Employing a nanny - advice needed

[Sheila]

I've recently become a single parent and have decided I need to return to full-time work (I work 2 days at the moment) so that I can be as financially independent as possible. To that end I start a new job in October that means a move out of London to Cambridge. Ds (aged 2) goes to nursery at the moment but I think since I'll be on my own and working full-time I'll need the flexibility of a daily nanny (no need to get him out of the house in the morning, less time off for sickness etc). BUT, I've always been very wary of employing a nanny, due to hearing horror stories of neglect, and from seeing some very disinterested nannies at 1 o clock clubs. I suspect I may be an anxious employer!

So, my questions are these: how have those of you with full-time nannies found the experience and do you have any tips for finding the right person? Has anyone had to make this transition (from part-time to full-time work, nursery to nanny) or anything like it? It's going to be a hard time for both of us I think. On a more practical note, can anyone recommend an agency in Cambridge?

Many, many thanks in advance for all info.

KatyW - it sounds like it is time to move on. no matter how good she was originally it sounds like she is now taking the michael. There are a lot of great, nice nannies out there looking for jobs at the moment. You should, legally, have given her a statement of the main terms of her contract within a month of her starting work (you don't actually have to sign a contract with her) and that should have included notice provisions. However, since you haven't, 4 weeks notice is market standard so if you pay her in lieu of notice you can ask her to stop work immediately.

Depending how bolshie she is, though, you might want her to work the 4 weeks - if you sack her nicely enough. "Its been a great 18 months, we really appreciate your work, but I think what you are looking for in a job and what we can offer you have diverged - car etc - but we'd love for you to stay for the next 4 weeks and help us find your successor". I've done that a couple of times and actually got a great notice period out of it. Especially if you point out to them that it is easier for them to find a new job if they are in another one, and that you will agree for reference purposes that she is leaving because the scope of the job has changed and it was a good time for both parties to move on.

KatyW, sounds to me like it is definitely time to move on. Failing to provide a daily diary, a range of activities and a varied social circle for your child all suggest that she is not taking her job seriously, particularly if you haven't seen any improvement after your comment at Chhristmas. It is most definitely a good time now in London to find a Nanny as there have been a lot of job losses in the last six months or so. Good luck.

Katy, before you chuck out the baby with the bathwater, so to speak, bear in mind that this nanny has been your ds's main carer for the last 18 months ? he won't be able to remember a time when she wasn't around and it'll be a big upheaval for him to change carers. We had a nanny once who ate all our food, invited her friends round to eat all our food and was rude to my friends on the telephone, but she was fantastic with ds, and ds loved her, so we put up with as much as we could. All my friends who have had nannies have similar gripes ? they're an odd breed (no offence to any nannies reading this ? some of you are wonderful, nice, normal people, I'm sure ).
How was your nanny when you had your "chat" before Christmas? Did she go along with what you said or was she defensive? Is it worth having another chat and laying down the law about some specific things?
I do sympathise, though, I think having a nanny is one of THE most difficult employment relationships.

BTW I was a nanny for a short time, many moons ago, and once, through no fault of my own (a double articulated John Lewis lorry rammed into the back of me) wrote off their car. I couldn't believe how unsympathetic my employers were! (Not saying you're like this, by the way! )

We've gone from child minders to nursery to a nanny and must say I love having a nanny. We're fairly laid back and leave her to get on with things but she's brilliant - I was v specific about a diary which is done every day and our nanny always calls/discusses with us anything slightly out of the ordinary. Our nanny has gone travelling for two months - back next week and we've had a temporary replacement who wasn't as experienced but again has been brilliant and tries SO hard to please. Not as tidy as our first nanny but I'm not anyway. We've always used an agency - yes, expensive, but they do all the leg work re police checks, references and a good agency sends you good people. One agency sent me far too many people - desperate to get the fees. I'd say have a chat at length with the nanny and see how she interacts with your ds/dh, the agency will give you a briefing sheet and a contract that you can adapt. Ask obvious questions and go by your gut feeling. I like outdoorsy people - want the girls out at least once a day and like a nanny circle - my eldest has got brilliant friends through this and it stops the nanny getting bored. Specify if you want them to do the childrens' washing and any other tasks. I don't ask for any housework as I want the nanny to entertain/look after the girls. I think anything in moderation is good - ie maybe a video, cake etc occasionally. Our nanny adores our girls and buys them ridiculously expensive presents for birthdays etc. Nannies come to our house quite a lot and that's fine. Have said don't want too many children around (ie more than six) but the nanny doesn't either. Can't recommend enough - relieves masses of stress if you work full time and a good nanny loves your children. I involve the nanny as much as possible in any decisions re schools etc (got our permanent nanny to interview our temporary nanny) or any problems re sleep/cheekiness. They're professionals and give great help and advice.

