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Original poster

"it is unacceptable for men or women to call in because a child is sick in my view."

567 replies

hunkermunker · 15/01/2007 00:29

Xenia says "it is unacceptable for men or women to call in because a child is sick in my view."

I am interested to know what other people do in this situation.

OP posts:
Cappuccino · 15/01/2007 11:02

whereas, CornflakeKid, there are no drugs or crime problems in London and young people spend all their time wandering round Art Galleries and talking about Tolstoy

Tutter · 15/01/2007 11:02

oooh i'm going to be popular here....

before i had kids i have to admit to feeling peeved occasionally when the one or two of us in the team without families were covering for colleagues who (frequently) needed time off (or, more often were "working from home"). it felt unfair.

i know that's incredibly un-PC of me, and if i were working now, as a mum, i'd be the one doing the upsetting, rather than being the upsettee (good word) when ds is ill, but that was the case. and i know it used to rankle particularly with one colleague of mine who knew she never wanted children. so, i doubt xenia is the only person to feel this way...

the one thing i'm surprised about is that as a mum xenia still feels this way - i doubt that i still would

iota · 15/01/2007 11:02

Thanks for worrying about me Twiggy

just off to check whether my washing machine has done its stuff [yawn]

batters · 15/01/2007 11:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Tutter · 15/01/2007 11:03

btw the "occasionally" referred to the frequency with which i felt peeved, ratehr than how often colleagues phoned in - that was, i would say, on average monthly or every other month for each parent

CheesyFeet · 15/01/2007 11:04

Iota

expatinscotland · 15/01/2007 11:09

So NO ONE here has ever thrown a sickie b/c of a hangover, a rough night's sleep (NOT child induced) or just b/c they needed a duvet day?

Yeah, right.

Judy1234 · 15/01/2007 11:10

Tutter, I am not sure I gave a view except in the context of someone who is in one of those shed loads of money jobs where at that pay you need to ensure you have child care, back up of child care and back up of back up. My sister by the way who earns the average wage was able to call an nanny agency to send someone in for a day to look after her sick child recently.

In the context of less well paid jobs then you do whatever your employment contract says. Some jobs don't pay you in the first 3 days if you're off sick. Others give you full pay if you're off sick and may be even if your child or dog is sick. It depends on the job too and if that employer's set up and profits and your colleagues can manage. It's impossible to generalise.

The more interesting question is should parents lie and say they're sick wen their child is which is what many many parents do every day. They lie because if they're sick they get paid. If their child is sick it's no different from needing to wait in for the gas man (where you have to take a day's holiday).

Tutter · 15/01/2007 11:12

how do you know how much i earned or didn't earn xenia?

CheesyFeet · 15/01/2007 11:16

Xenia, I take your point about lying to get paid. It's not on but it is tempting when you live from month to month financially and, as expat says, non-parents pull sickies too for different reasons.

Also I would like to add that there's no such thing as a nanny agency where I live. Even if there was, I still have to pay dd's nursery fees even when she's off ill so I can't afford the double whammy anyway.

FairyMum · 15/01/2007 11:17

I work in the city in a major investment bank and of course I take time off when my children are sick or DH does. I am in a management position and I can tell you that the people I manage who have the least time off throughout the year are the parents. Their time off tend to be time off for child emergencies such as sickness, but they hardly have any days off for own sickness, doctor appointments etc. In fact I just had a look at some timesheets done by HR and the parents in my team have 1/3 of the time off for sickness compared to non-parents. Parents needing so much time off is a myth!

Cappuccino · 15/01/2007 11:20

the gas man doesn't need you to hold a bowl under his face

so you can theoretically make more efficient use of your time

Caligula · 15/01/2007 11:21

Even where people earn shedloads of money actually, it is not reasonable to expect them to neglect their children when their kids need them.

I don't really get this implication that if you're on a low wage, it's not quite as important to be an honest reliable employee. Or that if you're on a high wage, you're less entitled to a reasonable work/ life balance.

kandi · 15/01/2007 11:22

Xenia, I hear what you're saying about equality etc, that why should women take time off sick and not men. But surely, in reality, a mother's maternal instinct will almost always be to care for her sick child, I really don't see what job could be more important than that? But ok, some high paid jobs demand more of you in return for a high salary, but really men don't really FEEL the same way about sick children. I mean my DH adores DD and would do anything for her, but when she is ill, really all the extra love and attention, and all the practical stuff, cleaning sick, giving neurofen, whatever, it all falls to me. And I wouldn't have it any other way, I really wouldn't.

