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Original poster

Working mothers lambasted again!!

266 replies

Missmibaby · 04/10/2005 11:26

Has anyone seen The Times today? Yet more articles telling us that wokring mothers are bad for their kids development. Isn't it funny how all the examples they use are middle-class women who left well-paid jobs, who are married to husbands with extremely well-paid jobs: bankers, lawyers, media-types. One of the headlines was that a woman didn't go back to work until her children were ten years old. The article then went to explain how she worked from her attic whilst employing full-time nannies! Real world? Not for most of us. I am the main wage-earner in our house. My DP is on £20,000 per year and our mortgage is c.£10,000 per year. What little luxuries would anyone recommend we cut back on if I were to give up work. Beleive me I do nothing but think about my son all day, I would love to be with him. I have another on the way and am trying to think of ways that I can work less. My son has always been cared for by well-chosen loving people. The childcare arrangements have changed very little inhis short life and I think he is a well-balanced, sociable, well-advanced little boy. I think the most important thing that he has in his life is that I love him to bits and I make sure he knows it!! Sorry for the rant I know it's not mumsnet faultbut but these generalisations make me so

I don't think women who stay at home are better or worse than women who go to work. It's how they treat thei kids that matters.

OP posts:
bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:39

Having nannies doesn't have to interfere with attachment though does it? I know quite a few people who have adopted and it seems to me that - just as in the case of biological parents- every situation is different. Children come at different ages, with different life histories and (just as ih the case of biological parents) different situations suit.

I sent ds2 to nursery at 2- all things being equal I would have preferred to wait until he was 3, but his elder brother (who was at home a lot) is severely autistic and ds2 was beginning to act very strangely- plus he was quite isoalted as we can't visit other families easily. Hence he started nursery at 2- and now at 3 and a half goes every day and loves it.. Our individual situation has made me do something differently to my orginal choice and ds2 has thrived as a result.

It's not really fair to single out Issymum like this. from what I understand her children are securely attached so therefore her decision making is the same as anyone elses. As aloha has said there are other factors anyway.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:40

No I am not suggesting that for one minute.

foxinsocks · 08/10/2005 21:41

undercovermum, more people don't admit it because not everyone thinks like you do

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:41

Well I kind of agree with you- but I don't think it has to interefe with working- as long as a child knows and understands that they come before work- that they are more important than work - then I dojn't think it actually matters that they work- or who meets them from school.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:42

I know that there are other factors as, quite rightly pointed out to me, by Aloha. I still feel quite strongly about my points though.

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:43

undercovermum - I think the "issues" do vary from adoptive child to adoptive child though. A friend has adopted two half siblings, one removed at birth, and one removed after 2 and a half years of fairly hideous treatment (don;'t know the details but but know it was bad) and their "issues" vary considerably.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:46

We should be at home for our kids really. To say that we are working for a better house/nicer school/whatever is a con. We are doing it for ourselves because none of us wants to downgrade our lives for something like 'children'. Anyone who doesn't have to work, obviously this is not for you. But the rest of us - are selfish.

I mean how many of you would consider moving from your 3 bed to a 2 bed flat so you could be a SAHM mum?

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:46

I do think in certain cases you are right undercover mum (can think of a RL one where the mum is a SAHM but has kind of messed up a lot on nurseriy choices for her adoptive child etc imo - but she's messed up a lot with her biological child as well- again purely imo) but I do think it is unfair to assume that is the case for every adoptve family- as the children and their experiences appear to vary so widly. I just don't think you can generalise- and really not fair to make assumptions when you don't know the family concerned.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:47

Then those children need ongoing care from one 'mummy'.

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:49

undercovermum- I've come from the position of not being able to work (have a severely disabled eldest child- no childcare) for years- am now venturing out one day a week (which having 2 other children makes life interesting- far too many people involved for it to run smoothly!). TBH I think getting out has made a difference to me and I'm sure it will be good for mu children if I work- providing- and I mean this - that they know and understand that they always come before mummy's work. Then, I think there is no problem.

soapbox · 08/10/2005 21:50

Yes - guilty as charged

And I don't give a flying f*ck what you or anyone else might think of my choices.

