how is your workplace dealing with employees who have given up their childcare while WFH

[SunshineyDay1]

I have name changed for this but interested in people's opinions.

having convened a number of calls from 3-4pm, it is now clear to me that there are a lot of people who no longer have childcare at home. At work, we have a hybrid system but with the understanding that if you are needed in or at a certain time, you will be available. Last week we had a really important client call and 2 members of the team were clearly doing the school run at the same time.

I spoke to both afterwards and one said in a quite arsey fashion that 'everyone knows not to schedule calls between 3-4pm anymore' !!

we have another firm in the same building as us - a big listed company - and I was chatting to one of the managers there as they haven't compelled people to come back yet but are monitoring it and they said they have noticed the same thing and are having a meeting this week on how to deal with it.

I don't have young kids any more but do people really think this is acceptable? Surely if you have young children and have a job that is essentially 9-5 or thereabouts, you can't just dump the childcare and expect to be able to work as well as you did when you were in the office? what happens when workplaces compel people to come back?

just interested in how people are dealing with this

I think flexibility works best where both parties are flexible. I work in a business where most internal support teams are expected to be available 9 - 5 apart from an hour at lunchtime. It's not that highly paid, so pretty much everyone only ever works 9 - 5 and starts / clocks off on the dot.

What's happening in practice now is that those with children are starting a 'just a bit' late due to drop off, and 'popping out' to do pick up, but still taking a lunch hour and finishing at 5 - so there isn't any flex coming back the other way. And people without kids are pissed off as they are having to cover when someone has 'just popped out to pick up the kids' yet again - which then turns into the traffic was bad, I had to make them a snack, settling them down to watch tv etc. It hasn't been addressed yet but it needs to be IMO - the language that people use around 'popping out' it makes it seem that it's just a few minutes but in reality we are probably losing at least 30 - 40 minutes productivity per person with children per day, and not getting it back anywhere.

Most companies are accommodating now OP. Your employees should have been there (as long as they actually knew about the important meeting) but equally, things have changed and management need to get on board instead of forcing the 9-5 standard, especially if it is completely unneccesary!

I have always worked from home and it’s expected we are available for meetings from 9-5. There can been 25 or more people on calls, often from different time zones, it’s not possible to work around the school run. Client meetings are usually late afternoon as they are mostly US based, so the expectation is we are available. DH’s meetings are mostly internal so he has more flexibility. For this reason I do drop off and he picks up. I think this issue is something which really depends on the nature of the job. If flexibility can be given then it should but employees should have childcare in place if needed for their role.

Put it this way. Covid showed us all that we could work from home, management just didn't want us to because "office banter" and organised fun.

People will leave and find companies who ARE flexible to work for and who offer WFH if thats what works for them and if you nare a mum, THATS what works.

It's time for management to start being flexible instead. People are fed up. Same with retail and restaurants. It's not a staffing issue, it's a management/wage issue.

For me, covid showed me just how inefficient working from home was. Everything is so much faster when you could just ask a colleague on the next desk something or when all the files/paperwork was easily accessible.

We all returned full time to the office in September 2020.

The problem with flexibility a lot of the time is that realistically not everyone can have it. There always has to be someone there to allow the others to be flexible. As soon as that person(s) isn't there, there is uproar.

We've told everyone that we expect them to be able to undertake all aspects of the job, which includes emergency visits and recall to the office, but that's the nature of our job. We've then spoken to specific individuals who have been unable to do this and given then time to get child care again but I have very little sympathy for those who gave up their places at sought after wrap around provision.

BUT we're generally very supportive of a regular (once a week am, once a week pm) request to do the school run, we give paid time off for children's illness, are accomodating of school plays etc without taking leave etc etc.

Our job involves home visits, and whilst people can and do schedule paperwork days, if an emergency comes in you have to deal with it and twice per week a worker is the duty officer, and that isnt (and can't be) a fixed day each week. Duty workers need to work out of the office as work is locality based. We also don't allow WFH if you're more than 30mins from base - though were more accomodating through the lock downs.

Some people have taken the piss though which has eaten away at good feeling though.

I’m surprised you haven’t considered being flexible, most companies are now. I’m pretty sure you will find your staff can leave and get a job that is flexible quite easily. The power seems to have shifted from the employer to the employee (for the first time in decades!! So about bloody time)

One person's flexibility is often another person's pain-in-the-arse.

@CallmeHendricks

One person's flexibility is often another person's pain-in-the-arse.

While I am very pro-flexibility in general, I totally agree with this. I've increasingly seen people not willing to acknowledge that flexibility works both ways and there is so often someone who is picking up the slack so other people can be flexible.

I'm really surprised that the majority of responses are people saying they can do the school run, I'm wondering if my employer is as flexible as I had thought! I pay for breakfast and after school club for my primary aged DC and work my hours then collect them afterwards.

@CallmeHendricks @mynameiscalypso I completely agree. Its a logistical nightmare trying to be flexible for everyone.

I'll admit, I am strict with my hours. I work 8am-3pm 2 days a week and 8am - 4pm 3 days a week. I don't really need any flexibility but I need to finish at my finish times. If someone wants to do the school run on one of my 3pm finish days then I need to cover them. If I don't, then I'm seen as selfish. My hours are as they are because I requested them years ago.

