DH has been offered a job in US ~ WWYD

[ablemable]

Sorry if this is in the wrong place, but didn't know where else to put it!

DH is away working this week in US. He got asked to consider working in the US on a permanent basis doing a different job to his current one.

Good pay (substantial amount more than he currently earns) and a decent re-location package.

The thing is he is happy doing the job that he is already doing and its about to take off globally, he will soon start to have more people work for him and gradually over the next 2 yrs he will earn the kind of money that he has been offered for the other job. Plus there is also a strong possibility that he could end up in the US anyway (but not for about 2 yrs!) Also this job has good prospects.

The crunch being -

Does DH take the job in the US now and have the money and life style but not the prospects etc.... And keep his fingers crossed he carries on moving up the ladder.

OR

Does DH wait and see what the job he is currently doing has to offer.

Obviously there are no guarantees that his current job will pan out how he would like/hope to but equally its a huge step/gamble to up sticks and move to the US.

We have 3DC - 16, 12 and 10 ~ they are really excited at the thought of a move etc... so at the moment thats not a problem.

I'd rent out UK home whilst you settle in, keeping options open.

I have no idea if divorce rates are any higher for mobile couples rather than stay at homes. Loads of people get divorced these days whether or not they move.

I'm definitely in the "you've got to live a little camp"

Yes it can be tough but it also has great upsides.

Good luck.

I know loads of expat couples (probably in excess of 50 couples) and none of them are divorced.

The only thing that would worry me .... is my kids meeting/marrying someone over there .... and not wanting to come back with me to the uk if i ever wanted to rtn.

My sister lives in the US .... i miss her ...but i miss her kids more

Are you sure Mme? I know a lot of people who in the surface seem to be happy moving around the world, but if you sit and talk to them about this for a few hours a good percentage of them confess to have had, at least, bad patches.

I think the key to success is that both husband and wife have some rewarding activity while abroad. Hence my suggestion to Ablemable to find what's in it for her before taking the leap.

BTW, when I say bad patches, I'm talking about bad patches originated by the relocation, not the other patches that all and every couple would have regardless of being relocated or not.

Nothing AM has said has indicated that she won't think things through before taking the plunge.

She also doesn't strike me as someone who will sit back and let circumstances get to her.

She won't be sitting at home waiting for her hubby to get in from work every night. She has her children's activities, and will be able to work if she wants to. If she has enough money she can do classes and join groups in her own right.

It's hard if you have a victim mentality or don't have the funds to get out of it. But it is not th American way to just sit back and not do anything other than moan.

The only deal breaker, imo, is to do with the 16yo.

And to add - most of 'life' is the same wherever you are: cooking, cleaning, shopping and working. If physical contact with friends and family in the UK is not high on the priority list, then life isn't going to be that much different.

For the 10% of your time when you aren't doing the cooking, cleaning, shopping and working, there will be plusses and minuses of the activities on offer. Some will be great and others will be hard going. The key to international assignments is to bring the best from your home country, and embrace the best of your host country, and to drop the yucky bits from each.

ablemable - we did less than 2 years ago & i would be happy to give answers to any qs you may have.

things to consider are
'top right' corner of US is expensive to live in - as expensive (or more) as the SE of england, so go online & look at housing prices.

schooling varies hugely, and can fluctuate wildly from town to town. e.g. detroit currently has NO money - they're shutting schools & talking of bulldozing part of the city as they just can't sustain it. we live 40 mins away & have fantastic schools, far better than the state school dd was in in the UK. find out about schools where you'd be & be prepared for 3 x private fees.

find out what kind of visa your dh would be on - some would limit what you could do hugely (i was on one where i couldn't even do volunteer work), and some make it impossible for you to apply for green cards (the right to stay & work indefinitely). it is v worth while finding out those details as they can make a huge difference long term.

relocation may look good, but there's a limit to how much your dh can receive without being hit with a big tax bill.

how often has his co done this? my dh works for a small firm & they helped, but just didn't know their way around the system. friends of ours came over with Ford, who have a relocation officer, so helped them out loads.

