs to speed up and offer her extra support and training if necessary.
This isn't micromanaging its managing.

after working closely with the admin girl today. her data entry is very poor and she is taking short-cuts. she is not double-checking any numbers. she's not referring to the instruction documents. her cuting and pasting is not accurate. she doesn't want to take the time to check

No matter how long she might be spending on the loo, there's absolutely no excuse for the above. You're employing her to do a job and she's being very sloppy with her work. I'd say she needs to go.

You can't assume she's on the loo anyway - she's said absolutely nothing to indicate this. You'll probably never know what's going on - she might have a small child at home that she's trying to care for while she works, or an elderly parent, or an unemployed partner. She's only a few weeks in and isn't suited to the job. If she was doing only a few tasks but they were perfect, then it might be OK to ask about health issues, but she's not performing those few tasks well.

Perhaps she's miserable in the job?

The other manager is very brusque and wants everyone to work at a million miles per hour. You are watching her like a hawk. The other admin left after 8 months. She said it was the other manager but it's highly likely it was both of you.

It doesn't sound great. What is she earning, just above minimum wage I guess?

You will get loads of applicants for admin jobs and 90% of them will be bloody useless. If you want a decent admin person then offer decent money.

So weird. Why do u think she’s in the bathroom? lol. Maybe since it’s remote it just takes longer to upskill? As long as she’s doing her job who cares

Oh if she’s doing a crap job maybe get someone else in. If you pay a decent salary you will hopefully get someone with a higher IQ.

A couple of things strike me here.

One is that she should have disclosed anything medical that will affect her work when she was recruited. I agree that it can be problematic in many companies and that people can be reluctant to, but I think you have to assume that she doesn't have a medical reason until and unless she tells you that she does.

The other is that it sounds like time for a suitability chat/review. Give her advanced notice and tell her what you'd like her to think about beforehand.

You ask her how she feels she is settling in to the role. You tell her that you've noticed that she isn't always following the 15 step process for processing microwave meals, and that this is a problem for the serving staff in the next team. You note that she listed attention to detail on her application and in the interview, and spell out for her that she is not currently performing at the level required. Point out that you want to see her succeed, for her sake as well as the company's, and ask what would be helpful help to get her to where she needs to be.

Point out that she's also taking longer than you expect a task to take. Ask her to explain why she things she is taking longer, and what she suggests she changes in order for it to be done in X time as well as with all the steps done.

If she can't really answer, ask her to go away and consider if this is really the best fit job for her.

read the whole post. she earns well for the level. I have invariably been told I should be watching her like a hawk, and now that I shouldn't be watching her like a hawk. this place is full of people with too little time to read things properly and took much time to judge incorrectly.
I am not doing either. I am supporting her and recognising that ultimately I am responsible for how well she integrates. I manage her manager. after 7 weeks her manager has come to me to ask for help. that is the correct thing to do. If I have to let her go, I need to make sure I have done everything possible to help her get up to speed first. if her manager is indeed being harsh, its also my responsibility to check this and do something about it.

if you read the post properly there are some things that she has said about medical conditions and previous surgery, not necessarily ones that need to be declared to HR. There are some very visible signs that suggest health problems. I can't go into more detail.

Anyway, there is a major update. she'd like next week to be her last week. she realises she's not up to the job.
on that note, I'd like to formally offer the position to @nootcoffee . I think you sound like a really happy and stable person. when I read your posts I realise you're the type of person who has no bitterness towards life at all. moreover you come across as a great team player. and you're really good with wording things nicely. I reckon you're really competent because you seem to know sooo much about everything. you're not judgemental at all... so I think you'd be the perfect fit.

good grief the very thought of being in this shit show of a team leaves me trembling!

The new recruit has seen sense! and good in her!

Go on Op… go out on a bang and share another analogy like your cracker of a microwave one

For those you have just joined… scroll up to read the very long microwave analogy post. It’s a gift 😆

I’m too kind

Seriously this microwave analogy is just beautiful!

Either management is the problem

or

Recruitment is the problem

You are being extremely weird on this thread, nootcoffee

😆

🧦

After reading the thread it sounds like a management problem to me. First line manager needs tackling, massively.

As the saying goes, (I think it’s a saying I might of made it up!) you don’t leave a job you leave a manager! (Sometimes, sometimes it’s both!)

OP, I manage a remote team of 15. It is challenging and you sound like a LOVELY manager.

Your problem here is twofold.

The micromanager needs to take active accountability for the turnover issues. It is hideously costly to keep rehiring, re onboarding, retraining. This person is obviously highly effective but not great at shared responsibility. You need to have a hard conversation with outcomes tied to staff retention and job satisfaction.

Your hiring process is not taking account of the soft KPIs of an admin working for a demanding manager.

We resolved this with a three day paid on the job interview. All new starters do this, we pay handsomely for their time. It has reduced attrition rates to zero for the past 6 months.

Personally, after investing 7 weeks into another leaver, I would sit down with this person and have a completely frank conversation about what has made them so unhappy. It's possible that with some small tweaks you could turn it around.

You sound empathetic and caring, hope you work it out.

Step away. You are being a tad over zealous and a bit over invested on this thread. One thing to disagree on a thread but not cool to requote and ridicule.

she had loads of extra support and training. Its all there in the posts. you just needed to read them.

Seems a common denominator you don't know how to manage your new starter and you don't know how to manage the micro manager .

@snoopsy cant believe the aggression on this thread.

you sound perfectly reasonable and the microwave analogy explains it really well 🤷‍♀️

This new hire sounds way out of her depth. But I’d definitely do an exit interview with her ( perhaps face to face) to get to the bottom of why people keep leaving. It might be LM or maybe the job is too difficult for the level it’s been pitched at?

Who was responsible for recruiting her? Who interviewed her?

Someone faffed up

First person lasted eight months.

Second person lasted seven weeks.

Sounds like they both had a lucky escape based on your responses to the people on this thread.