BTW, a friend (and former colleague) of mine who was on long-term sick leave, really down and really unwell, her husband would take time off sometimes when she really needed him. And as far as I know his colleagues totally applauded him for it.

Caligula · 15/01/2007 11:22

People pretend to be sick for the gasman as well.

Whether they have kids or not.

I once threw a sickie to go to job interview in my dim and distant childless youth

flutterbee · 15/01/2007 11:28
  1. Taking time off for sick children is fine. it was when I didn't have any and is now I do.
  1. Taking time of and lying about it is up to the individual as it is their risk, we have all done it and will probably do it again. Also isn't taking time off and lying about it the same regardless of whether you have kids or not. Why did having kids have to come into it?
  1. People will always find something to moan about, especially the type of people0 who feel hard done by and as if the world is out to get them. For example when I was pg with DS some of the people I worked with complained about me going off to appointments and then went on to complain about me taking my full entitlement to maternity leave.

Where does it end? Should we live to work or work to live?

MamazonAKAfatty · 15/01/2007 11:30

only read the OP

I sort of agree with Xenia.

most large city firms are still very much male dominated. When i woman reaches a position of authority/responsibility within that firm she does so by being not just as good but better than her male counterparts.

For her to then have to take time off for childcare reasons just brings back the same old "women shouldn't do this type of job" arguments.

Of course there are times when it is a necessiy to be with your child. I had to give up my own career to care for my child.
BUT Xenia wasn't talking about the local shop girl.

My xSIL is a Director at Lehmans. She had a little girl just over a year ago and the first thimng on her mind as soon as she found out she was pregnant was getting my xMIL trained up as a childminder so that she knew she could care for her child even if she was unwell as she was her gran.

Now SIL is no less a devoted mother than any of us here but her job is equally important. she spent hour after hour slogging her guts out top get where she is and why should having a child stop that.
Your husbands all continue with their careers and still claim to love your children deeply...what is the difference? do you love your child more than they do?

The simple fact is that SIL earns far more than her partner so if ever one of them had to stay home and care for their daughter (she has sorted it so that this isn't a problem) it would be her partner not her that takes time off.

As i say, i don't necessarily agree with everything Xenia says but i can sometimes agree with what she is trying to say.

now im off out so don't shout as me cos i can't answer

themildmanneredjanitor · 15/01/2007 11:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FairyMum · 15/01/2007 11:31

My answer to Xenia would be yes parents should lie if they get a difficult time at work if they tell the truth. IMO it's the workplace putting parents in an impossible situation and forcing them to lie. I think we should get some form of legislation in place which entitled parents to a certain number of paid days off work a year for child emergencies. I don't see this as parental rights, I see it as children's rights.

Pablothelittleredfox · 15/01/2007 11:31

Only read OP but I'm baffled!

What is the alternative?

expatinscotland · 15/01/2007 11:33

Exactly, Caligula 11:22:20 post!

That's what I was meaning.

All these people on their high horse about those incredible slackers who have lied to their employer and thrown a sickie.

Get a grip!

It happens all the time.

themildmanneredjanitor · 15/01/2007 11:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MamazonAKAfatty · 15/01/2007 11:33

But then people would abuse those "emergancy days" for hangovers or dentists appointments or whatever.

current legislation means that you are entitled to take time off for child sickness or childcare issues, it is unpaid to try and deter people from taking it unecessarily.

Cappuccino · 15/01/2007 11:33

Caligula agree entirely about the low/ high wage thing

Xenia's point assumes that you are earning mega-bucks for this kind of loyalty. There are plenty of people who are very 'important' in sectors such as the charitable sector, arts sector, who don't earn these fantastic salaries but are just as vital to what is going on

any sector deserves a good work/ life balance and enough respect for their employees to realise the importance of their own lives.

think the point that parents actually have less time off is v intereseting

FairyMum · 15/01/2007 11:33

Remember that people in low-paid jobs can be just as needed and important at work as a director on a very high salary.