Continuation of Polypostwonder thread

[Imdunfer]

Follow on from this thread

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5532352-the-liminality-of-sex-perception-sex-based-spaces-and-bodily-autonomy?page=39

For argument sake, I understand Blaire White to be a woman. This is independent of the knowledge she chose to only undergo cosmetic facial surgeries and breast augmentation, while retaining everything else.
I think I remember reading that she politically aligns 'right' and is politically vocal about being a male, living as a trans woman. I'm not 100% sure, though. It's not a way that I could understand living, but it is financially lucrative in her case.

There is a person who declares themselves to be male.

That person chooses to live presenting as a female.

In spite of their self declaration as a male, complete with male genitals, you understand that they are a woman.

And you ascribe their understanding of themselves being male, at least partly, to financial motives.

This is either monumentally arrogant or monumentally stupid thinking, or possibly both. Or perhaps you just like playing with a largely female forum and seeing how many feathers you can ruffle.

One thing is for sure, and that is that I don't think anything you write on this subject from now on is going to be of any value to read.

if PPWs history and description of himself is correct

All this hypothetical anecdote is not really very helpful.

No. It's not just about who can physically hurt us.

If that was the criteria, why bother calling them "women's" spaces and only letting safe men who claim to be women in? There's plenty of male people who don't pose a physical threat, so what makes PPW and PPW alone different? The fact he tells us he's turned himself into a superficial facsimile of what "a woman" looks like? Please.

PPW didn't wake up one day looking like a woman and decide "oh well, I guess I'd better live as a woman now" - he started by feeling inside something he believes only "women" feel and so chose to make his outside match it. Before the transition, there was the sexism. Transition is simply sexism enacted on the flesh.

What I believe harms women, and what I resist, vehmently, is also the creep into society the idea that there are ways of thinking and feeling that are proper for women but not men, and vice versa, and that if a man thinks or feels enough like society has decided women do, then he might as well be a woman because that's all that we are.

It reduces us. It takes us right back to the same old sexism that says our minds are better caring and nuturing than thinking and leading.

The most empowering, inclusive way to think about women is the half of humanity that has a female body in all our diversity of thought and feeling. Anything less than that reduces us. Tunring us into simply the subset of what we can be that can also be achieved by a man does us a great injustice and it's done entirely to benefit men like PPW and not us.

As for your sports example, I looked up Becky Pepper Jackson. She won the 2026 AAA Girls WV State Shot Put title. Her result is almost 4 feet shorter than the WV State record and just under 2 feet from the best recorded AAA Girls score in the year. She got lucky. Her score is also well within the normal expected range for a top performer of her age.

You are again wildly missing the point.

Becky threw a longer throw by virtue of her male muscle, which is of a different quality to female muscle. If he had been born female, his female self would not have been able to throw that far.

Somewhere, there is a girl who missed out on the wonderful experience of competing at that level to a boy in a girl's competition.

It is entirely irrelevant if these men in women's sport aren't winning. They are depriving women of their place in the competition.

Disagreement is not an attack 🙄

I think it's for me decide whether I feel I'm being attacked, not anyone else.

Sure, but feelings do not always reflect reality.

Can you point to where you have been attacked, it's possible I missed it.

The PP posted this example stating that this sport result was evidence of the threat of physical violence against female people.

She transitioned before puberty. As a girl, her male puberty was blocked and was redirected to a female direction. She will live the remainder in her life as a woman. Her body well within average for a girl, there is no male testosterone levels advantage.

I am not missing the point. I disagree with the gender critical belief. I believe she is not displacing any other girl because she belongs in her spot.

"puberty was blocked and was redirected to a female direction."

This is impossible. No one can have their puberty redirected so they go through opposite sex puberty.

It is impossible under gender critical beliefs. I recognise that this is your belief.

He absolutely took a place from a girl. And in the US, that can impact scholarships to university, so entire lifetime opportunities. It's disgusting.

Laurel Hubbard took an Olympic spot from a young Pacific islander woman. That could have been life changing for her, but no, he, a man in his forties, decided to compete. The fact that he tanked is neither here nor there, she never got a shot because of his delusional vanity and sense of entitlement.

Laurel Hubbard and NZ followed the sport and Olympic qualification requirements of the time. Do I believe this was fair, no I don't. But that example isn't illustrative of youth academic sport.

Becky Pepper Jackson is a girl. She should compete with girls and if she qualifies for a scholarship to attend university as a woman, then good for her.

No it's just straight up impossible.

Are you trying to tell me that some male (or multiple males) out there in the world has had their male puberty blocked, and then went on to go through female puberty?

He's a boy. There's no getting around it. At his age, he won't even have been able to have the plastic surgery you believe makes you into a woman.

Apparently there are many thousands now. When I did it, you could probably count us on both hands. Trans boys do it too. They never have a period or develop breasts.

Ah, so we can add "puberty" to "woman", "subjective" and "objective" on the list of words to which those who have PPW's beliefs assign an ideological meaning that is different to the meanings those words have commonly carried for hundreds of years.

This is helpful. I may write a translation dictionary.

Hormones are all anyone should ever need to grow to adulthood at this age. Surgery is extremely rare before adulthood.

You did not go through female puberty!

It is physically impossible, you were born (and remain) male. You do not have the biological ability to go through female puberty.

So are you telling me with what I assume is a straight face that you took cross sex hormones and grew a uterus, cervix, ovaries, fallopian tubes etc. That cross sex hormones change you down to the DNA level?

Because that would be the height of bullshittery, a most outrageous lie.

Did you grow a uterus, cervix, ovaries, fallopian tubes in puberty? Why would you expect me to?

My skeleton changed and grew, my skin and fat distribution changed, my muscles grew, my secondary sex characteristics matured, thanks to oestrogen receptors under the direction of my DNA.

And if an archaeologist dug you up in the future, they'd know you were male.

Not at all. But I understand you need to believe this.

Yes they would. But I understand you need to believe otherwise.

Obviously not, mine were already grown before I hit puberty because I was born female, unlike you.

No. I asked if you went through female puberty, which you absolutely didn't. Obviously because you are a male person.

You might have had natural male puberty blocked, but you didn't then go through actual female puberty instead.

So you lied when you told me that you and "many thousands" (derisive snort!) have had natural puberty from their birth sex stopped, and artificial hormones given through medical intervention literally caused you to go through opposite sex puberty.

It's just sheer lies because that is absolutely impossible.

Perhaps if they were also doing DNA tests in the field, but this wasn't what was being implied.

Don't be trivial.

Female people are born with primary female sex structures that mature into their adult state at puberty in response to their naturally produced hormones.

And your primary sex structures? Did they react by developing into their adult state when you had your artificially induced cross-sex hormone inspired "puberty"?

I'm not going to convince you, so we end this here.