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Tribunal handhold

58 replies

Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 09:27

Is anyone else going through this? Received final grievance outcome yesterday after months of silence - happy Christmas! As expected was not good. My marriage, family and health have all suffered. I could withdraw it but things are toxic and don't think that would resolve anything. Are things always this bad before tribunal has even started? Not feeling very strong today, been crying all night and had very low thoughts. Rowed with DH. And off to see the big man today. Am feeling like I can't cope with anything anymore but also feeling I can't just walk away. Any advice gratefully received.

OP posts:
flowery · 22/12/2018 09:33

What is the claim you would be making? Are you still at the job?

Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 09:42

Yes still there but signed off with stress. I feel so low today.

Equal pay and sex discrimination

The response to date has been vindictive and bullying.

OP posts:
flowery · 22/12/2018 09:47

Ok. You need to do what is right for you and for your family, and you need to remember that ‘winning’ is no victory if it comes at a terrible cost.

Instead think about where you want to be. If what you want is to be free of this enormous stress, you should focus your efforts on finding a new job, so you can put this huge burden down as soon as possible.

Bombardier25966 · 22/12/2018 09:50

Need more information, on what basis are you claiming not to be paid equally, and why do they say it does not apply? Is this the sole reason, or are there other examples of discrimination?

How long have you worked there? Is the pay difference substantial?

Tribunals can be very very messy. You'd need to consider whether the emotional burden of going through it is worth the potential outcome.

Bombardier25966 · 22/12/2018 09:51

Also how long have you been off sick, and are you receiving any payment?

Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 09:52

You're right. I'm worried about financial impact if I leave with no job. Have spoke to lawyer who thinks bullying for bringing a grievance is just as if not more than bad than the original claim.

Right now I feel whichever way I turn I've lost. Feeling like why did I stand up for myself, even though deep down I couldn't not.

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Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 09:55

Maybe wrong place to post. I can't think straight. Last night I went on a long drive and just parked up crying for a long time. Whichever way I turn there is no hope it feels

OP posts:
Bombardier25966 · 22/12/2018 09:59

Are you getting support from your GP, can you self refer for counselling?

flowery · 22/12/2018 10:13

I genuinely think if this is how you are feeling now, going through a (very) lengthy and stressful grievance process would not be a sensible choice.

What does your solicitor think the prospects are of a settlement if you go to Acas for early conciliation?

flowery · 22/12/2018 10:14

Why do you think this might be the wrong place to post OP?

W0rriedMum · 22/12/2018 10:19

I have great sympathy.
A friend started a claim for unfair dismissal and sex discrimination, and was horrified as HR records started being shared between solicitors. Despite being promoted and getting good performance messages, the background rankings which she never saw told another story. She settled in the end as she couldn't face it and it destroyed her confidence for years.
I hope you can put it to the back of your mind over Christmas. A mediated exit (regarding reference) might be the way to go as it will be hard to return.

Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 10:24

They are not entertaining a settlement despite having done so for others who have had bad performance etc. Lawyer is adding this to bullying behaviour. Lawyer thinks tribunal has 80% success but that it will be very hard on me.

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Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 10:25

Thought wrong place as maybe need emotional support not employment. It appears am getting both Flowers

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flowery · 22/12/2018 10:35

We can do both here Smile

I genuinely think you should think about letting it go OP. It wouldn’t be admitting you were wrong, it would be making a choice about how best to spend the coming months to ensure that you are in a better place sooner.

Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 10:44

Letting go and staying there? I don't think I can after what's been said. And if I go, I'll put my family ubder such financial stress Sad

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flowery · 22/12/2018 10:47

No, letting go and finding another job.

neverknowinglynormal · 22/12/2018 12:06

I have been involved in tribunal proceedings after raising a grievance (which was ignored) for over three years. I still work there because I have no confidence to go for a new job and because 95% of staff are lovely, just the top tier the aren't. I won disability discrimination and victimisation at the first one but appealed an aspect that I lost. Won appeal. Then had to bring a second claim because the victimisation got so bad. Won that on victimisation, discrimination and harassment. It has been beneficial to my self-esteem because my boss is a bully and I have stood up to him. He is treating others better now. I hope he will leave but it is hard at the moment because he is so angry that I have challenged him. I suspect he won't leave. It has been the opposite of beneficial in terms of health and having my life, but I also think I would have been made iller by giving in and accepting my boss's treatment.