Thanks for your replies - she partly went along with what I said at Christmas, but it's the general atmosphere that she's doing me a really big favour by looking after my son. For example when I said that I didn't count going to the shops/post office etc as a trip out for him (often the only trip out of the day - this is why I want her to fill in a diary), she countered with, well I don't get a lunchbreak to do things like that (even tho' ds sleeps for 2 hours). I want to come home from work and find an enthusiastic nanny with stories to tell me of what they've done, not just 'oh nothing really...'.
Rosie - I do take on board your comment as I know ds loves her and I think this is why I'm so angst ridden about it, but he doesn't bite or kick anyone else, and I just think that he's bored.

I was very sympathetic about the car, and she was very upset (and I didn't tell her how much it cost to fix it), but I later heard stories from elsewhere that she'd tried to move a sofa in it! So my patience started wearing a bit thin. Best comment was 'now I have to take the bus, it takes an hour out of my day that I don't get paid for !!'

I feel encouraged by your comments that there are other nannies out there (bit different from 2 years ago!) and I've placed an ad in Simply Childcare. Anyone who knows a nanny looking for work in Hammersmith area, please let me know !

Good luck KathyW. I get the impression from your comments that she is letting your son down with her lack of enthusiasm for outings etc. If a car is that important to her, then she would be better off finding a job that comes with one.

KatyW

Strangely enough, just given my nanny her 3 month notice last night. I am expecting my second on 30 May, her last day of employment ( how brave is that ) and have decided to take as long off as possible ie: a year and maybe not go back to work.
So a nanny is an expensive luxury we cannot afford.

She has looked after our son since he was 5 and a half months ( now just passed a year and a half ). She sounds like the opposite to your nanny, she is energetic, enthusastic, they are always out doing things - going to the park, the library, toddlers groups and if the weather is bad then they do cooking and art !! Never known her to read a magazine or watch TV while looking after DS. Presently they are making posters of the letters of the alphabet. Our son has thrived in her care and I have no problems with recommending her.

She lives in the Shepards Bush area. We have paid her £350 PW net. She doesn't drive, which isn't a problem for us as she is very happy walking or if needs to taking the bus.

Anyway, if you are interested then get Tech to give you my email address. Don't know if I quite want to chuck this at her now - but certainly, no doubt when she has got over the shock of being made redundant ( this was a change of our initial plans which involved me going back after 3 months ) she will be looking.

No doubt I'll be looking for advice on being a SAHM shortly....

Kaz33

Kaz33, your situation is similar to mine. I will be giving our Nanny three months notice next month. She will be leaving us when I give up work when (all going well) I will be 29 weeks pregnant with number three. How did she take the news? I am dreading it already.

Bells2

Actually she took it very well.

I don't think she was that suprised as she sort of knew that I wasn't happy at work. But it was a total change of plan as we had originally said that we would like her to stay whilst I was on maternity leave and then when I returned and look after both of them.

She said that she was always sad to leave her charges and she would probably go home and have a good cry. She said that she would like to keep in touch with us and our DS. Her biggest concern was that it was something that she had done and I assured her that wasn't the case - we would give her great references.

This morning she was fine with us, with no sign of any resentment. I suppose it comes with the job description moving on after short periods of time. She views her job as a profession and so dealt with her redundancy very professionally.

Good luck Bells2 - is this also a change in plan or do you think she is expecting it ?

kaz33

Bells2 I must have missed an announcement - congratulations!

Congrats from me too Bells.

bells - how fantastic. Am curious to know, what are your current views on returning to work with three small children?

Many thanks. Sml2, I am chucking it all in!!. I have been very unhappy in recent months. My long hours and DH's even longer hours have left me feeling I just don't have enough time for my two, let alone all the household chores. We just don't have enough flexibility in our lives and it's been getting us down. After around a year or so, I would like to try and do something one / two days a week but I'll see how it goes.

Kaz333, our Nanny has no idea I'm expecting let alone that I would give up work (she will be amazed). She will be devastated to leave DS whom she has looked after since he was a tiny baby but I suspect that she will take it on the chin. I hope we are right in thinking that it's a good idea to give her maximum notice in order to find something else.

Bells2 - exactly the same as me, I want to work 2 or 3 days a week in the long term but in the short term want to look after my family. Think its the hormones but i get quite emotional about it - especially with my mum who thinks I'm mad to give up a well paid job...

We decided that it was best to give the nanny as much notice as possible ie: to treat her with respect, the way we'd like to be treated ourselves. Certainly she appears to have reacted postively - though of course its only been one day. Our employment contract does however require three months notice in any event - yours may not.

If you are unhappy with the way things have been at work then your nanny has probably picked up on it. She is going to want the best for you as a family.

Funny you should say that Kaz33 as I know my Mum is disappointed with my decision. She had four children and was a politician and I can't remember a time when her career wasn't important to her.

Now that is an opening for me I'm afraid Bells2.

