How do I negotiate my way out of this job well?

[BlinketyBlonk]

i’m in a situation where my boss wants me to leave and I want to leave. How do I work out some kind of amicable settlement rather than a horrible mess?

Background is I have been in the role about 18 months. It’s a major misfit with my skills, and I’d be the first to admit I have been dropping the ball left right and centre. I’m recently diagnosed with ADHD (which they know) and with anxiety and depression (which they don’t) and I’ve found it incredibly hard.

I’ve got a meeting with HR next week which is supposed to be putting me onto a PIP. I really don’t want to drag this out - I think we all know it’s pointless and it’s a more fundamental mismatch between me and the role.

I think my ideal situation would for us to mutually agree an amicable parting of ways now, be able to work part of my notice so I can leave my team in a good place, and be paid for the remainder. The sector I work in is quite a small world so I don’t want to leave under a cloud or screwing up my future employment prospects.

Anyone got any advice on how to approach this.

I would expect that any compromise agreement would probably want to pay you less than your full notice. They would most likely offer 3 or 4 months pay for you to leave now.

They hold all the cards here as your reference will show start date, end date, and reason for leaving. In most scenarios I can see here, the reason for leaving would be poor performance unless both parties agree to something else in any compromise agreement.

Your only other option is to resign now, where resignation is then your reason for leaving. You may have to work your notice in this instance though.

I’m slightly confused here OP. Why can’t you just hand your notice in and leave if that’s your desired outcome? get a fit note to cover your notice period so you don’t need to return?

What difference does it make for them to “negotiate” the same thing? They won’t hold you in any higher esteem, ie they won’t look more favourably on you.

I think the OP wants to leave immediately and not work notice, but still be paid for it. Essentially cake and eat it.

They hold all the cards here as your reference will show start date, end date, and reason for leaving

Modern references don't normally include "reason for leaving" - that would be of zero advantage to someone leaving a role under a cloud and trying to secure new employment, nor would it be of any benefit to the former employer to disclose that. The whole point of a bland, non- commital reference is that it's very factual (dates of employment, role title) and means there's a clean break to both sides with no contention.

if the OP wants to extricate themselves from this employment situation in the least painful way, they should have an open conversation with the employer about a mutually acceptable (shorter) notice period with a basic reference. Make sure they pay for any unused annual leave accrued to the negotiated leave date.

Getting into the vagaries of a settlement agreement is totally inappropriate and will get their employers' back up, when the employee has clearly not performed well in their role, nor have they met the 2 year employment rights threshold.

Cutting one's losses, get released earlier than the employment contract states and move on, in this situation, is the most pragmatic approach. Start applying for new roles now, to get ahead of the game. Anything else is delusional.

Between 2020 and the end of 2022, I employed several hundred people. Every single one has start date, end date, and reason for leaving in the reference provided by previous employer.

As the gaining employer, the reason for leaving their previous post is very important.

I’m getting the cake and eat it impression too, but surely handing notice in and getting a fit note for that period will be the same end result? Leaving role, not working notice, but getting paid for it. I suppose it depends on sickness policy.

I don’t think reasons for leaving are the be all and end all though. No one wants to hire a dumpster fire, but you genuinely don’t know if it was the employer that was the problem or the employee.

EG say a spouse cheated on their partner and they broke up. If you asked the faithful one why they left, it seems reasonable. If you asked the unfaithful one why the other left, they’d potentially paint another picture which frames them in a better light.

switch the spouses to employer/employee and you’ll surely see a conflict of interest. Plus I’ve managed absolutely awful people and would give them a normal reference to get them out of the door faster! What’s the point in me declaring they have performance issues and they get rejected from a new job, when I can get them out of my hair?

As a manager I'd probably be pissed off that you haven't been good in the job and now you want a 6 month pay out too

why? A settlement is ultimate a low effort, low risk approach, to parting ways with someone who hasn’t done anything wrong beyond ending up in a role that’s a poor fit.

Given the OPs recent diagnosis, minimising risk of litigation should be front and centre for the employer. It’s in no one’s interests to draw out what could be an amicable solution.

That said it really depends on the culture of your organisation and settlements (like sign- ons and LTIs) are commonplace in my place of work, threads like this remind me that isn’t the case everywhere.

If your performance is poor and there's no specific reason for that other than a mismatched skillset it'll depend on your contract terms.

Depending on your role, seniority and sector a swift, agreed amicable parting of the ways may be the best you can do. Any financial arrangement is likely to be minimal.

switch the spouses to employer/employee and you’ll surely see a conflict of interest. Plus I’ve managed absolutely awful people and would give them a normal reference to get them out of the door faster! What’s the point in me declaring they have performance issues and they get rejected from a new job, when I can get them out of my hair?

exactly, and despite @HappiestSleeping being highly confident that "hundreds" of people they employed all had "reason for leaving" on their references, which I highly doubt, it isnt normal practice nowadays. The more bland the better, because most HR departments have recognise it can open a whole can of worms to getting into the detail in a reference that could be the subject of a dispute, when they just want rid of the problem with least come-back and repercussions incl admin burden.

