Gross misconduct dismissal

[whatsthisforGodsake]

I am wondering if there is anyone here who can shed light on how to manage/deal with the impacts (financial & emotional) of gross misconduct dismissal at work pls.

It was a case of working for 2 firms who are competitors & they both found out.

Hi, that sounds like a tough situation. CAB or turn to us are good to talk to around accessing any benefits to help until you are next employed. Emotionally there are some really great helplines about. Shout, samaritans etc if you need to tall about it and help with emotions.
I guess in some level you would have known this could happen? Or was it a shock and you thought you could work for both?

Did you know you couldn’t work for both at the same time? Did you not read your contract?

Not sure there is any specific “support”

I think the first thing is for you to be honest with yourself about whether you knew you were in breach of your contract or not?

If you did know, you need to work out why you took this risk.

If you didn't know, you need to think about why you didn't know, because you ended up putting yourself at risk.

Emotionally, losing your job in this way is hard to take. I'd recommend you try to get back into the workplace as soon as you can. Are you struggling financially? You can apply for benefits but sadly they are very low.

If you have feelings that are hard to process, do call Samaritans. Take care

I think you need to take some time to lick your wounds then dust yourself and start applying for jobs.

You are going to have to be a bit reflective in thinking how this occurred and how to stop it happening again as your next employer will want to know what strategies you have put in place to ensure this doesn’t happen again.

From a practical point of view how did you work at two firms? Was it part time or self employed?

I presume this relates to the query? https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/work/4949988-hr-personnel

You can resign op. From both jobs. They are clearly going to both fire you. I can’t imagine what you were thinking working for two competitors, if you needed a second job, then a non competitor was the way forward.

for gross misconduct they can pay you for only what you’ve worked and any leave etc due.they don’t need to do notice.

It has already happened, if this is the same poster. And working for two employers simultaneously will always get you dismissed for gross misconduct, competitors or not.

Oh I see, she’s already been fired from both?

op, what do you mean impacts then, do you mean in terms of trying to find another job?

It depends on what your references say from both places and how small an industry it is.

I work for two employers (not competitors)

It's totally fine. I work part time for both.

Permission is the key thing here, if you need two jobs for whatever reason then be upfront with the ‘main’ employer (or the job you get first). I employed someone who’s family ran a business that they worked for in the evenings and some weekends, they were totally upfront about it, confident they could manage both and there was no conflict of interest so we agreed to trial it for 6 months.
The issue here is that you were not honest and have been caught out. I’d suggest being totally honest in all future interviews and employment as the truth has a way of coming out. Good luck

I work in education and have worked at a competing school in my (unpaid) summer holidays doing the same role. I did get permission from my main employer as stipulated in my contract.

Assuming this is the same poster that posted the issue recently, I think you are all mostly missing the point. That poster wasn't working two jobs for different employers, at different times - which yes, is ok provioded neither emp[loyer has contractual terms that say you can't. That poster was literally working for two employers at the same time, didn't care, and just wanted to move on without any consequences. If - and I emphasise if - this is the same poster (the problem and the writing style and the timing are all very, very similar) then they were lucky to only get dismissed.

Context was important in the previous thread, and it is still important. I have employed people who have been dismissed for gross misconduct more than once. People can make mistakes. But as I said, context is important. Not all gross misconduct is equal, and there are some things that can't be excused or explained.

How is that possible, it sounds humanly impossible. Do you mean she had two 9-5 jobs, and was telling each she was doing it for only them, and actually just doing both in the same day?

as that’s the oddest thing I have ever heard. Who does that?

@Getthethrowonthesofa I guess WFH could make this very possible.

How is that possible, it sounds humanly impossible. Do you mean she had two 9-5 jobs, and was telling each she was doing it for only them, and actually just doing both in the same day?

Well that was the impression given on the other thread, but the poster did not come back to clarify.

Context is everything. Working 12 hours a week for McDonalds and 12 hours a week (at different times, obviously) for Burger King is not necessarily an issue even though the two companies are competitors. Working 9-5 Monday to Friday at home for Scottish Gas and 9-5 Monday to Friday for Bank of Scotland would clearly be a massive issue even though they are not direct competitors.

I think what the OP is really asking is how to move on from this shitshow. @whatsthisforGodsake you need to realise that if a future employer asks either of these two companies for a reference they can choose to disclose that you were sacked for gross misconduct. Personally, if you were working two positions simultaneously, you're lucky to have "just" been sacked.

I had to assume that is what they did because (a) that is literally what they said they did, and (b) when asked if that was what they really meant they refused to answer the question.

Why can't you work two jobs without "asking permission" it's archaic unless your WFH and doing the same hours 🤔

But as a general rule why?

Wow. That’s something else. If that’s what she’s been doing that’s incredible.

it depends on the company. Some allow it some don’t, depends on the job and its demands. In addition, you can’t work foe competition due to the risk of potential information sharing ie pricing etc, which can cause legal issues.

so for example you work in the pub evenings, generally that’s fine on top of an office day job, depending on what it is. Working for two directly competing companies is not, due to sensitivity of proprietary information,

Depends on the job, it could cause great conflict of interest and leave you open to accusations of corruption. Suppose it depends on whether you are party to information that's sensitive to one of the organisations.

2 different pubs or hospitals as a Dr or nurse, probably workable as long as it did not affect your level of service and you were transparent about it. Plenty of clinicians do private work on top of NHS for instance.

If you worked for one national government then they wouldn't love you moonlighting for another country's embassy as you would have access to a lot of very delicate information.

This could also be commercially sensitive information if it was 2 rival say, banks or pharmaceutical research and development departments.

Re OP: I think self reflection is key, with a good dusting off and working out what you would have done differently. Samaritans or your GP if your mental health is affected with perhaps a private counsellor to help you think it over.

Unless you were mis-advised by two separate HR departments when reporting your jobs with rival organisations then I think you will need essentially to take this episode on the chin, learn from it and move on.

Just had a look at your previous thread OP.

Don't cling onto 'well, I got away with it and my work was ok'. That isn't the point. Have a proper think about why you thought it was a good idea to breach contract twice and not declare your other jobs.

It's not the end of the world to mess up at work like this, but you need to be clear eyed about your own mistakes and take accountability. Far easier to move on mentally that way than hanging onto it not really being your problem because it was.

To be honest it's kind of genius....apart from the getting caught and losing your job issue. I could definitely work 2 jobs while wfh from a workload pov. Though I imagine being available for meetings, etc could be tricky.

eh? I've often worked for more than one employer and it's never been an issue.

I actually know someone who was working 2 jobs at exactly the same time. He got away with it for about 9 months. Thats 9 months on double pay. It's genius when you think about it because it takes a while for employers to realise.