remember, you will effectively be starting over again with EVERY aspect of adult life - you'll have no credit rating, so hard to get a mortgage, or even bank account. no idea how heating/plumbing etc works so every single thing you need to do for the house/car etc is learning again from scratch etc. i often tell people that me being in charge of a house is scarily like leaving a 14 year old home alone - in theory, fine, but with only a very hazy idea of what to do if there's a problem.

don't underestimate the emotional side - we never lived close to either set of family, but there's something about not being ABLE to get home that makes it so much harder to cope with. also, US families seem to spend more time together as families, so weekends you are very mucha unit on your own.

assume that you will lose 10% of your current capital - bringing money over costs, and you will have to go through all those 'start up' costs of house finding, cars, driving licences again in one go. even if you keep your UK house & rent, there are agency fees & mortgages cost more (if you can get them) on buy-to-lets.

on paper, our US living style is massively better than if we were in the UK, but i still go through months when i sob almost constantly, even as i tell myself that we're better of (in almost every way) here than in the UK. it took dd (then aged 5) at least a year to stop crying to go back home & she does still miss friends & family.

BUT we do go on fantastic 'vacations' and have a lovely lifestyle. It is a big adventure & we were v much stuck in a rut before we moved here. dh wants to stay here permanently, i am not so sure - i like the idea of a few more years before we go 'home'. however, the uk feels less like home each time we visit, so who knows.

one thing i do know - i am NOT prepared to do this again in a hurry. it took at least a year to feel that we were sorted out, so you not working for a while could be a good thing.

Didn't really think about the relationship probs. SIL & BIL relocated a couple of years ago due to SILs job. After a year of looking for work BIL returned home and 2 years on SIL is having to return with their 2 children (who are cared for 90% by nanny) in order to try and 'save the marriage'. She is not doing this happily but realises it can't work any other way (not in US btw).

WRT relationships, it's togetherness to the teeth and aloneness, also to the teeth -- 'normal' will not describe your lives for a good while.

The working party's every waking moment will be taken over by the company. He will be very engaged in trying to hit the ground running, get up to speed, every other cliche you can think of that indicates a high degree of stress as he tries to settle in at a new job that he really can't just up and leave. He will have to make a 100% effort to get on with it.

Meanwhile you will be dealing with the children and their feelings, schools, the very complicated minutiae of running the house (agree wholeheartedly with whoever said it's like being a 14 year old left in charge) and supporting your very preoccupied H, while there are really only perfunctory inquiries about how you're doing from the few people you will have any contact with.

we're not making it sound good, are we?

i agree with mathanxiety's comments

however, if i knew it was for a fixed term, e.g. 6 years, i would still say yes & do it, if i could go back in time with the knowledge i have now. i'm still not sure about the 'forever' bit - the idea of dd growing up to be really american, marrying an american etc. it feels like such a final ending, really cutting off all our past lives. but then, think how many people have done it before us.

Lots of good advice on this thread already, but nevertheless, I'll add my tuppenceworth.

We moved to New York just over a year ago. DS1 stayed in the UK at boarding school - could that be an option for your eldest child? In our case the school fees are paid as part of the package. He comes out each half term and holiday, so we see him every six weeks or so.

DS2 has not enjoyed New York - I think a big part of that is living in an apartment in a big city: if we were living in a house with a garden where he could go and kick a ball around it would make a big difference to his happiness.

We move around all the time, and have lived in lots of different places. The US has been one of the hardest for me to settle into (and I still don't really feel settled here - dh and I both work, so we have social networks through work as well as ds2's school friends/their parents etc, but it doesn't feel like "home"). In our case, "home" is wherever we happen to be living, but I haven't got that feeling here (yet).

There are of course may good points to living in the US, but I'd advise you to think very carefully and do lots of research first (and a recce if possible).

We moved to the US just over 2 years ago and our lifestyle is fantastic in comparison to what we could afford in the UK. Our house is beautiful and the the Pacific Northwest, in particular Central Oregon, where we live, is just beautiful and perfect for an outdoors lifestyle. However, what math said about the person whose job has taken you out there having to concentrate on that is really true. My dh works long hours, travels occasionally out of state and I sometimes feel like I am just the person who takes care of the house and looks after our very young children. Someone else mentioned the idea of you as couple being reliant on each other for company, especially if you are a bit reserved as I am (dh is even more so!) I would say outside of the two families who moved the same time as we did, I have made around 4 friends and a few acquaintances, though I have been as outgoing and pushy with my phone number as I ever have been in the past. I'm sorry I am being negative - there are parts of this adventure that are absolutely amazing! Like kickass said though, maybe 6 years for me will be enough? I am sure you will have a blast though OP!

