Flexible working refused (despite role being advertised as flexible) - County Council

[gingerbreadtits]

Can anyone please tell me what "flexible working will be considered for this position" means if the hours and work place setting are non negotiable?

I have applied for two "open to flexible working" roles at the local Council and been offered both roles only to find out that the role is 37 hours and on site only.

So what does "flexible" actually mean? Has anyone negotiated part time hours with the Council before? I want to do 30 hours.

(No support here and our wraparound care is often cancelled by the school at last minute)

I'm even happy to pick up the additional 7 hours in the evenings WFH but this too isn't allowed despite both being "flexible" roles.

They have a full web page dedicated to how amazing they are as employers (term time only, part time, compressed hours, WFH, hot decking etc etc!). Theyve attended all the career fairs to encourage people to apply for roles. They have advertising on buses about "flexible working" & and keep whining about a skills shortage!

I'm confused - so what is flexible working in the public sector? 😁

Flexible working is usually about start and finish times IME. So maybe later start and finished each day for school drop offs.

Part time working, remote working, condensed hours are all different terms and not flexible working.

Flexible working at my old place was
"40 hours a week, must be in the office 9.30-12 and 2-3.30"

I've asked for that too. Start earlier and finish earlier but it was also refused.

That was literally my first request when offered the first role. So confusing!

This is my experience in local government. Hybrid working is the term usually being used for part remote/part in office positions. And if they’re open to part-time they’d generally describe it as such.

Lots of public sector organisations have flexible working policies in place allowing different start / end times; part time working; term time only etc. However the level of flexibility varies with the role quite a bit so it's worth checking before applying how the flexible working policy applies to that individual role.

I used to be in the Civil Service and had flexitime, one place with core hours (0700-1000 and 1300-1500 IIRC) and one without. If you are on an FT contract, you can’t just drop 7 hours.

It does seem strange that they’ve advertised as flexible when they don’t appear to be, but I don’t think they ABU asking you to work the hours that they’ve advertised.

Most flexi time positions have either core hours (like a previous poster describes) and a flexi bandwidth within which you have to work those hours. For me that’s 7am to 7pm, so hours worked in the evening wouldn’t count.

In reality even in my role which has no core hours, is a professional one, not customer facing, where I’ve got a high degree of autonomy, there are recurring meetings etc that mean I don’t have complete choice over my hours.

😔 ah this is a shame.

It's so bizarre that they've actually spent money on a full advertising campaign about flexible working. With a photo of a parent collecting their children being used in one of the adverts.

The radio adverts say "work around your life".

That's why I thought I could collect from school and continue working from 4-6pm or something like that - to make it up to 37hours a week.

Thanks everyone! All replies are much appreciated.

Gutted though.

Send them their own advert and ask.

Our flexible working arrangements request us to be at our desks for the core hours in the morning and the afternoon, we can start earlier or finish later but within x in the morning and y in the evening and it is not that we have free range on when to work, we need to consult the manager to ensure there is enough cover if we want to vary our normal work pattern.

Flexible working doesn’t give us the right to choose to work less hours, unless we have been in the position for a long time and they prefer to keep our expertise part time rather than losing it altogether.

I think its role dependant.

I've applied for a few local gov and nhs roles and they all seem to come with the same blurb about how wonderful it is working for them/career prigreasion/training/flexible working.

But when it comes down to it if the role is customer facing it will be set hours.

One role could finish at 4 or 5 but had to be 3 days and in person for example.

Flexible working isn't there so you can look after your dc. Pre covid I couldn't officially WFH if my dc were home poorly from school/childcare.

Flexible working is having core hours but able to start later/earlier and finish later/earlier.

I got a role working compressed hours 35 hours over 4 days. I asked when they offered me the job. They said no, but then couldn't find anyone else they wanted to hire so got back in contact and said yes. Was advertised as normal full time role as well.

I would ask them what they mean by flexible.

Was this a public-facing role? If so, there’s likely to be limited flexibility if you have to cover a phone line or be available during normal office hours. The degree of flexibility is usually dictated by the business needs of the role.

Why don't you ask them? Say they were advertised as flexible so what flexibility can they offer? See what they say.

In my experience it means sod all !

It’s just a ploy to get more applicants, without looking to be the modern, flexible, family friendly employer, they know they would receive many fewer applications.