There are staff complaining about their perceived lack of flexibility but don't seem to see that they require someone else to give up something in order for their needs to be met.

I don't work late unless there is some major emergency. I'll cover for someone to do the school run if something has gone wrong for them, not just through assumptions or lack of planning.

@HunterHearstHelmsley I also hate the assumption that people without children are less deserving of flexibility than those with children. My choice to have a child does not mean that my time is my important than that of a colleague who doesn't have a child!

It really depends on the type of job. The vast majority of my work is working completely independently. Yes, I have the occasional team or client meeting, but even if I were in the office I would be in a private office with the door closed.

Our workplace are being very flexible as long as the work is being done. No one has any issue with it that I'm aware of.

The problem is that it is very hard to have any sort of consistent fair approach. I have two team members who need to be contactable between them 9 to 5. So in theory one of them could do the school run at 3 but then they can't make the time up because we don't need anyone before 9 or after 5. I have another team member who could work from midnight to 8am for all the difference it makes to their job.

There is also the question of how much disturbing is ok in online meetings. Noone minds if a child appears during a team catch up but it's not fair for the same to happen during someone's disciplinary hearing.

I think a lot depends on the role. We have some roles which are customer-facing, and you can't just pop out for half an hour. Others work closely with teams in AsiaPac and/or the USA, so their hours tend to start early or finish later to fit in with that. My team, we can work pretty flexible, as long as we do our 40h a week. (Or 32h or 24h for those who are part-time.) One guy some years ago did renegotiate his contracted hours to make sure he was available for the afternoon school run. We have to cover on-call, and some out of hours work, including overnight and weekends, so flexibility goes both ways.

But we are expected to attend meetings, and 3-4pm is a popular meeting time, because UK and Europe are availableas is the USA.

In my experience, it's not so difficult to work round medical appointments, child pick-up and so on. The real scheduling issues come from those who don't check availability before putting meetings in the calendar, and suddenly you're expected to be on 3 calls at the same time.

If this had been allowed to happen your work has dropped the ball on communication.

My work had been very flexible but still have regular comms with updates on WFH and policies during different stages of the pandemic including saying what the plans are for future hybrid working when we reopen, advising people not to make decisions that leave them unable to commute to work once this is all over. Advising when additional flexibility was given for childcare and when it wasn't after childcare reopened.

Sounds like your work needs to communicate its expectations and sort out the mis understandings and rumours urgently before you find yourself in the situation where you are asking people to return to work and they say they cant.

My employer, a publicly funded organisation but not government, has left it up to manager's discretion. However they are also trying to ensure lunch breaks are meeting-free and 'be nice' generally.

So there are people taking the piss to save on childcare costs. I'm a manager and queried whether I could start a formal improvement process about lack of availability in core hours. HR advised against. So managers can't pull staff up on availability because HR won't back it. That isn't leaving it up to manager discretion, it is removing the manager's ability to manage.

I think the place isn't going to be around many more years.

I think some people really don't understand that WFH doesn't give you carte blanche to disregard the established core working hours of 9-5 (for roles without flexibility).

I'd expect to no longer have a job if I was no longer actually available 9-5 when my expected work hours are 9-5.

Luckily they aren't because I'm senior enough to choose my own work pattern but I'd be furious if an employee decided they weren't going to be available for 5+ hours a week and still expected to be paid their full time wage.

I run several teams. By the nature of their work, it can be flexible. However, we have core hours that someone needs to manning the inbox or available on the phone.

Thankfully they are all grown up about it and are truly flexible. They will let people know in advance what their plan is and we work it between us.

My school run is about 30 feet ds is in year 6. So I do take time to see how he is. Get him a drink and a snack then work. But I do way over my actual hours anyway.

My teams are flexible as is our MD. But they are actuly flexible. Flexible doesn't mean it always works in the favour of the employee. My teams will swop things about to accommodate each other, where possible. They don't ditch meetings. Or half listen while on the school run. They will change their planned working hours in emergencies etc.

By the sound of it, OP your company seems to have a problem with employees assuming the flexibility just goes their way. Which I would say is a management failing.

We are happy to flex but if a client meeting is needed and no other time suits, we expect you to be available in normal working hours as specified by your contract which has not been altered and no change to working hours have been agreed. So no we don't think the hours of 3-4pm are sacred - unless someone has agreed it beforehand we expect you to work and be present.

I now work 745-6pm every day to factor in time away on the school run. I'm not alone in working later now to accommodate this, lots of friends do the same.

I'm extremely grateful my employer is flexible and I ensure all work is completed as my way of showing that I can work successfully this way. The kids are happier, I'm happier, no complaints from me. If a meeting is scheduled in 3-4pm I make alternative childcare arrangements if my husband can't cover the school run. (He usually does the mornings, I do the afternoons.)

I think a lot of bosses are getting wise to the fact that a lot of "wfh" people aren't really and are basically, loading the dishwasher, pegging out the washing etc etc and some people are taking advantage..... hence they are calling their workers back to the office where they can keep an eye on them.

Some people (including us) have no choice in after school care. DS school has no after school club, he used to go to a CM, her partner also used to work for her but due to money lost in COVID he has taken another job, they have reduced their numbers so DS was let go.
Several CM in the area also shut or reduced numbers and parents with DCs starting the next door school were left with no after school care at all.