FT, PT or SAHM; middle age muddle-sorry long

[majorstress]

I have no one in RL, so would like some MN support/advice/own experiences.

I went part time due to terrible problems getting help at home and childcare. This wasn't my choice and I'm someone who finds being at home depressing, so predicatably got VERY depressed. Meanwhile my status at work has been demolished and I feel like a waste of space. DH did less at home, on the grounds that I am there to deal with everything, and he is working even more to get a promotion he wants that would hugely increase our income.

Anticipating youngest's entry to Reception, I asked to come back FT ASAP. Then I got more problems with the summer hols and finding out very late about the school's new very slow settling in policy. I am upset about that and how I and others (dh, boss, family, CM) have dealt with it, but never mind.

My confidence is really low and I doubt I could do my former more demanding FT job. More importantly my enjoyment of it has ebbed away and I can't put up with my boss or colleagues anymore. Also nothing seems to have changed at home-dds are still as much work if not more, even though at school, and I can't even retain an expensive cleaner from an agency for more than 12 weeks. I'm really tired of trying to hire help.

I'm going through a big sea change and wonder where others have pitched up on such stormy shores? Or maybe it's just my impending birthday!!!

sorry you are going through such a difficult time, no advice but thought you might like to know that we can't hold onto cleaners either because we are just too disgusting you are not alone! x

have you thought about hiring an au pair/ nanny?

What about looking for another job?

I think you should go back to work full time because obviously that suited you. Your confidence will soon come back.

I think

• DH needs to shape up, sharpish and start pulling his weight wrt domestic stuff, it's not your JOB
• You then need to consider another job or working out hwo you can progress in your current one - i.e. putting past issues behind you
• keep trying re help and DH must pull his weight with the sheer responsibility of it all

I bet you could do the job but the problem is that you cannot do EVERYTHING on your own. Also:

• Chore list for everynoe, inc you and dh
• shop online
• cleaner
• lower your standards
• plan ahead big time for hols (i.e. I booked all mind in Jan to cover half terms/easter etc

Good luck. Anyone would find it hard doing it all alone.

well I've went from good job to waitressing at the minimum wage as I've no help either and over the last 10 years have had to leave jobs as no help was available when I needed to work (weekends/odd times)

now we are skint

dream of a cleaner, might end up a cleaner actually!!

hope things improve for you MS, its so hard

I keep trying to organise things like chore lists, for years now, but find they are resented and then ignored (by me as well ). It's like I have lost the will to keep trying, feeling like I need to quit work and feed my inner hippy, or work FT and use the money to find some Supernanny for mums who will come in and put up the lists, tell me what to do, tell us all off in a loud voice, and my REWARD would be to sit on the naughty step for 45 minutes (my kids do this to me sometimes). But a) she doesn't exist and b) oopsI forgot b-that is part of the problem, forgetfulness, aging brain, loss of energy to deal with all this hecticness-I mean, WHY? Is this what I have lived my life to do?

I already shop online and have a cleaner and an ironer, but they are turning over faster and faster (i.e. new ones needing training I don't have time for) and costing more for less. The standards mean that important mail is left unopened, clean ironed clothes end up on the floor in piles of dust, food is rotting...lowering them further would be counterproductive.

The holidays are a very sore point, the problem is I have to cover for others who want the same holidays. It's caused lots of rows and boss is ineffectual, so now we aren't allowed to book in advance and then have to give 6 weeks notice, then fight it out. Every time. That's one reason I no longer like or respect colleagues or boss.

toomuchtodo, now you are skint, is that worse than juggleing, making excuses, struggling until you pop?

Are you better off in other ways?

No nanny or au pair wants to work in our council estate, and I think they seem to peter out really once kids are all at school-it's not their job really. We don't have enough room for a live in and the transport is poor.

Sounds like the perfect time to spring-clean your life by the sound of it. You've kept your hand in workwise despite all the problems with having small children, so that's a big plus. In theory your children'll gradually need you less as time goes on so you'll be able to concentrate on your career. Decide if you want to stay in the same field or try something different and register with a few agencies to ease the work getting a new job cerates. On the cleaners front do you know why don't they stay long? Is there anything you can do to make your home more manageable (declutter?) or is it down to them not having enough time for what you need them to do. Could be the time to identify everything that needs doing around the house and divvying the jobs up o a rota for you, dh and the cleaner. Might be time to get a hobby/ outside interest too, so dh doesn't take the piss with any free time you do manage to carve out for yourself. Might be time to sart the process of getting your children to help out a little in return for some pocket money too.

The cleaner situation has really changed over the last few years. All the retirement age British ladies vanished some time ago, and then I had a spell of lovely overqualified Eastern Europeans that usually stayed 18 months or so. They usually get a "real" job in the end, and good for them. Now they are getting younger, unqualified, and leave because it is raining.

