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Soooo disappointed in job applications!

230 replies

SnowfallSnowball · 04/08/2021 10:24

Hi
I am currently shortlisting for a role and the level of applications are so disappointing. I totally understand that nowadays applications are a task in themselves but if you’re not going to take the time to read the application guidance, JD and PS why bother applying at all?

I have already seen a high number of people who have just wrote a cover letter and attached their CV when we specify no CV’s and to write a supporting statement abiding by items on the PS. Many of these applicants are already in a job so they must have applied properly to posts in the past, I don’t get it!

Any other recruiters have these issues?

OP posts:
RemoteControlledSheep · 04/08/2021 18:07

That’s surprising- all lawyers are not of equal ability despite qualifications and experience. Really quite surprised that recruiters think this way.

AvantGardening · 04/08/2021 18:49

Before I became a stay at home mum I was at a reasonable place career wise. Job adverts that wanted me to spend a couple of days filling in an oh-so-unique application form before they filtered I just didn’t bother with. I had enough options without wasting my time that way. It may be the application process is turning off the qualified, ideal applicants you want.

AwFeebs · 04/08/2021 19:02

I think some people need to apply for a certain number of jobs in order to qualify for financial help, could this be a factor?

I have recently been job hunting and equally the amount of job adverts that had typos and poor grammar in them was astounding. I'm not the sharpest tool in the box but if you're stating the applicant must have good literacy skills, attention to detail etc then at least try to make sure your ad isn't littered with errors.

SirSamuelVimes · 04/08/2021 19:07

I was in a position a little while ago of two similar jobs coming up that suited me.

One wanted pages and pages of application form filled in, statements linking skills and experience to a 3 page job description/ person special, etc etc.

One wanted a cv, phone call, full interview.

Guess which one I applied for? (And got. And it's better paid then the first.)

GillBiggeloesHair · 04/08/2021 19:14

I applied for a job with the UN recently, it took me 5 hours. I expected this.

Prior to that I applied for a job at a school, advert said CV and covering email.
Got there for the interview and they made me fill in a fooking 10 page application form with the EXACT same information.

On top of that, they left me in reception for 45 minutes. They did offer but I declined.

Iseeyoulookingatme · 04/08/2021 19:24

Honestly op I've been job hunting recently and I have to say that if any jobs had long applications I took one look and said no. I was going to apply for a teaching assistant job but the amount of information they needed was ridiculous so I didn't bother. Perhaps people are being put of like me. I had filled out quite a few applications at this point and couldn't take anymore. Luckily for me I have managed to gain a new job and all they required was my cv with relevant experience.

girlmom21 · 04/08/2021 19:24

What level of employee are you recruiting for?

I've helped relatives and friends apply for £18,000 a year jobs that have taken an hour or two because of the bollocks application forms which 100% could have just been answered with the attachment of a CV.

viques · 04/08/2021 19:30

@SnowfallSnowball

Hi I am currently shortlisting for a role and the level of applications are so disappointing. I totally understand that nowadays applications are a task in themselves but if you’re not going to take the time to read the application guidance, JD and PS why bother applying at all?

I have already seen a high number of people who have just wrote a cover letter and attached their CV when we specify no CV’s and to write a supporting statement abiding by items on the PS. Many of these applicants are already in a job so they must have applied properly to posts in the past, I don’t get it!

Any other recruiters have these issues?

I would be a bit annoyed that my job application was being criticised by someone whose level of written English is as poor as yours.

“The level of applications are so disappointing”

“Have just wrote a cover letter”

PegasusReturns · 04/08/2021 19:33

@bostonbullsmumma

What area of law is this if you don't mind me asking?

Im GC at a large MNC so it covers: corporate, IP, regulatory, compliance, digital, tax, data privacy, litigation, employment etc. Plus some more industry specific stuff. It’s a pretty broad church.

Bostonbullsmumma · 04/08/2021 19:36

[quote PegasusReturns]@bostonbullsmumma

What area of law is this if you don't mind me asking?

Im GC at a large MNC so it covers: corporate, IP, regulatory, compliance, digital, tax, data privacy, litigation, employment etc. Plus some more industry specific stuff. It’s a pretty broad church.[/quote]
Thank you. Makes sense now and really interesting to know.

Runnerduck34 · 04/08/2021 19:42

I do think you should read the jd and personal spefication and tailor your application accordingly, also think you should read and comply with the way in which employer wants the application submitted. Thats pretty basic.
However I also like proper job adverts that state hours, pay and benefits like amount of annual leave. Those type of adverts seem pretty extinct.
It is hard work applying for a job ,takes a lot of time and effort if done properly and as pp have said most employers dont even say thanks but no thanks if you arent shortlisted.