My mother had my brother and me very young and had to put her own career plans on hold. Although she did become a teacher and later a solicitor, she obviously wanted me to have the choices that she didn't have. Education has always been the way forward for my parents. They are very strong willed and I was certainly heavily pushed into my present legal employment. Her ideal would for me to become a partner in a city law firm - that is so not going to happen !

My father though not a politician also has quite a high public profile.
Having sacrificed quite a lot to get to their present position I think its hard for my parents to admit that maybe it wasn't worth it. I want something very different for my family.

My mother knows that I am not happy in my present employment and is I think trying to understand that I need something different. However, it is hard for her to deal with. I am trying to include her in my thought processes and ask for her input as she is very important to me. I find by not shutting her out, as I have done in the past, but admitting my insecurities we are able to have a relatively civilized conversation about a me leaving the law.

I have absolutely no idea whether I am suited to being a SAHM in the long term but I sure do know that I do not want to continue what I am presently doing.

Gosh that was hard - I've gone from asking about advice on buggies to posting really personal stuff for me.

Kaz33 That's mumsnet for you!!

I've been reading thsi thread with interest as I have a nanny who is brilliant, she's been with us a year and I couldn't imagine her not around. However we have already let her know she will need t find a new job in Jan next year as our eldest will be going to school, do you think this is enough notice

Thanks again Batters. That's interesting Kaz33 as I don't often come across women whose parents put a lot of emphasis on them developing a career. My dad was a Barrister so between my parents, they always worked very hard.

I too suspect that I am not really cut out to be a SAHM in the long term but like you, know that I am unhappy with my present situation and so intend to give it my best shot.

Crunchie - I make that over ten months notice, think that's more than sufficient. Couldn't work out if you were being a little tongue in cheek there ! Have you started to think about all the money you will save when she leaves?

Mumsnet addiction I'm afraid - now where was that other thread.

Bells2 - I must admit I can't really work out why I don't think that I am cut out to be a SAHM - I am perfectly capable, active, sensible, able to network... so whats the problem. Is it because I'll get bored, won't be able to deal with the stress ? Are all SAHM's somehow mentally defective ? ( obviously not )

I suspect its because my mum told me that I didn't want to be a SAHM, my family is quite serious, not really used to kids ( well i'm getting the idea now ).

So, I've decided that I'm going to be a great SAHM and really enjoy it. Long term I will probably have to work because of money - though this month I am going to try and run the family budget on my DP's earnings - to see if it can be done. Last night, I found myself in Sainsburys looking at the price of orange juice.

I think what I'm trying to say is that our attitude towards own abilities are very much influenced by our background and experience - not actually our abilities. So go into the experience positively - you might love it. If I do, then I'm going to do my utmost to keep at it.

bells,
You do sound happy about that decision! But there is certainly a moment to draw the line, and it sounds as if you have reached it. My mother is the complete opposite, she hoped I wd do as she did and stay at home, with consequent horrified tutting at my continued career....parents, honestly...oh god, I am one myself..

kaz33 - I think lots of people carry their parent's expectations- and if that has been for a great career etc etc then it can be hard to leave. Dh certianly gets some pressure form his family. We're both oxford graduates (although his family don't seem too worried about me not working - lol). DH is a solicitor- used to work in the City. However when we had ds2 we found that it wasn't really compatible with city life so he moved to a (good) regional firm. He still works hard, but can come home for lunch/bathtime/meetings etc more easily. It's made a huge difference. His Mother though doesn't get it. When ds1 was diagnosed as autistic dh was still working in the city- she said "now you'll have to work really hard to become a partner" no no no!!!! DS1 needs his daddy around. We want to send ds2 to a Steiner school so he isn't tracked into a profession I think that professions still carried a lot of weight in our parent's generation- attidues and aspirations have changed. I'd like to work again sometime- but at the moment it isn't compatible with ds1's needs. My life hasn't gone the way I thought it would at all, but I've done things I would never have imagined doing. I've lost the point I was making but now I have to go and start work (internet teaching for channel 4- 2 hours a week- doesn't really count )

bells - congratulations, didn't realise you were pregnant

I think I would like to give up work or work PT. No what I want is to really give up. BUT I honestly carry such a guilt thing from my bloody mother who does remind me that she didn't have the chance to go to university to further her career blah blah blah. Anyhow I know both my parents are so proud of the progress I have made within the company and cannot believe the salary I am on (I cannot believe it - I was the thickest one at uni, and know I am on miles more than anyone in my class). - I am baffled that thicko me ended up where I am.

Also I have just returned to work from ML. And part of me thinks I would be letting the children down too. I know my love of material objects/status symbols - the sole reason for staying on. (Embarassing I know.)

Dont want to go on. But it is a brave decision to cut that work cord. I would be useless as a SAHM anyhow. Feeling quite low now. And it's only Tues, 3 more work days left. AND DH is away this week and I am on my own at night.