What can I do about this young woman I manage?

[Linedbook]

Actually she's not that young (40s), but she looks young, dresses young and behaves young- much as I hate the descriptor, she's girly and she sits crossed legged on her chair, as in like a child sitting on the floor

I was told by the (female) CEO that she'd be a problem, shes spend all her time flirting and fluttering her eyelashes. CEO is a very no-nonsense woman who abhors this behaviour and I'm not a fan myself. My predecessor was a man, who according to the CEO "fell for it".

Anyway he told me she's brilliant. CEO is not a fan. I have found her to be brilliant, hard working and full of great ideas. One of those people where you just have to say "it would be good if...." and it's done. She doesn't flirt with me, but is respectful, helpful and supportive.

She's also really good at people, which is where the flirting comes in, she can a absolutely pick the men who will be susceptible and get them to do anything. I'd guess she's done the same with me, the reason for her entirely different approach.

It is annoying though and my boss hates it.

So, do I try to manage her and make it stop, or leave her to get on with what she does so well?

Just tell the CEO if it gets the job done you're not really bothered by her 'methods'. Emphasise that she's an asset to the team and you wouldn't be without her.

Have her back, because the CEO is obviously gunning for her.

I do too, if it didn't have arms I would do full cross legged.

Actually if you want to use the "if she were a man" argument, which is very rarely relevant, I think it could probably be considered sexual harassment. It would certainly be inappropriate office behaviour.

she finds the girliness and flirting annoying and unprofessional. I think it offends her feminist principles

"Girliness", eh? Sounds like a CEO problem to me (though I appreciate you are now firmly caught in the middle).

Time for a frank discussion with the CEO. What would she have you do if this employee is not violating any company guidelines and is performing her job exceptionally well? CEO should probably tread carefully.

Keeps identifying that what is a problem? If this woman doesn't say anything inappropriate, then giggling and using eye contact are perfectly fine. I think it would be ridiculous if a line manager complained about that.

It sounds like the CEO's problem.

I would talk to the CEO and leave her in no doubt that you think she is genuinely that good.

And talk to the woman about being aware that the way she flirts with men may get good results, but it can alienate people around her. Don’t spell out that it’s the CEO, but if she’s that good at reading people she’ll figure it out. Encourage her to develop her interpersonal skills to take that in to account.

And if she’s crossing the line to inappropriate, then it is absolutely right to bring that up with her.

If she's as good as you say ignore the CEO.

Just because she doesn't like girlie types isn't a good enough reason to start looking for fault. If she's good at her job, has a good relationship with others, and isn't doing anything against company policy stay well out of it.

The CEO, your boss, is jealous of her. Don’t get involved in this insecurity.

She’s hitting targets, doing her job and not bothering anyone. Your CEO is embarrassing herself.

That sounds like a CEO problem to me, if the member of staff wants to be girly and ‘unfeminist’ that is up to her.

Respect to her for that!

If she's doing a good job, you really can't ask her to change her normal behavior, it doesn't sound inappropriate. how would it be if it was a man who was seemingly being flirty? being a feminist doesn't mean you have to behave a specific way.

Can you give some examples of the flirting? I've looked at your updates and so far can only see "looking up through eyelashes" which isn't exactly gross misconduct.

Has she said or done anything that could be inappropriate? If so then you need to speak with her about these behaviours not being appropriate in your workplace. If she hasn't actually done or said anything inappropriate or that could be reasonably construed as inappropriate then sounds like it's just personality / choice of make up & clothing.

She's probably behaving this way because she's found it works and no one has pulled her up on it.

How exactly is she flirting if you think it could be categorised as sexual harassment?? What is she saying or doing to these senior men?

I guess it depends on the culture of the organisation. Where I work it would very much matter if flirting was used to achieve objectives as it doesn't fit the restorative 'adult to adult' communication style that we're committed to in all of our policies abd frameworks. I'd also be worried about what is modelling to more junior members of staff.

I'd have a reflective conversation with her about it, say that you have recieved some feedback about how she relates to others (particularly men), does she recognise that in herself? Is there anything about her communication style that she would like to improve on?