You’re under two years and there’s already evidence of the under-performing. If you drag it out to PIP you’re putting yourself in a silly position because you will end up leaving and they could reference capability to other employers. It’s very difficult to get discrimination awards and in your situation you’ve already got poor performance. You’re trying to be grabby, IMO. I would simply offer that you leave now and claim half the notice, or you can stay and drag out the pip to everyone’s determinant.

voluntarily putting yourself on a PIP is certain a novel approach! A cross between self-flagilation and turkeys voting for Christmas.

A pertinent question for moving forward, is how you ended up in a role so mismatched to your skills?
Was there supposed to be additional training that hasn’t materialised? Did the role change between you accepting the job and starting it? Did you get offered a different role to the one you interviewed for? Gently, was there some embellishment on your CV? How did you pass your probation period if you had one?
The answer to the above should be a guide to what you now do. You need to also look in detail at your contract - if you’re to be put on a PIP, does that impact the terms of your notice period/payment in lieu? Can it trigger a clause where you can be let go without notice? Is there an exclusion clause where you will have to “not work in the industry” for a while after this role ends?
In your managers shoes, if I had an employee underperforming and wanting to leave then I’d prefer them to just resign instead of going through the motions and paperwork of a PIP, knowing they were still intent on leaving.

If your contract is definitely 6 months notice both ways (this seems unlikely, especially if you're only a few months in to the role - have you passed probation? Is there a shorter notice period before passing probation?) then best thing is to hand in your notice now.

Most likely they will then come up with an offer to reduce the notice period if you're not adding value.

So, get it straight in your head what you're happy to accept. 6 months pay, bonus, pension, accrued holiday pay? If it's renewed as a settlement agreement I think it is also tax free (check with an employment solicitor as you'll need a solicitor to check any settlement agreement anyway). That would either give you a little more in your account or a bit of leeway on there actual figure you'd accept.

Worst case, they have you work your full notice period. Do the absolute bare minimum, don't stress, knowing you've done everything you can and it's their choice to keep you there.

Also it sounds like there may have been some bullying or other negative situation. Please take some time to look after yourself, don't let a bad job/toxic environment/bad fit impact your confidence for doing what you ARE a good fit for. And try to let go of any resentment/bad feeling, look at it as a good chance to reframe for the next steps.

Correct

I recommend thinking about what a man would do in this situation. Then do that!

Let's remember notice periods are there for a reason. If you want to exit someone because they're not got, and there is no misconduct, then you end the contract on capability/ performance and pay their notice.

It makes little sense to keep a poor performing employee in the business working that notice, so you pay them a lump sum and be done with it.

In this case going through a pip is timely for everyone and not likely going to lead to a positive outcome by the Ops own admittance. So a compromise agreement is a productive way forward.

6 months notice is crazy

In the UK, it is unlikely that a reference would be sought from a prior employer until an offer has been made which would be subject to references. I get what you mean about references not being the be all and end all, but the individual would usually be past the point of no return by the time references come in, and so would already be out of your hair so to speak.

That is why having decent references is such an important thing as a person could have started their new job and then be let go due to bad references.

You may believe as you like, however I know what I saw. Start date x, end date y, job title z, reason for leaving resigned / redundancy / dismissed. In every single instance.

You are correct that it is more bland than it used to be which is why it is reduced to the above which is short, factual and indisputable.

I don't know whether it's been said but if you do go request a mutual non disclosure agreement.

@Growingoutthegrey - I passed probation, and notice on both sides jumped up to 6 months at that point. It is a slightly absurd amount of notice and cost me an opportunity to move to a much better fitting job (they said it was between me and another candidate and the went with one who could start much faster).

Thanks for kind words too - I’ve found this very tough going mentally. Normally when I leave a job the conversation has been about what they can offer to keep me, not what they can offer to get rid of me!

Yeah I’m kind of ignoring the “being grabby” and “wanting my cake an eating it comments”. I don’t want to be a twat about it, I just want to understand what’s a reasonable expectation for an arrangement that’s better for all than going through the rigmarole of managing me out.

Been through a very similar situation, and the best advice i got was to look at the payout as a step into a better chapter, rather than feeling the failure I did. If they passed your probation it really is on them if the job isn't right for you!

Best thing you can do is simply resign, advise in line with your contract your leaving date will be 6 months from notice given and thank them for the opportunity blah blah blah.

Just be ready with what (if anything) you're willing to accept if if they want to negotiate on the notice period. That's where you need to think like a man.

Also, you'll find they rethink their ridiculous contracts for future employees!

Taking all emotion out of it, there's a legally binding contract that both sizes have signed. Unless you both agree to deviate from that, stick to it.