I will eventually consider leaving if my boss doesn't when my confidence and health are better.

Good luck. It is hard and a settlement would be better in many ways but my case was less about money and more about principles so they have never wanted to settle because I always wanted an apology as part of it and they have always refused.

neverknowinglynormal · 22/12/2018 12:07

Btw I would be happy to stay there and work with my boss if he would just let me get on with my job. I can let it go if he can. But pigs do not fly!

neverknowinglynormal · 22/12/2018 12:08

You could always go for another job and bring a claim once you have left. That would be easier.

daisychain01 · 22/12/2018 14:54

In practical terms, knowing where you are in the process can give you back control, you are in the driving seat. You have a 3 month deadline to lodge your claim online, counting from when the 'event' happened eg discrimination. It is rare that the Court will extend that deadline.

You have little to lose by lodging your claim, as Tribunal is fee-free. Entering into ACAS Early conciliation is helpful because it forces your employer to reveal their intentions as to whether they are willing to enter into a Settlement Agreement to avoid Tribunal. This depends on whether your Claim is strong.

The key thing is, time will become the driver, due to court deadlines. If they have been using delay tactics to date, they won't be able to keep doing that. Meanwhile, you can pull out right up until the day of Tribunal, without necessarily incurring significant cost You don't need to make any decision for a while yet

I would advise you to seek new employment as soon as possible. It will be good for your morale to focus on the future and it complies with the Court's expectation that you as the Claimant are mitigating Loss. So it's a win-win.

If your contract is for fully paid sick leave, then stay on sick leave. IMO once this type of situation happens it is very difficult to turn back the clock, repair fractured trust and return to work. Better to leave (once you get a new job) and start afresh. Use your sick leave to rebuild your emotional strength, be proud of yourself for surviving thus far, and remember your future life awaits, with rich experiences gained. It is a very challenging time, so give yourself permission to have a few wobbles. Main thing keep focus on the end goal, which depends on what you want to achieve.

Sadatchristmastime · 22/12/2018 19:48

Never - sorry you have been through this. It sounds s though was the right thing to do for you. I, like you, care about the principles more than money.

Daisy - thank you that's given me a lot of comfort. We actually exhausted the ACAS process early on, as they were refusing to investigate the grievance, so I went to ACAS, was a waste of time tbh. They then said they wanted to "continue" investigatung the grievance. I know my claim is string but having wobbles when they are being very vicious - my lawyer says will strengthen my case in the end by is weakening me and my sanity.

OP posts:
daisychain01 · 23/12/2018 05:06

If you haven't yet gone through formal Early Conciliation, via ACAS (which is a mandatory step needed before Tribunal can commence) then you haven't yet fully exhausted all avenues.

EC has to be completed and if at the end of it, your employer states they aren't willing to continue then ACAS issue your certificate.

Just to highlight there are several pressure points your employer has to go through, EC being one. So all is not lost, you just need to stand firm if as you mentioned you have a strong claim.

Sadatchristmastime · 23/12/2018 06:05

Thanks Daisy - sorry I meant we went through EC as they were not addressing the grievance. I was given a certificate but advised they then wanted to complete the grievance process so let them. I appreciate that seems a roundabout way of doing it but I took them to ACAS to address the grievance. My lawyer advised I was best to let them complete grievance (even if after EC) as would look bad on me if I didn't. The whole thing is a long drawn out mess, with lots of delay tactics and bullying.

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Sadatchristmastime · 23/12/2018 06:09

Sorry and to add, he (the lawyer) has out forward that the bullying is ongoing, therefore the deadline has been ongoing...have I explained that well?

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Truckingonandon · 23/12/2018 08:07

I'm amazed that almost everyone on here is advising you to walk away. From what you've said, it sounds like you have a strong case (if you're accurately presenting the facts - people can often be somewhat blind about their performance etc. not saying you are btw....). Grievances are tough and you have to have grit and resilience but fuck walking away when they've treated you so badly. Do you have support from any friends? Someone in your corner holding your hand? You need it, to keep you strong and focused.