If passport says female

[SpringCalling]

I feel like i should know the answer but I don’t! My friends’ trans son has changed their name by deed poll and has a new passport where sex is now shown as female. They do not pass as a woman. Currently they hardly leave home but hopefully that will gradually change over time. I am just wanting to know if the passport change means they can access female only facilities if challenged? Asking as their mental health is so fragile I’d think they need to be well prepared for whatever is the likely outcome.

... the fact that he seeks reassurance from a piece of paper just shows how desperately immature and deluded he is. That's really sad - there's no need for anyone to be unsympathetic or aggressive to his face, but I will not be told by anyone that this is anything other than craziness. I don't tell lies.

Let's be realistic, do you show a passport when you go to the toilet? No. A young male entering the women's toilets is just that, he's not going to whip out his passport and then everyone accepts him in there.

There isn't a law preventing men from going into women's only spaces. The police can't arrest them for that, but they can be arrested for other behaviour.

The equalities act basically protects businesses from being sued. For instance if he walked into a women's toilet, the business could demand he leave, previously he could've sued them because he's legally female, now he can't sue them as the definition of sex has been clarified.

If he wanted to join the WI, the WI can now tell him "no", previously if they said "no" he could bring a lawsuit under the equalities act.

... all true, but as his mother I'd be telling him that he was not welcome there.
Pedants' Point: it's The Equality Act, not 'equalities'

@RareGoalsVerge

(Apologies for the slow reply, limited screen time. Due to disability stuff, to be clear, I’m not of an age where I’m having things confiscated!)

The point is that an individual feeling discomfort or even distress about using the correct toilet facilities isn’t an access need. It’s one of the - many - reasons people identifying as trans need REALLY robust MH support; & arguably a reason to provide single-person gender-neutral toilets in addition to accessible ones; but it does not constitute an access need.

I’m looking at accessible toilets as a potential battleground, frankly: disabled people got wheelchair spaces on buses by fighting for them; then spent decades having to defend those spaces from people with pushchairs & bus drivers who weren’t interested; & even now, with it settled legally, wheelchair users get left behind at bus-stops (sometimes featuring horrified pram-wrangler shouting at the driver as she realises & the driver accelerates away) & drivers feel free to make it clear we are an inconvenience. Now it’s loos - already viewed as fine to use for all manner of reasons by a surprising number of people - that need defending as being a resource for people who require them rather than desire them.

I think it is also important for a scenario like this that as well as acknowledging that mental health should be cared for - there is also an opportunity to reassure... men don't tend to experience any form of violence from men in the loos - so no need for a man pretending to be a women to feel unsafe in the men's loos - no-one is interested, they can come in and pee and leave and even wearing the most 'outrageous' of women's outfits there is unlikely to be any comment...

If there were a strong belief that men cause violence to women in loos and this was a reason for 'trans women' who are now 'women' (so they argue) to avoid going into the men's loos in case of violence against them - then that strong belief would apply even more to men going into women's loos - and thus the trans community would have to admit that a 'trans woman' (i.e. man) in a women's space is far from ideal

so the trans community is confused - they can't argue strongly that they are in danger in men's loo's as it simply supports the argument of women against them being in women's spaces...

but equally it is difficult for them to argue no danger, because then there is no reason to go into the women's loos - the men's loos will be fine!

and to argue the truth that they want to be in women's spaces as men to validate their charade / or for more nefarious reasons is of course the truth that can not be spoken.

tough logic call for them - all because there is no underlying logic to a man claiming to be a woman!

the reality of course is that there is risk when men are in women's spaces which is why a 'trans woman' (man) should not be in women's loos (risk for the women) and has no issue being in men's loos (no risk as man in man's space)

wow there is a bit of a headache in all of that - much simpler of course to go back to men with men and women with women!

so, back to this lad - it is worth reassuring him that as he will clearly be seen as a bloke, whatever he wears - he will have no issues in the men's loos!