My children are extremely able, happy and well adjusted with futures full of opportunity.

Lucky them - lucky me

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:50

Bakabat, I agree and Issysmum I am truly sorry as I didn't know your circumstances.

What children need is love and ...this is the word ... stability from one set of parent/s.

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:51

oh but undercovermum it's getting confusing as I'm talknig about severla different famileis- the mum with an adoptive child and a biological one who has made some- hmmm- unusual choices has lots of issues in every area of life tbh- she;s not a good example as you can say "she should" almost everywhere. Believe me she could do 1001 things differently

roisin · 08/10/2005 21:51

Undercovermum - I just don't understand where you're coming from. You clearly feel very strongly about this. Yet you are a working mum yourself. I just don't understand.

Do you feel guilty yourself, and are trying to project your guilt onto other people, who do not (and have no reason to) feel guilty?

I have strong opinions about what is best for my boys, and I make sure that is what they get when it is at all possible. But I don't have strong opinions about what is best for other peoples's children - they can make their own choices and decisions.

I really think you are being rather rude.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:52

Soapbox, me too, I use childcare up to 40 hours a week and quite frankly it's a godsend. Still wrong though (not moving into a flat shit or bust)

foxinsocks · 08/10/2005 21:52

well you have your opinion undercovermum.

I notice that fathers who work are not labelled as selfish? Why is that always the case.

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:54

oh-= the mum with the 2 adoptive children - one with a hideous start to life was a SAHM by the way- because she felt her children needed it. But from what I understand the circumstances were pretty extreme.

My dad was away at sea when I was little and my mum worked part time, but I always knew I was first. When I spent a week in hospital she was there etc- (my dad was at sea so had to be her). I always knew I came before work.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:55

Of course I feel bloody guilty. But I know that I am being selfish really. But I can't stand all of this, 'my children know I love them nonsense'. Perhaps they do, but we should be at home.

It doesn't matter what I say. Women these days have to work as hard as men. Most families can't afford to live unless both work. I just don't think it is correct. But there you go.

foxinsocks · 08/10/2005 21:58

well if you really feel like that, then stop working and move into a flat and downgrade. If you don't want to do that, then your feeling that 'women should be at home with their kids till they are 12' is obviously not as strong as your love of your working life/lifestyle and then I have no reason why you even posted what you did.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:58

Because when we were naked and living in caves men were the hunter/gatherers and not much has changed really . Wish my hunter/gatherer earned more then I could go live in a cave and be naked apart from a rabbit skin. And do cave drawings all day.

bakabat · 08/10/2005 21:59

But then you get into the mortgages should only be based on one salary argument- which actually I think would make the world a nicer place- but isn't going to happen.

I disagree that you have to be home when your children aren;t there- although I have no choice as there isn;t anyone who can look after ds1- so if he's home I have to be- so perhaps ignore me!

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 21:59

FIS, because I am truly selfish.

hunkerpumpkin · 08/10/2005 22:09

Only caught the tail end of this thread again, but if we were to move from our two-bedroom house to a two-bedroom flat, we would still both need to work. Or perhaps nobody should live in London near their families and friends?

That's a good plan, actually - yes, we should move to a two-bedroom flat 100 miles away - DH would commute for a couple of hours extra a day, I could stay at home with my children (no friends because everyone's already in groups/cliques and we all know how friendly they are to newcomers) - they wouldn't see their grandparents nearly as often - but heck, I'd be ecstatic because I was a SAHM and that, dear reader, is what we all aspire to.

Is it fuck.

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 22:22

Oh just a quickie Fox, the reason I posted is because if I didn't there wouldn't be a conversation going on. I bet you're not much fun at the Toddler Group if you don't speak unless it's to say Hello/goodby!

undercovermum · 08/10/2005 22:23

Right memo to myself. Stay off of threads which do not encourage dispute.

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