I'd be interested to unpack whether she is actually being 'flirty' or is she just being feminine which your CEO has internalised as 'bad'? In which case you need to get your ducks in a row and communicate that upwards.

Being girly and being feminist aren't mutually exclusive. The way you describe her as young and sitting cross legged is actually quite telling about how you see her, regardless of how you say she is amazing. Is what she is doing actually sexual harassment? Has anyone complained of being subject to sexual harassment from her? If not, then it sounds very much like your CEO is the problem and clearly has some issues to work out herself.

It's the kind of "banter" that some men can get away with and is sleazy from others. Massaging egos. Comments on their appearance etc Nothing terrible but I would take exception to any many trying to manipulate me like that.

I do think it's different when roles are reversed though

Good for her. She’s obviously not doing too badly.

No one's saying it's gross misconduct, more that it doesn't present the professional image the CEO wants for the business.

Women do love to tear down other women in the workplace, don't they? Your CEO sounds like a right charmer.

I agree she sounds fabulous at her job, which is the main thing, but if she was my direct report, I’d be spending some time coaching her so she is aware of how to leverage her obvious skills and charisma for different audiences. She sounds as though she could develop further if she were able to adapt her style a bit. I know many people will say ‘why should she’ but that’s not realistic- we all adapt our behaviour to the circumstances.
She clearly deserves praise and nurturing for all the great work she does, but having credibility is part of that and if she’s clever, it will serve her in the long run.

Everything I said, including the crossed legs, is what the CEO has brought to me.

No, no one has complained of sexual harassment, I didn't say it was. I was asked how it would be perceived if roles were reversed and I do think, if she were a man she might be perceived as a bit sleazy. But she's not.

It sounds from your description that the CEO dislikes her...and she may well be annoying but that in itself isn't something to address. She might flatter people and play up the persuasive eye fluttering but if she is not dressing inappropriately or making inappropriate comments then it's not flirting. I mean does she just act a bit helpless to get men to help her or does she say flirtatious things like making comments about their appearance or innuendos? If none of the latter then I would probably just reiterate to the CEO that she is doing her job well and that unless the CEO can pinpoint some specific inappropriate behaviour e.g. solicitous comments, a breach of the dress code or a harassment complaint then there is very little you can do.

I do think like others the CEO is the issue here - you say the CEO is a feminist, but has a problem with someone who is stereotypically "girly"? The staff member sounds like they're really good at their job, dressing / looking young / being girl is such a ridiculous thing to dislike someone for, your CEO needs to lose the chip on her shoulder - it takes all types of people to make a company great, diversity of workforce leads to better work being done!

The "flirting" thing seems odd - if you say it's "banter" and her looking through her eyelashes seems like hardly the worst crimes, if someone is uncomfortable with how she relates to them, that is different. Having soft skills and being able to relate and talk to different people is a great skill in an employee!

Your CEO needs to bring other problems to you than someone's appearance / sitting preferences, she honestly sounds like the sort of person who's got a lot of internalised issues if that is what she's picking up on.

It sounds like you could ask her not to make comments on people's appearance, but this would have to be inline with a general expectation across the business.

But agai only if inappropriate eg; "Ooh, the site of your arse in those jeans Barry, I want to grab it"
Not just, "nice jeans Barry, are they new?"

I would expect a CEO to know that unless they can clearly identify specific behaviours that can be objectively determined as unprofessional, then they would get torn apart at an employment tribunal.

You can't say 'stop flirting' as it's subjective and not specific enough.
I'm struggling to even think of specific behaviours you could call out.

Let's take another example:
Employee A keeps distracting employee B
If its disruptive to the point that you need to keep having a word, to the point where its actually detrimental to performance and therefore needs to be officially challenged, it would need to be specific.
You can't say 'stop distracting B'
It would need to be 'can you stop approaching B with non work related chat outside of break times' or 'can you stop talking out loud to yourself, it's distracting B'

Whereas you can't say 'stop flirting' as you'd need to define what specific behaviour is flirting and how that's unreasonable for this individual to do with certain people. Can't say 'don't laugh at people's jokes' for example really can you!

I really feel for you, this is a tricky one!