Transgender women will not be prosecuted in the use of women’s single sex facilities

[Theotheruser]

You can support transgender rights or not but the law isn’t itself politics. Transgender women will not be prosecuted in the use of women’s single sex facilities in public in the standard use the facilities was built for.

A standard use is:

• A transgender woman goes into the women’s toilet facilities in a cubicle for the purposes of relieving bodily fluids.
• A transgender woman goes into the women’s changing facilities in a cubicle for the purposes of removing clothing for leisure activities.
• A transgender woman goes into the women’s toilet facilities to protect the transgender women of being attacked or sexually assaulted.

A transgender woman in the standard uses of the women’s facilities are not exposing the users of the single sex facilities.

A transgender woman in the standard uses of the women’s facilities are not exposing child users in the single sex facilities.

A child user using single sex women’s facilities can’t deny other women public access of the facilities the child user believes are transgender.

With official documentation of the new sex will be difficult to disprove the claim of the transgender women being the male sex.

No harassment or sexual offences can be found against the transgender woman in the standard use of the women’s facilities with official documentation of the new sex.

A woman in the women’s single sex facility can be prosecuted for an offence and or removed if the woman is abusing or harassing the other user of being transgender without proof.

A woman recording and sharing publicly the other user without proof of being transgender can prosecuted.

The Supreme Court ruling or EHRC guidance has not changed the law to prosecute transgender women in women’s single sex spaces.

Transgender women have history of official records to support beyond a reasonable doubt the new gender identity. Have protection of gender discrimination.

Prosecution of transgender women is not going to work in the standard uses of the women’s facilities.

A woman can complain to management but unless management decides to take action to resolve the issue no action can be taken against the other user.

Also I do wonder about the type of person who gets a kick out of that kind of thing.

Well, quite.

80s born UK Brit here, and we've always used poo. Was wee in our house, but plenty of my friends were using pee when I was a kid, so I don't think it's an Americanisation.

And no, it's entirely irrelevant to the thread, but it's significantly more interesting than whatever the fuck OP is going for with this thread!

I'd also add, OP : women's single sex spaces being protected isn't merely because a few middle class women got bored one day and decided to annoy men with trans identities. Nor were the courts - upto and including the Supreme Court - merely messing around for funsies in expensive cases that took years in process.

If men do not respect women's need for single sex spaces then there are many women who cannot use those women's spaces, and there are no alternatives for them.

To let men crack on with breaking the law means actively excluding and discriminating against women, many of whom are excluded due to protected characteristics. This is obviously not ok, is it? Article 8 rights belong to them too.

Unless of course you're into the racism, xenophobia and religious intolerance of believing that women from varied cultures and faiths are lesser because of it and should not have the same rights as others, or that women harmed by violence, trauma and disability are also lesser and shouldn't have equality. It's a bit grim, but if Farage and Trump are your thing then you do you. But by law, those women have Article 8 rights too, and it won't end well in court. Even if a political lunatic fringe manage to successfully mess up the Equality Act, it still won't work.

Yip. I’ve posted about my experience. And I’m not even allowed to describe it in detail as it’s too upsetting for others to read.

What does “the law isn’t itself politics” even mean?

A good example of another area where men will be prevented is prisons, which hopefully none of us will ever need to worry about first hand, but I’m very glad the law has been laid down clearly yesterday for those vulnerable women who it does affect. The men in women’s prisons will need to be moved. Yes the Scottish government may waste further taxpayer cash on digging their heels in, and they will lose, and go on setting precedents that will benefit women’s rights, not TRA goals. The party’s over.

Staff not tackling a shoplifter are not breaking the law.
Staff refusing to uphold a single sex space are
HTH

/TransgenderUK and Feminism here are echo chambers. I use women’s spaces as I was born female but I do see both sides of the issue. The issue is transgender women are not going away and will use women’s spaces and women are not going to be prosecuting transgender women. It takes courage to prosecute and it is unsafe. Cancel culture is alive.

It is easier to not notice a transgender woman in the women’s space and go on with your life.

What a lot of hyperbolic drama.

The guidance, the SCJ, the prisons case yesterday all repeatedly mentions the protections and accommodations for these men as a group, about the care and sensitivity involved, and that while they cannot use the women's space, because their needs and wishes cannot trump those needs and actual rights of women, additional mixed sex spaces must be provided.

Spaces in which there will be plenty of women such as yourself, who are fine and happy in mixed sex spaces (currently, for all women this could change any day).

There's no question of them being 'forced' into men's spaces. Or incidentally them even having to suffer what women who can't use spaces with those men have had to, which is to deal with the fear and threat or leave the space and go without: I didn't hear you complaining or minding about that? Odd that you mind when it might theoretically and dramatically affect a man, but you don't care that it has seriously and harmfully affected many women, and that's only if you go by the cases that ended in court with a conviction.

Stop the dramatics, and address the real situation.

Why can’t these trans individuals use a fourth space?

I’ll tell you what takes fucking courage to prosecute. A fucking bastard rape so violent I can’t even describe it here. It takes fucking courage to go through with that.

I did that.

Bloody right I’ll take on some transgender identifying man who thinks the law doesn’t apply to him.

How do all the recent court cases square with that. Sandie Peggie, the Darlington nurses etc.

And that's before the law was clarified by FWS. If women were taking their workplaces to court before that, they're only going to feel more able to now they know they can win.

A man who breaks the law by using single sex female spaces is showing us who he is. A woman-hating predator with absolutely no boundaries in which to practice his kink,

“Transgender women on medication will be threatened with violence going in the men’s spaces.”

Why is this a justification for diminishing the safety and comfort of girls and women?

All this concern for TW being around other men but absolutely no compassion for the females you’re expecting to just happily accept the same.

The cognitive dissonance and misogynistic double standard is still shocking to me every single time this argument is trotted out. 🙄

No it won’t you numpty. However, allowing some males into female spaces, but not all males, IS sex discrimination.

We are going to prosecute them because the law will be changed precisely because men won’t stop transgressing female spaces.

opinion polls are dead against trans rights above female rights.

You’re not very convincing @Theotheruser- what exactly do you imagine you’re achieving here?

You forgot to add
Transgender women are not, and never will be, female.
or to put it a different way
Transgender women have always been, and always will be, male.

We need to be honest. I have a daughter to support and I need my job to pay the bills and I can’t afford to do that if I start policing the women’s spaces.

Transgender women have won. Prosecuting will not happen and that why I wrote the post. It’s all talk. It will not happen. It takes courage and money and with the cost of living crisis I don’t want to lose my job or house.

Speak for yourself. I’ve nothing left to lose and a spine forged in the fires of hell.

Transgender people using women's spaces will be challenged unless they are so good at masquerading as a woman that they genuinely can't be spotted. Women are particularly good at this, the number will be very small.

We have not felt the law was with us to challenge them before. We do now.

As a woman who regularly sees women double checking my short hair, height and broad shoulders, I welcome with open arms their right to reassure themselves that I'm female.

🤣 nice one.

Transgender people have come out of the closet and won’t be going back in.

We need a truce of sorts.

The “truce” would have to involve them agreeing to use third spaces, mate. Otherwise, no deal.