I've just emailed an "agency Agency" to ask about mother's helps-I tried a couple of years ago for part time nannies and they just laughed. Maybe things have changed?

Decluttering, the spirit is willing but the flesh is quaking at the magnitude-I'm so distractable now too I end up running all over the house trying to sort stuff, then get interrupted and dds find their treasures in the recycle box. Cue gnashing of teeth. The problem is I can't get to the decluttering because I am doing the day-to-day stuff that a cleaner doesn't cover.

Reforming DH is off the radar right now, he just isn't here and he needs to be at work to bow and scrape for the promotion.

How about this, I hire a FT mother's help temporarily while I get on top of things?

vacua

really why do you have cleaner troubles? I mean, surely the job is to...CLEAN, right? If it was already clean, there would be no job.

We're really untidy, it's hard work here and even the agencies demand a certain level of tidiness

How about - Give up work and allow yourself the time and space while the dd's are at school, to get on top of the house, get organised, and just enjoy some time on your own rather than as worker/wife/mum.

I think though if you're worried about hating being at home, it affecting your career, etc; then yes, you definitely need someone full time to get the house sorted during school hours and to mind the kids when they come in from school. It sounds like you're looking for a mother's help rather than a nanny, I think you're right there.

I have always asked cleaners etc to help sort and fold laundry, pair socks-but I guess that's not their job-maybe they resent it and quit. I just don't want to do it, have many other things that only I can do piling up, and it's an easy job for someone else to take on-AIBU to wish to pay someone to do it for me?

Cleaners seem to do dishes (by hand even if there is a DW right beside them) and wash the floor. When I ask them to do other than that, I have to really struggle to stop them just washing the floor over and over. The laminate is getting ruined.

I get the feeling that the people I hire/try to hire despise me for not doing it all myself. Maybe I should despise my boss for not doing my work instead of me? It doesn't make sense.

HonoriaGlossop- yes that's right

I really want to hand in my notice on Monday, that would mean I was free from Xmas (3 months notice, groan). I feel desperate to have time and space for the first time in years.

But I fear never working again, and getting bored/depressed over time, then finding I can't get a job at all when I want to go back.

Oh, come on I will get something!!!!

You are egging me on to resign, probably without meaning to.

majorstress - at the risk of sounding trite (because this doesn't address career issue); why don't you join us on our fly thread (it's the most recent baby-steps one) It's under Good House-Keeping (started by SAHM1)??

I can't stand the folksy style of Flylady but the underlying principles are sound and good and it does work.

If you are overwhelmed by clutter and the task facing you is too enormous to contemplate - Flylady gentle steers you through it - 15 mins a day - in fact you are positively discouraged from tackling too much at once

I'm hoping some kind person will do a link because I don't know how ...

Definitely agree with others that you dh should pitch in more. Also, could you start to address your lack of friends in RL? I know it seems mad when career/home issues seem more pressing but could you try attacking it from a different angle and go out and do something just for yourself (art class/spa/book group - whatever makes you happy) with the aim that that will strengthen you to tackle the rest ...

Hope things get better for you ...

sorry, that should read ...

• gent - ly
• you - r husband

I don't mean to egg you on....you need to do what feels right for you.

All I can say is what I would do in your situation; and that is, that if financially we could do it, I would stay home to get on top of things. I remember reading one of your threads before (and looking at your name!!) and thinking that you just don't seem to be enjoying family life, and that's SUCH a shame. If you can give yourself the time during the day to get stuff sorted so you don't feel so stressed, you will probably find that you enjoy everything alot more, kids included.

And the thing with kids is that they give back what they get, doubled IMO - the happier and more relaxed you are.........you see where I'm going!

However I am not a 'career' person; I have one, cos we can't afford otherwise, but in your situation I wouldn't worry about work; I'd take each step as it came, however I know alot of people think differently.

Good luck, whatever you decide.

majorstress

I think you need a full-time break from work to get your house in order. And getting your house in order will be a full-time job for a little while - all that decluttering, recycling, putting systems into place so that it all runs smoothly takes time (and, dare I say it, some brain power ). The daily chores are really not a big deal if your household is well thought out, and shouldn't be beyond a cleaner once you are set up and organised.

Could you not ask for a three-month or six-month leave of absence from work?

That's a thought Anna. A sabbatical? Would they go for that Major? At least then you would still have the security of a job in the background.

majorstress - I'm not in the same place as you atm as I carried on full-time since having DS#1 10 years ago until DS#2 was born in 2003. And I resented it. I wanted to be at home. I still feel a bit sore that I had no choice. Now I work 9-3 and work from home 2 days a week.