KnottyKnitting · 04/08/2021 19:44

I know your pain. I once received an application written on pencil on a torn off piece of paper from a notebook. No CV- no reference to the job at all...

Another required a certain level of sign language. Applicant said she knew a bit of makaton through watching Mr Tumble and was sure she could pick it up easily. Yeah that's not going to cut it translating an a level physics lesson into BSL🙄

PegasusReturns · 04/08/2021 19:45

@RemoteControlledSheep

That’s surprising- all lawyers are not of equal ability despite qualifications and experience. Really quite surprised that recruiters think this way

If that’s directed at me you’ve misunderstood my comment which was candidates qualifications and employment history speak for themselves. Of course that doesn’t translate to equal ability across all disciplines and histories.

If I am looking for an IP lawyer and I get a CV from a 5PQE lawyer with a relevant PhD who has worked for a competitor for three years I don’t need them to tell me why they’d be a good at the job. I know they will be.

If I’m lucky enough to get two such CVs the question isn’t who is most qualified, or more experienced the question I need answering is who will fit best? Who has the personality to fit with the organisational values and the existing team.

If I get a CV from a tax litigator for the same job then their CV and employment history is going to tell me they’re not suitable. Regardless of how persuasive they think their cover letter might be.

Heyha · 04/08/2021 19:45

Having done plenty of recruitment in education for both teaching and support roles you'd be surprised what people think is sufficient to apply for a role. Obviously public sector all the info and details in the advert have to be crystal clear and yet you can get three or four in your inbox for a particular specialist role that have got absolutely zero experience of that specialist thing. These are often also the ones that hassle you for an update on their application before the published closing date...

It does make it easier for genuine potential candidates who have followed the requests in the advert though, as you're so grateful to see a workable application!

Brefugee · 04/08/2021 19:50

It's been a struggle to be honest. We've looked at our recruitment process and where we advertise, but are being told that lots of agencies are experiencing a shortage of good quality candidates at the moment.
I don't think it's too onerous to expect a candidate to be able to complete an online application and tie it in to the JD & PS.

it's a seller's market. So you need to turn that round and make the application process more attractive, surely?

I was head-hunted into my 2 most recent jobs, but when i have looked, i have avoided anything that wants me to provide the same info that is on my CV in a custom form. It is ridiculous and I'm not interested in faffing about.

Mindyourbusiness22 · 04/08/2021 20:06

99% of job ads are diabolical and all about the company rather than what’s in it for the individual. Listing competitive salary, 25 days holidays, and a company pension alongside a crap wage isn’t company perks and will attract the wrong candidates.

TheDevils · 04/08/2021 20:06

I work in HE too and I'm currently shortlisting. We specify no CVs so if you've just sent in a CV then you aren't getting shortlisted I'm afraid.

CormoranStrike · 04/08/2021 20:08

I got applications in recently and rejected many for poor spelling - not a simple typo, but repeatedly spelling the same obvious things.

Eg that they studied at Oxfurd rather than Oxford.

skybroke · 04/08/2021 20:23

I'm seem to know a disproportionate number of people in high paying jobs who aren't great at spelling, grammar or have a great vocabulary. Is it because at the level you don't really do application forms?

PinniGig · 04/08/2021 20:40

I used to run care homes specifically for failing homes that needed to have someone come in and help get things turned around, on the up and avoid enforcement action.

The worst were larger providers that owned multiple sometimes hundreds of different places and used a recruitment agency to whittle down applicants for job roles that needed very particular skills, experience and most importantly, the right person to fit in with the rest of the team.

I only figured it out after wondering how the fuck places ended up paying absurd salaries to staff that were as much use as a one legged man in an arse kicking contest. One huge private care provider for example had thrown no fewer than five different management roles to tackle one place with a long history of non-compliance including acting manager, regional / area manager, recruiment manager all to the tune of over £100k to try fixing what only needed one with specific experience and background.

I also discovered over time how agencies actually do more harm than good and will filter out the best, most ideal staff who just don't want to go through all the nonsense and bollocks of an online pre-application test and in my case, I wouldn't apply for a job as care manager because I didn't know which home it was and they refused to give me the name.

All I wanted to know which I explained is the name of the place because it might be somewhere I've worked for previously and have no interest whatsoever in going anywhere near. It meant I'd be wasting their time, my time and the employer's and I wasn't happy to give my personal details and apply for a mystery job. They wouldn't have it so I wouldn't apply but if they had just told me where it was and I had no prior dealings with, I'd have applied in a heartbeat.

What I did and generally found got a better response was post the job advert and aim to keep the wording, tone and overall language informal, friendly and ask people to forward a CV and email telling me a little about themselves and what sort of person they are including a note that we are keen to know and find the right person as opposite to finding a person that ticks the necessary boxes.

