Pay issue.... help please

[Supermum29]

I applied for promotion and successfully got the job! Talent team call to offer position and confirm salary. I felt it was low but as I haven’t been a manager previously I went in with the intention of proving myself for 6 months then seeing if it could be negotiated.
For context while I haven’t officially been a manager before I do have all the skills required for the job and have done training/people management in a previous role.

Pay offered was £30k. Today I discover that someone I’ll be managing is on £500 a year less and others not far off. I find this quite insulting as I will be managing a large team and it’s quite a full on job involving a fair bit of travel.

My previous manager that I’m replacing started on £36k + £3500 car allowance with no prior experience and it was later increased to nearly £40k with car allowance.

I’m obviously not happy and feel it’s quite an insult. I don’t want to rock the boat right at the start but feel I’m well within my rights to request my pay be increased I’m just not sure of the best way to go about it as I anticipate I’ll get quite a lot of resistance. Inconsistent pay is currently an issue in this company. Any advice welcome!

Are you a union member? Is there a pay scale? Thet should help you negotiate the best deal.

as I haven’t been a manager previously I went in with the intention of proving myself for 6 months then seeing if it could be negotiated.

If stick with this plan.

So you were happy to accept a post to line manage these people until you knew how much they were paid?

I would never accept a job without negotiating the pay at the outset these days. It’s actually an easier conversation the more you do it.

NEVER agree to terms such as “we’ll review it in six months” as companies always use some kind of get out clause for this.

Do your research on market rates for this role. Make a short list of why YOU should be paid more (use points from your interview preparation).

Then, and I know it’s scary, take a deep breath and phone them to ask for more money!

I’m happy to do the job. Either way for me it’s a great move whether I stay there long term or not. I’ve worked hard the last 10 years to work my way! As stated I went in feeling the pay was low but with the intention of negotiating it after 6 months.

I do however feel it’s unfair to be expected to manage a team of 16 people, regular travel and all the responsibilities for £500 a year more than the staff on the team!

I’m not a union member but a friend of my works for a union and will help if needed. I don’t want to start off on the wrong foot but at the same time I don’t want to be a push over!!

This is a good lesson although it feels like a kick in the teeth right now.
Always know your worth, ask for a bit more than you expect to get. Ask what other benefits are in the table. Next time be prepared.
This time is more difficult as you’ve already agreed your deal, they know your expectations. You can work your socks off but you must be able to demonstrate the differences you’ve made, what changes and improvements have you made, and how does this impact the bottom line. Evidence everything.
You will have to be prepared to find a new role though if they don’t go for it, you’ve weakened your hand this time.
Don’t underestimate yourself ever again.

Oh it’s definitely a steep learning curve. I am more than prepared to leave should I need to.

As I say inconsistent pay is a massive issue for this company especially in the team I’m managing. I think given the situation the best thing I can do is knuckle down, prove my worth and in 6 months evidence why I deserve to be paid more and expect to leave should it not go the way I plan.

You sound very determined!
Try to minimise any feelings of resentment if they arise (I’d be spitting mad if I was you), channel it into efficiency. Make sure everything you do is attributed to you, and keep that six month review in the diary of the key decision makers. Act shocked and surprised if they renege on that meeting.
I’m rooting for you.

It’s worth looking closely at the nature of the team. I get paid close to three times what my line manager does but in this context she provides a tick in the box for HR that I have one and I get on with the work and and when it’s needed, she just organises the rota and leave requests.

Asd without asking for specifics, that’s really interesting. I’m guessing you have a particular skill set, and your manager doesn’t review performance? Are you on a pay scale?

Why are you so happy to undersell yourself for six months?

What would you say though, ItsAlright? If someone agreed a package then tried to renegotiate after starting? (Not being arsey by the way)

Sorry for all the questions, I find pay negotiation and inequality really interesting, please ignore me if it annoys you.

If you've already agreed the package then that ship has sailed I'm afraid.

You should have negotiated hard after they'd offered but before you'd accepted, the point at which your bargaining power is strongest.

Ideally you'd have found out the salary before applying or latest first interview stage.. I can't understand anyone who doesn't do this.

It is not uncommon for a manager to earn similar to direct reports, it all depends on the salary they negotiated at the time, their value to the company, any special skills, length of service, how desperate the company were to fill the position at the time they were hired.

You negotiate your salary on what you belief you are worth and what is fair for the role and your experience, not on what someone else does/has earned. You took the role believing £30k was appropriate for your level of experience as a manager, if it is on the low range of the pay scale you have the opportunity to prove yourself in the role and negotiate an increase in this relatively quickly. It is likely your team is at the top of their pay scales and their opportunities to increase their salaries significantly are much more limited.

I would absolutely encourage the re-negotiation if I found out later on that the agreed salary isn’t fair. In fact I encouraged a friend to do this recently and it worked out in her favour, and at this point her contract had already been signed! “It’s come to my attention that... and therefore I feel that my agreed salary of £x should be increased to reflect.....” and so on.

The thing to remember is that you can’t lose.

If they agree to paying you more - great!

If they say no then you can have a discussion around, ok well what can you offer me? Can you put into the contract that I get an increase of £x in X months’ time? Can you offer me more leave? Can you offer me a WFH day once a week? And so on.

And if they still say no to all of the above, well you’re in exactly the same position as you were originally, so you haven’t lost out.

Research shows that women will not have these pay negotiations and that’s why I am so keen to encourage us to do it. Another friend of mine got an extra £5k the other day and all she had to do was gulp and have that ‘awkward’ conversation.

You have nothing to lose and everything to gain!

Were they not clear on salary being offered when you applied?

When did you find out what the previous manager started on?

Salary was not disclosed within the advert. The application process was a shambles to say the least.

I am yet to receive any documentation, contract etc so I am in a position to go back and query aspects if needed. I cannot stress how disorganised the whole process has been. Before I applied for the job I was offered a pay rise to stay as I had applied for a job elsewhere and they didn’t want me to leave. Even with that pay rise it would seem I was still one of the lowest paid in the department despite having a lot of experience and training the new recruits.

My previous manager left on Friday, she asked me what salary I was offered I told her and she said instantly that it was not enough, told me what everyone else was earning and suggested that I discuss it with my new manager and ask for it to be increased.

Thank you @ItsAlrightAlright

I definitely want to have the conversation just don’t want to start off on a bad note.

Thanks all for the advice

Ah, that information puts it in a new light. It’s great that they’re chaotic, they’re definitely ‘open’ at the moment, definitely go back!

@Herocomplex

Specific skills, no performance management at all in this job (it’s not something I have ever effectively had), just turn up, do the work, go home.

I don’t think my line manager has a clue what I do, but exists purely to tick the box and sort logistics out. I must have spoken to her three or four times in the last year. The organisation as a whole like everyone to have a line manager on paper though.

Thank you, that’s interesting.

@Supermum29 Have you asked yet?

@ItsAlrightAlright I’m on annual leave for two weeks. I plan on tackling it as soon as I get back and officially start. My manager will be down for 3 days so will be the ideal time to have the conversation :)