I used to work bank for Nhs, you would think you can’t get much more flexible than that…how very wrong I was. If I wasn’t available for certain shifts, I would get silent treatment and tantrums from the team lead. I gave it up, couldn’t stand the stress caused by a grown woman not getting her own way!

Ask them what they mean by 'flexible' - and remind them what their ad actually said.

As a by the by, did you mention you wanted to work flexibly in your application or mentioned it at interview ? I'm just thinking if you didn't mention it before, they may have decided to appoint you on the basis that you were happy on a standard contract, 37 hrs on site.

I work for the NHS, and flexible working for me, is working from home mainly, but we do meet up once a month for a face-to-face team meeting or go to sites if requested. There are 2 of us who do the same role in the team so this week I am working 8-5 as he is on annual leave, but normally he starts at 7 and finishes at 3 and I start at 9 and finish at 5, so between us and with our line managers approval we cover the core hours. Before COVID we were all on site, but as working from home was successful so we have been allowed to continue.

I recently applied for and got a job (civil service) in the organisation I was already working for. Advertised as full or part time but when I was offered the job, the powers that be said they really wanted someone full time. However the person who interviewed me fought my corner and they have taken me on part time. It is infuriating though - why can't they advertise properly? I'm sure it is a case of someone not really thinking when they are ticking the options when setting up the job advert 🙄

I work for a local authority and working flexibly would be allowed as long as it fitted with the job (i.e. customer facing staff need to be in the office during opening hours etc). However, we wouldn't allow someone to WfH whilst providing childcare for their child. I think that's an unreasonable ask of most employers.

To me working flexibly would be earlier/later starts and finishes as long as working the core hours of 10am-4pm. Wfh part of the week would be allowed as long as the role was one that could support it, and the person working was fully engaging during the time. Job share arrangements would also be considered.

For us flexi used to be, in office during core hours 10:00-12:00 14:00-16:00 but you could start from 08:00 and end up till 18:00. Each period lasted 4 weeks and you were expected to do 37hrs per week. You could however build up a debit or credit during the period provided it didn't exceed 17 hrs at the end of the period. If you built up credit you could have up to 1.5 days flexi off (with permission).

Of course it's there to help people look after their DC. That's why they can start later or finish earlier - for the school run.

It's weird that they've called it flexible working when it isn't particularly flexible. Very annoying. Do you understand why the role might demand on site, fixed hours?

Ours was very similar.

Core hours were 10 - 1230; 2.30 - 4. You could start at 0830, and work till 1830. You could accrue a max of 1 additional day a month (or be minus a day).

It actually wasn't v flexible for me personally. Due to my personal situation as a single parent with small DC, I couldn't arrive early, and needed to leave earlier than I should due to childcare timing. I often worked evenings & weekends but this time didn't 'count' to my working hours & periodically I had to take leave or pay for extra childcare to get my hours on the clock correct. I understood it was the system but it was frustrating - I managed a team & worked so many additional hours

Now that post Covid we have a blended working policy, officially we've no flexitime but I can now work outside core hours and have it count towards my hours, it is hugely beneficial to me; I can pick up kids at times, attend appointments, work at quiet times for focused work. I still do long days but I feel like I get the benefit now.

I would discuss with the employer what their understanding of flexible working is & take it from there.

As an aside, if I needed someone f/t, I would not agree to a shorter working week. I'll never get to fill those other hours. I also work in the public sector & p/t working, while good on an individual level, is a nightmare in terms of full staffing.

Of course it's there to help people look after their DC. That's why they can start later or finish earlier - for the school run.

Yes, but the poster was saying she couldn't wfh with her DC there too - same with me; children old enough to need childcare need to be in childcare. People trying to work & take care of children is unfair on everyone.

I have asked them and sent them the screenshot of their own job adverts which links to their own web page that states that part time IS part of their flexble working policy and applies to all roles.

I know that I was the only applicant for both roles (nobody wants to work there - Glassdoor is an eye-opener)

It isn't a customer facing role. It's a database / SQL / IT "behind the scenes" role.

I did mention requiring flexibility in my covering letter and again in the interview.

I have an interview at 5pm today for a private sector role. Confirmed as part time and much higher salary. Wish me luck :)