Can I get fired for this?

[canigetfiredforthis]

Please be kind I'm extremely stressed right now.

I started a job in relatively senior position to be told 5 weeks later I was at risk of redundancy (no fault of my own). I've been extremely stressed due to this as I was at the last place for a very long time.

Anyway I stupidly sent an email to my boss late one night (drinks had been consumed) basically saying there are loads of issues and you've messed me about massively basically. No swearing and not abusive in any way.

I recalled the message soon after I'd sent it but obviously unsuccessfully.

Anyway now they are saying they are going to fire me for gross misconduct! Can they do this?

I'd maybe resign in your shoes. I was fired for gross misconduct from a job I had been in for over a year. Acas advised me that they had no grounds for gross misconduct and even HR at the company advised me to fight for my job because they didn't want to lose me.

I managed two teams, one of which I had started from scratch and they were doing so well that they received awards for the last four months I was there. I went to the hearing feeling confident and was fired. To this day I have no idea what I did wrong. The job I had done by myself was taken over by two managers and an assistant manager. I did file a claim for unfair dismissal and they settled with me before the hearing.

I wished I had resigned instead of being fired though.

I'm just finding it all so unbelievably distressing I've never had any kind of negativity never mind anything like this in my whole career. I don't know if I have the fight in me. But on the other hand I don't know if we can pay the bills if I don't have any notice!

This is so hard.

You may as well post the email so folks can advise. You’ve posted enough detail already, and there is nothing wrong with asking advice.

Can I just say to those debating the length of the notice period and referring to statutory notice: yes statutory notice is to one week for service between one month and two years. But the employment contract can confer additional rights on top of the statutory entitlement.

In this case the OP's contractual entitlement is to 3 months. That entitlement can only be waived if she resigns (without notice) or commits gross misconduct.

And they are saying it’s gross misconduct. Only if we can read the email can we say if she’s a chance, there is drip feed on what it said. Things like questioning the boss’s experience can be done well or very badly. Although it’s seldom a good idea if you’re looking to be treated decently

Don't resign OP. You're working for an employer who clearly is trying to encourage you to enable them to not pay you your notice.

Let them do their investigation. Explain that it was frustration that made you communicate that way. In the investigation tell them that you're also upset that you've raised concerns and are now being told that you're being investigated for GM and feels like they're trying to get out of paying your notice. Ask that they minute that.

Then what will be will be. They can put you on garden leave or pilon if they don't want you to work the notice. Feels like they just don't want to pay you!

Btw (HR here). GM for 1 email? It'd have to be REALLY bad. Defrauding the company, serious gdpr issue etc. Doesn't sound like it is from what you've written

Op worth reading up a bit on your rights here. There’s a difference between unfair dismissal and wrongful dismissal as others have said. Have a look at the citizens advice website there should be some useful information on there.

I'd just resign. I know people say fight for it but the stress and chance of winning isn't worth it. If you resign with no notice you wouldn't need to put it on a CV. If you end up with 3 months notice that's going to be harder to not show and then you'll need to show that as a dismissal. Even if you win the wrongful dismissal you would probably still have to show it on the CV then it opens questions up and unfortunately (and wrongly but that's life) will put some employers off.

Fight it, you'll be damn proud you did!

Are you for real OP? Just resign and move on.

Yes I get that they're saying it's gross misconduct. They would have to reach that finding though and accept that their decision could be challenged via a wrongful decision claim. I'm just making the point that the issue is not a choice between one week's notice or no notice at all, but between three months' notice or no notice at all.

*wrongful dismissal claim that should say

Sorry, I meant to tag @Gymgoingfool

Op
Honestly a drunken ranty email is definitely on the cusp of gross misconduct. They don't have to prove it as such as they have to email but you could try and argue that it doesn't quality as gross misconduct which could go either way.

Honestly I'd approach them and tell them you don't accept it was gross misconduct and offer to settle at a mid way point ie 6 weeks notice period etc

Cut your losses and walk, chalk this up to experience. Leave it off your CV and watch your alcohol intake in future.

If you send out ill conceived emails after a few drinks I would be very concerned what harm you could do the company maybe sending drunken emails to clients or customers. You haven't been there long and they don't know if this is the type of thing that you normally do when stressed or frustrated.

Honestly I think I I'd resign - but if you want some advice ACAS are useful.

Why would you not be entitled to your notice period if you resigned? This part is confusing me. Everyone that resigns gets their notice pay even if they are told to go on gardening leave.

I wouldn't waste your time and mental energy locking horns and going head to head with them, and even stating you'd take them to ET, and over what - a very short employment, a situation where you have ill-advisedly levelled criticism against them and rocked the boat very early in your employment and put something in email that would have been better dealt with verbally in a meeting if you felt that strongly about whatever it was, and now accusing them of wrongful dismissal.

Don't fall into the Sunk Cost Fallacy trap and get so entrenched in your view that you get wrapped around the wheels of this, you need to extricate yourself as swiftly as possible, show them you're prepared to part company amicably with a bland reference and negotiate some notice payment that is amendable to both sides. Anything else is sheer madness.

potentially accusing them of wrongful dismissal.

They want her to resign with immediate effect, i.e. both sides waiving the notice period or, the alternative is summary dismissal for gross misconduct.

I wondered if they might consider a negotiation.

All I want is for it to not ruin my career and hopefully to survive Money wise until I get my next role.

My DH is adamant I should fight them but I'm not really that keen myself!

Do NOT do this. If the employer happened upon the thread it is currently impossible to definitely identify you or them. If they read the exact wording of the email that you sent them you escalate gross misconduct to a possible case of defamation as well (based on what you say you have said).

Your "truth" about what you said is A version, not THE version. You can have your own personal opinion about the way the company is run and the people in it but, frankly, whatever the provocation, it is bloody stupid to say what you think; and disturbing that a person in a senior position thinks that a late night drunken rant which seems (on the basis of what you have disclosed) to include an unprofessional character assassination of your employers would be a good idea, even after drinking too much. There is angry and upset about they way you have been treated, and common sense. The first in private is fair enough and warranted; but common sense is lacking when that is expressed in such an unprofessional way.

As I have already said, I think you are on a hiding to nothing in legal terms. Some people might think otherwise, but I very much doubt they are correct, and ACAS won't commit to anything ever. But there are other things to consider, including the fact that it is a very small world these days, and leaving on "good terms" - even if that is a fiction - might be sensible. Remember that in that small world that drunken rant may have been "explainable", but it was definitely neither professional nor sensible. If potential / future employers find out that this is how a relatively senior professional acts when angry (and combined with "forgetting" to include this employment on the CV???) then that foolishness could come back to haunt in unexpected ways that you may not like. I mean, being honest, how would you feel if you thought a senior professional person was likely to send out ill-conceived emails about your company or managers after drinking too much at night. Doesn't come across that well, does it? Truth isn't always what it is cracked up to be. And what the truth is often depends on where you are standing and who is telling it to you.

Yes, that's what 'unread' means......

I've quit.