However I do have the same aggravations as you re childcare, school (esp settling in policy ) and school holidays. Part-time has made life easier in the sense that I can be there to pick up from school and working from home has given the flexibility to deal with some childcare issues and sickness. BUT!! I feel short-changed, as like you, I seem to have swapped hours at work for all the extra chores that are waiting for me at home . And all hope of promotion has really gone by the board and I have to fight tooth and nail for juicy projects. I don't do either job (paid or parenting) as well as I could.

Please be very very aware that once your DC is at school working gets more difficult, not less. It might be cheaper but it's harder. Schools don't offer the flexibilty that nurseries/CMs offer. DS#2 is at school this morning today - but the teachers didn't come to take them in until 9.10! So I was 15 mins late for work. I have to leave work 10 mins early to pick DS#2 up from school - it's OK, no-one mentions it, but it's difficult if I'm in a meeting and not only do I have to leave at 3, I actually need to leave at 10 to, to get there on time.

I'm at the point where I feel I've compromised my career to the point where I can't recover it without moving jobs and I doubt I'd find one as family friendly as this. I also feel that I've not done the best job I could rearing my children either. I don;t know what I want to do TBH but I do sympathise. I realise this post isn't very helpful or supportive but at least it's honest.

Re cleaners - on the odd occasion I've had one I've not had the problems you've had. Mine have been great by and large. And would do anything I asked. Not sure what to suggest as you've tried agencies. Postcard in newsagents window? Might work.

hmm a sabbatical-or that unpaid leave that parents are supposed to get (ha). I like the idea in principle, but it's a shame about this job, I'm not getting on with the boss as it is, and if since I asked to go full time in June he has made plans, he won't be too pleased.

I used to be more sure of myself, especially with bosses. Now I feel like I would be stepping off a cliff to leave, but that's what I think I really want. I have actually blamed family life for my unhappiness but tbh I've just been focussing on that, blind to the other things going on, including the gradual loss of job satisfaction. If dh gets his promotion "we" don't need me to work, but in the back of my mind "we" is not that sturdy. I'd like to get somewhere in my current job, then leave on a high note, but it's not going very well.

I do have other interests of my own but they have been utterly off the agenda since school broke up in July!!!. dd2 finally goes fulltime on Monday, and of course I feel guilty about anticipating that so much! (She IS wearing though!!)

OrmIRIAN you sound very like the same situation as me-I was full time for the first 4 years of motherhood, from dd1 age 5 months. Once dd1 went to school, things went awry and I have never felt happy with the choices and variations I have tried.

And the career is a real catch 22, I have squeezed them to be "family-friendly" with me, which I couldn't do in a new job, and my performance on the most boring projects on earth is lacklustre so I won't get a better job anyway even if I do spend the entire salary on a nanny cleaner and cook.

thanks counting the grey

I've looked at flylady a lot, but never got going, I will try again. I do see that through the annoying stuff this is just perfect for me.

Isn't it funny how ANNOYING the housework issue is, no matter how you cut it?

I mean, really.

The problem is balancing work and home and "you" time, but most of your time and energy is sucked up by trivia.

Hi majorstress, this is what hasn't worked for me! (sorry if long hijack) I've been FT in a job I love since February this year. 3dcs at primary school, livein aupair (we're on our second but that's another story), cleaner, dh who works from home. I'd been SAHM for 9 years preceding this. It should have all been so simple.

What went wrong: I have a long commute. My earnings are pitiful after travel and childcare costs. Weekends are spent catching up on tidying/laundry because our 'systems' aren't up to my standard. Forever losing plimsolls/school books etc. Tried shopping online but unable to predict our needs a week ahead so dh does it week time. Aupair can't/won't help dcs with homework so they're falling behind or at least not as competent as I'd like. Aupair can't cook properly so dcs get processed suppers. Dcs whiny and clingy around me as see me so little, this stresses me out so I yell and want to get away from them. Everyone's more argumentative than they were. I'm knackered all the time, my lovely allotment is neglected, I've no time for exercise or relaxation. NOT FUN.

The result: I requested a 3 day week (perfectly feasible with my workload). Was refused. I resigned. Today's my last day

I'm gambling on finding another job/temping closer to home. Then I'll be home for holidays etc. My experience is that being away from home caused more problems than it solved and while I am sacrificing professionally it's worth it for all our happiness.

You sound unhappy both at home and work, I believe it's a question of which makes you the most miserable atm and concentrate on solving that. Cleaners etc should fall into place if your house is tidy enough and you're not overburdening them. Good luck, I'll be interested to hear how it goes. Sorry again for ramble.

oooh curious cat, I so know what you mean.

Of course we can USE the money, but in fact we don't NEED it, if I was on the ball at home we wouldn't need to spend as much. I've never been worried about money, except for old age.

The first things to go are the "me" items, lie it's selfish for mum to need exercise rest or fun.

Next are the "little" things the kids need-someone to listen, help with school, healthy food.

Little things...not.

and when I say not worried about money, it's not that there is a lot, dh and I are very cautious spenders.