Alternatively they could call me for an informal friendly chat about the job and we'd take it from because not everyone has enough relevant experience or quals to create even a sparse CV but they might still have exactly the right traits, qualities and personality that counts.

Some of the best care staff I ever had the privilige of working with and alongside started out without a single qualification and two girls needed to compelte basic literacy and numeracy courses before they could be accepted to start NVQ's. One is now a deputy manager and the other is in her third year training to be nurse.

I often wonder how many ideal candidates have either not bothered to apply or hit a brick wall when agencies refuse to engage and give the most basic info about the company.

SpringRainbow · 04/08/2021 20:54

@PinniGig

I used to run care homes specifically for failing homes that needed to have someone come in and help get things turned around, on the up and avoid enforcement action.

The worst were larger providers that owned multiple sometimes hundreds of different places and used a recruitment agency to whittle down applicants for job roles that needed very particular skills, experience and most importantly, the right person to fit in with the rest of the team.

I only figured it out after wondering how the fuck places ended up paying absurd salaries to staff that were as much use as a one legged man in an arse kicking contest. One huge private care provider for example had thrown no fewer than five different management roles to tackle one place with a long history of non-compliance including acting manager, regional / area manager, recruiment manager all to the tune of over £100k to try fixing what only needed one with specific experience and background.

I also discovered over time how agencies actually do more harm than good and will filter out the best, most ideal staff who just don't want to go through all the nonsense and bollocks of an online pre-application test and in my case, I wouldn't apply for a job as care manager because I didn't know which home it was and they refused to give me the name.

All I wanted to know which I explained is the name of the place because it might be somewhere I've worked for previously and have no interest whatsoever in going anywhere near. It meant I'd be wasting their time, my time and the employer's and I wasn't happy to give my personal details and apply for a mystery job. They wouldn't have it so I wouldn't apply but if they had just told me where it was and I had no prior dealings with, I'd have applied in a heartbeat.

What I did and generally found got a better response was post the job advert and aim to keep the wording, tone and overall language informal, friendly and ask people to forward a CV and email telling me a little about themselves and what sort of person they are including a note that we are keen to know and find the right person as opposite to finding a person that ticks the necessary boxes.

Alternatively they could call me for an informal friendly chat about the job and we'd take it from because not everyone has enough relevant experience or quals to create even a sparse CV but they might still have exactly the right traits, qualities and personality that counts.

Some of the best care staff I ever had the privilige of working with and alongside started out without a single qualification and two girls needed to compelte basic literacy and numeracy courses before they could be accepted to start NVQ's. One is now a deputy manager and the other is in her third year training to be nurse.

I often wonder how many ideal candidates have either not bothered to apply or hit a brick wall when agencies refuse to engage and give the most basic info about the company.

This is nice to read.

My current boss made it clear from the beginning that they didn’t care about my past experience or qualifications. All they cared about how I am as a person and can I be trained to do what they needed me to do.

I am actually hearing more and more companies taking this approach, although it still isn’t the norm.

I have heard nothing but bad stories about agencies from both sides. I really do wonder how they are still around.

Heyha · 04/08/2021 20:55

@TheDevils

I work in HE too and I'm currently shortlisting. We specify no CVs so if you've just sent in a CV then you aren't getting shortlisted I'm afraid.
And then you get the odd one that does everything right with the letter and form and then sends a CV too... I tend to forgive that as I quite like a belt and braces approach, but I don't look at the CV. It would be unfair on other applicants who haven't sent one in as an extra because we didn't ask for one.
azimuth299 · 04/08/2021 21:31

Your process sounds exhausting - if it's so complicated that you have published guidance on how to do the application then it's too complicated.

The trouble is that every job application involves these long-winded forms. There will be essay questions which overlap in their answers, there will be no way to see the entirety of the application without filling it out, there will be no way to save progress, then a long personal statement which overlaps the previous questions - all for the company to not even bother to tell you that you've not got the job. Once you've done that twenty times you tend to give up and just send a CV and hope for the best!

TheDevils · 04/08/2021 21:41

@azimuth299

Your process sounds exhausting - if it's so complicated that you have published guidance on how to do the application then it's too complicated.

The trouble is that every job application involves these long-winded forms. There will be essay questions which overlap in their answers, there will be no way to see the entirety of the application without filling it out, there will be no way to save progress, then a long personal statement which overlaps the previous questions - all for the company to not even bother to tell you that you've not got the job. Once you've done that twenty times you tend to give up and just send a CV and hope for the best!

But you're risking not getting shortlisted! We specifically state no CVs- if that's all you sent then you'd be straight on the rejection pile.
TheDevils · 04/08/2021 21:42

Oh yes!! I just ignore the cv too!

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