For us the biggest impact has really been on our son. dd found moving no problem, made friends where ever we went, adopted an American accent on the plane over, and even our double move (first to New York, on a transfer to an office which then was closed three months later, and then up to BC as we couldn't stay in the States but couldn't really go back to the UK as our home was let, and in any case given the huge upheaval to move we didn't want to "waste" it) but ds was bullied in New York, missed (and still misses) his friends in the UK hugely, and has had his social confidence hugely hit.

We found moving very very stressful, mainly because dh's firm really messed him about, and then the new office was very badly run and the new boss a bully. I hated not being able to work. You can't apply for an EAD (the paperwork to prove you can work if your spouse is on an L1 visa) until you are in country, and then it takes about three months or so to arrive.

On the plus side we found our neighbours very friendly, and the adventurous parts were cool too. Day to day living was pretty similar, except that you don't know anything so you are very dependent on the friends you make to help you, and it can be very dis-empowering, especially f like me you have lived in the same area all your life and are used to knowing how everything works.

School wise it is very area dependent, with local taxes being a large amount of the school's funding. So poorer areas have worse schools (and the catchment areas are very rigid). The school we found for our children was on the face of it very good, but they apparently did not think that bullying happened there, and ds suffered the brunt of that).

It was also very expensive. The costs of the move were high (very poor package, should have told us not to go I guess, but dh really really wanted to) with lots of hidden costs (like having to give deposits to all the utilities and having no credit). Plus we didn't look carefully enough at the taxes plus healthcare costs, which took a very large chunk of dh's salary, so what looked like a good level of pay left us very tight (also letting our house int the UK turned out to be fairly expensive too).

So I would say really really explore all the costs, short and long term and get as much as you possibly can into your relocation package, and the longer term stuff written into your dh's contract (bearing in mind that US worker protection is virtually non existent, you can be sacked on the spot for example, or made redundant with virtually no compensation).

We are very happy now in Canada, but I think we could probably have been just as happy moving somewhere else in the UK, and a lot richer! Looking back I think we might have done better to take six months off and travel the word instead.

Have just sat and re read the whole thread. If I wasn't confused then, I sure am now!!!

I would like to go, but I do know we need to do an awful lot of homework before we decide anything.

DH is on his way home from the States as I type, I know it will be the conversation of the week!

We never do anything on the spur of the moment, so no worries about us just rushing ahead and jumping in feet first and regretting later. LOL

The company is a decent company and we have seen other people take up the offer of re-locating.

Lots of thinking to do and lots of talking!!!

Speak soon

Hi

I was thinking about this thread this morning on the school run and I was getting really annoyed. Have logged on specifically just to post this.....

I know some people are going to hate me for saying this

and I know you are asked for comments so wanted both sides of the conversation

but FFS!

I know moving families and countries can be stressful

but I can't believe some of the pessimism and narrow focus......

yes house prices may go up, yes he may miss a promotion, yes you may get divorced....

..but all these things could happen if you stay put .....and as for the comment about you are only going because you are lonely and don't have friends in the UK.......(!)....(yes I have paraphrased but you get the sentiment).

We have been lucky enough to be relatively mobile....yes its been tough at times....yes its cost us money and cost me many, many wrinkles....

..but as a family we are so much personally richer...

..not in cash or promotion terms (and my carer has suffered to the extent I have had to change it entirely (but I found an alternative that it stretching))

but overall in life experience terms its been great. We have grown and stretched ourselves. The children are richer for it. We all have breadth we didn't have on leaving the UK. We are not here permanently but if and when we return we will be better for it.

Whats the title of that bestseller....(I haven't read it but the title is appropriate here)...

.."Don't sweat the small stuff"

Good luck what ever you decide......

