Khadija Patel support thread

[LabubuTERF]

Khadija recently won the British Citizen award for empowerment. She wears a niqab.

Unfortunately, the response she has got online is disgusting. Even many supposed supporters of women’s rights are attacking her.

This thread is to hopefully support and encourage Khadija.

https://x.com/talktv/status/2082150667045507430?s=46&t=p6GESSn09HWHVXYgTLIbJg

I think you are clearly unaware that the sort of rabid comments that have been made on this thread means that many women choose to wear the niqab because they are fed up with white people telling them what they can or cant do.

Seriously if you are not aware of how this sort of judge and jury by complete outsiders of a community just back fire you really need to wake up.

You aren't helping any one.

And if as you think she is just some hapless product of male oppression how does attacking her help her be empowered.

It is just as obnoxious that the grotesque white male standard of what is feminine means we know have many young white women walking round in clothes that until a few years ago would have made most people assume they were prostitutes.

Just because there isn't an overt statement sent out by men telling women how they should dress to suceed or be praised doesn't make it any an issue that women do not have the freedom of choice that men have in any community

This bizarre endless insulting of women for no other reason than the community they are born into has about as much to do with feminism as quoting Boris Johnson.

Thanks OP for raising awareness about a woman who has been given an award. And having the empathy to point out the double standards in this country.

I think it is inappropriate to drag how a woman dresses into a discussion of a specific achievement of hers if it was not considered to be part of the achievement. And there's no excuse for spiteful racist comments even if it was.

However, stepping back from this particular issue, I think this country needs to take some serious thought about its stance on women's rights and draw, or reconfirm, some ethical lines in the sand. Relativism is a slippery slope and no woman in the UK should be de facto a second class citizen just because her family, community or ideological subculture thinks she should be.

Basically what you're saying is that women in niqabs are free to wear what they want without judgment or criticism but also they do it to annoy white people and besides, young British women dress like prostitutes anyway.

How feminist of you!

I don't like the niqab either, but why do you think there are so many women in this country who won't leave the house without makeup? Why do so many women shave their body hair? Why do so many women feel the need to wear a bra even when they don't need the support? Let's not pretend our culture doesn't also control women's appearance to a huge extent. If you only get angry when Muslims do it, that starts to look racist.

Do we get beaten or put in prison for not wearing make up or a bra?

Has she stated that she chose to wear the niqab entirely freely? Growing up in the 80s my Muslim friends were under a lot of pressure from their families to cover their hair in certain situations - they didn't do it if they could avoid it.

As an adult a friend of mine was told she was bringing shame on the family for not wearing a headscarf. That in the early 2000s when they were usually worn loosely.

Now I see many women/girls with only their face showing or only their eyes. The cheerful sparkling Indian dress shops have been replaced with ones selling drab brown, grey and black outfits.

Now we're supposed to celebrate a young woman "empowering girls" at a club for sports but she won't even show her face?

One of the comments that has been quoted here is pretty obviously someone outside the uk trying to stir up trouble. It sounds American but so would Russian or Iranian bots. It's likely that many of the worst comments are in that category since Britain is, on the whole, a pretty tolerant society.

She should not be subjected to abuse for what she chooses to wear any more than someone else should be criticised for their skimpy clothing or full face of make up. If it's not actually indecent do what you want.

However I cant support someone who chooses to wear niqab. I see it as a statement of not liking British culture, not wanting to be part of British society. It's not a religious requirement, it is a rejection of the country you live in.

There is a nasty stink to this of 'people are only acceptable if they look and behave Like Us'.

At which point, you might as well sign up with Farage and Tommy Robinson. Are we culturally diverse and tolerant in this country or not?

Is bullying and hating on this woman likely to do anything to increase the freedoms of women particularly of her cultures, or just alienate them and add to division? The whole 'just abandon your culture, faith, values, family and everything else on the spot because I told you my stuff about middle class rightthink on patriarchy (with no idea of your culture or your stuff) and you should be what I think you should be' is really pretty much just more patriarchy.

Farage and Tommy Robinson want to send people away. If you cant see the difference between that and people should not force a different culture on the country you live in more fool you. You are a Farage enabler. Niqab is not a religious requirement.

I'm not sure it's ok to bully someone like this for being different so long as you don't want to actually deport them?

I'm not sure where 'Farage enabler' came from. There are rungs on the ladder of prejudice and I have concerns about the growing divisions that come really from 'this person should be (made to be) more like me'. We see that same value come out in activism, for example that women who can't or won't undress with men should be bullied/excluded until they get with the group who see themselves as the 'right thinking' ones.

While I agree that the response on line to Khadjia has been disgraceful. I think you're heading for the other extreme.
Are we culturally diverse and tolerant in this country or not?
I think the question is not either /or but how we set boundaries. Do we just shrug and say whatever floats your boat.
Do we accept FGM, polygamy, the concept of 'honour' held by some groups?
I simply do not accept that the niqab is just clothing. It is linked to the most fundamental connection between humans, the face.
Face covering seems to have only 2 origins - deceit (as in disguise), and patriarchy as in the protection of a valuable possession.
I can't even begin to imagine a world in which everyone hid their faces to anyone outside the family.
Cultures are plastic, habits and norms change over time but it is not something that is an obligation of a host community to change on demand. That is not tolerance it's capitulation. The niqab is culture not Islam, it's not a religious requirement.

I don’t know if she wears the niqab under family pressure or through free choice, but anything that normalises the wearing of this oppressive and dehumanising garment is to be discouraged, not commended.

Like PPs I seriously question the motives of a young free woman who thinks this is empowering when so many women in the Muslim world have it used as a weapon against them.

I agree that the niqab is problematic. However, why are people letting that debate overshadow the good work that Khadija has done?

Should she carry the weight of the world on her shoulders?

Is she responsible for how some Islamic cultures treat women?

No and no.

If a white British woman working for the BBC had won an award, would people on here be blaming her for Jimmy Saville and Huw Edwards? No, they wouldn’t, so leave Khadija alone!

I agree. She is not actively promoting the compulsory wearing of the niqab therefore it isn't relevant.
She is makiing a real contribution to women and girls health and sense of achievement.

This!

You "agree that the niqab is problematic". You also previously said "I don’t think that [the niqab] does send a positive message".

You can't expect us all to shut up about it and ignore the elephant in the room.

Not sure what planet you are living on, but it's not the same as mine. The faith concerned is not a benign force for women, as you suggest. Freedom of choice is a joke for most female adherents of it, including over their own bodies. Misinformation like ths would be risible if not so deliberately misleading.

I don’t like the niqab, but I don’t take it personal with Khadija.

She is out there, helping her community, especially women and girls. By attacking her, people may be dissuading other women in niqabs and similar from also helping their communities. How would that help anyone?

@LabubuTERF There is a reason you don't like the niqab, that you think it's problematic, and don't think it sends a positive message. Why don't you explain why that is? You don't want to say what is obvious to everyone.

By wearing the niqab, Khadija is endorsing it, heedless of women who are forced to wear it, who do not have her (claimed) luxury of choice.

She is not helping women and girls by supporting extreme veiling. No women or girls should have to hide their faces because of men and their misogynistic culture or religion. It is also antithetical to assimilation with British culture. Women who wish to or are forced to wear the niqab can never assimilate in Britain. They will remain outsiders, isolated, and subject to control by their families.

The niqab is medieval, oppressive to women, and completely inappropriate in UK society. And yes, freakish. Not to mention the security risk.

Do you think she would've been nominated or won the award if she wasn't wearing the niqab?

Yes (but worldwide it’s many millions).