Now please don't flame me if you disagree, I just wanted to put an alternative positive view.

Indaba dons hard hat and walks away.

actually, i agree with indaba.

it's just that a lot of people see that side of things, and it's amazing how much of the small stuff can really get to you. none of us know the op, but if we point out what we found hard, we may pick up something that for her, would be a deal breaker.

i actually think the main thing is whether the job suits the dh. he seems quite work focussed, so if he's unhappy in his work, it could be a major cause of stress, which would seriously impact on the 'life experience' of the entire family.

But I think the main advice here has been: think carefully (and whole raft of issues), get them to give you the best package you can get from them, get the best visa and make sure you can still work if you want, don't burn your bridges.

And don't do it for the money but maybe do it for the adventure.

I agree with much of what you say, indaba.

I don't agree with any of the posters who have said, 'just do it', or those who have said, 'don't do it'.

It's up to the OP to make her own informed choice based on her own feelings, goals, and based on experience of others.

Those of us who live/have lived as expats can share our feelings and experiences, but that doesn't mean the OP is going feel the same way.

If she is doing it for the sole reason that it brings forward and inevitable pay raise by a couple of years, that is probably not a good reason.

If she is doing it because she wants personal growth, then that is a good reason.

Although we are a UK/US family, our home base is the UK. When were were offered a US assignment when our children ranged from age 7 down to newborn, there was no reason not to jump at it. Indeed, we would have regretted it if we hadn't. We knew we would have a lot to lose by going (our established friendships in the UK, and the overall hassle of moving), but had so much more to gain. When we returned to the UK, we picked up our friendships exactly where we left, so overall, it was all gain.

My biggest concern for the OP is her 16yo dd. This does not mean that I don't think she should move, just that she needs to be strategic about it and not to drift into anything or to assume anything. That means working through the immigration system to give the maximum choices (ie to get on the green card conveyor belt at the first opportunity). The educational dilemmas are something that money can be thrown at, if the money is there.

I don't think I have been particularly negative, especially in light of how I have been feeling lately. The OP and her family sound like the type of people who are confident and can make a go of things anywhere and would therefore have a fantastic adventure. Best of luck with your research and decision-making. Let us know what you decide.

Fair point Indaba. It's easy to obsess about the small things and not see the big picture.

However I do think this thread has highlighted some important issues. I have friends in the UK who only see the sunshine and big houses...

For me that's part of it certainly refliflops. When we had the chance of moving to the States everyone I knew (apart from my poor parents) was incredibly positive about it. No one really went through the downsides, and a lot of the assumptions that people made were just wrong. Like living in the States would be cheaper (it wasn't), or the kids would really benefit from the experience (dd has, ds hasn't). I would have loved to have had some really good practical advice and some dos and don'ts, especially about employment law. We probably would have made the same decision, but we might have had more of a safety net in place.

I agree with people that say you need to check your DH's contract - especially how much holiday he gets and how easily he can be sacked. DH works for a UK / US company, and I'm repeatedly taken aback by the difference in employment contracts between people doing an identical job in the two countries, in particular that the US people can be sacked very quickly, and for what seem to be reasons which wouldn't necessarily be acceptable in the UK.

Well Dh and I have talked, cried, screamed and discussed the new adventure that could have happened!

We (more him than me!!) have come to a mutual decision!!

We are not going to go, we have decided to wait and see what happens with DH over the next couple of years! I am so disappointed but at the same time relieved! I honestly would hate to make the wrong decision and poor DD1 really fail big time!

Hey ho, wonder what the future will bring! Hope it happens sooner than later!

The relocation package that would have gone with us us was amazing, including help with selling our house, cars etc..

Medical insurance also would have been included.

I did surprise DH with my knowledge of the US and it ways, normally I leave it up to him to organise things etc....

Thanks everyone who contributed, whether it be positive or negative.

Honestly I am gutted, I was really beginning to get excited over the prospect - i understand and respect DH's reasons

Sorry about the feelings of disappointment. Still it sounds as if it's more of a "not this time" than a "no". I do think you all (well the adults anyway, I'm afraid we decided on behalf of our children) have to be 100% up for a move of this magnitude.