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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Are We Really 'Women' On The Inside?

1000 replies

HazelLemur · 27/04/2026 17:39

Dear friends,

As anyone paying attention to current trans affairs knows, the anti-trans brigade like to throw around what they think is the “killer question”.

"What is a woman, then?"

These people will often engage in triumphal sneering as they further insist "Your chromosomes are what you are; XX are women and XY are men. It's science, innit?"

And as a confident trans-woman I say to these people "Absolutely! What is a woman? Great question! Let's examine that".

To begin, let's consult three definitive sources:

First, the Cambridge Dictionary of the English Language.
Then, modern genetics and neurophysiology.
And finally, up to date research on brain structure in cisgender and transgender women.

First, the dictionary.
For this, let's go with the Cambridge Dictionary of the English Language:

Woman (noun)

  1. an adult female human being
  2. an adult who lives and identifies as female though they may have been said to have a different sex at birth

As we can see from #2, despite the recent social backlash and disproportionately loud screeching from certain murky corners of the internet, Western culture as a whole is moving toward accepting the validity of trans peoples' inner gender identity. No person with a working moral compass would consider this a bad thing.

Next, let’s summarize genetics and neurophysiology.

Modern society routinely treats all the following “XY” humans as WOMEN, however...
-You can be a woman because you have X & Y chromosomes but your body is insensitive to androgens and you have female anatomy & gender identity.
Ah, so much for the childishly simplistic “But women = XX and men = XY".
-You can be a woman with X & Y chromosomes but your Y is missing the SRY gene, so you have a female body and gender identity (yes, this is a real thing despite your denials).

People who have X & Y chromosomes, but their Y is missing the SRY gene, develop a female body.
Should we treat such people as men, in society, when they have the body of a woman, simply because simpletons insist that XY = Male?
Only an inveterate bigot with some weird religious and/or psychosexual axe to grind would say yes.

You can be a woman with XXY or XXXY chromosomes, giving you a male body but female brain/body map and gender identity.
-You can be a woman with XY chromosomes but a mutation called CBX2 that blocks the influence of the SRY gene.
-You can be a woman because you have 46,XY in some cells but 46,XX in other cells, or 47, XXY.

These are all valid, scientifically obervable genetic variations that highlight the "But XX = women and XY = men" mantra for the simplistic, unscientific nonsense that it is.

And lastly, there are studies of brain structure.
These show that in the section of the brain that determines one’s sense of gender identity.

The brains of transgender women are almost identical to those of cisgender women.
The brains of trans men also align more with cisgender men than they do with women.

And so, to summarize

Modern science, which is how rational people resolve differences of opinion.
It is not about referring to holy books, written in pre-scientific ages past.
It is not about regurgitating simplistic, binary statements that you learnt in the 4th grade.

This shows us that, genetically and biologically speaking, there are many types of women; including transgender women like me.

P.S. In this essay we have a summary of the cutting edge science which validates transgender womens' biologically determined, inner sense of gender identity.

As I’ve said, a rational society follows rational explanations, and doesn’t define its people via outdated religious or cultural ideas.
But beyond that, there is simply human courtesy and kindness.

It’s cruel, hateful and rude for the transphobic bigots to demand that people be forced to conform to their anti-scientific notions.

No one's life is affected negatively by honoring a transwoman as a woman, as the historical record of many trans accepting societies have shown.

Good people will see the very challenging dilemma that transwomen are in, and their natural empathy, coupled with scientific insight, will make them want to support their fellow human beings in being who they know they are.

And so, I ask all of you:

Should we as a society treat trans-women as the women their brain and neurobiology tells us they are? And, if not, why on earth wouldn’t we?

P.P.S. The image in this post is of women who have XY chromosomes, but an androgen insensitivity syndrome which causes their bodies to develop as female.
Would anyone in their right mind insist we treat them as males, simply because of their chromosomal makeup?
The bigots might, but you know you're better than that, right?

Are We Really 'Women' On The Inside?
OP posts:
Thread gallery
39
HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:20

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 28/04/2026 11:17

No. People are challenged here for arguments, not merely “beliefs”.

If someone says female spaces should include males, women are entitled to ask why female privacy, dignity and consent should be overridden.

That is not an “attack”. That is scrutiny.

And in this thread, the actual insults have overwhelmingly come from the OP: “cult”, “howling”, “screeching”, “pathetic”, “hateful”.

So no, I am not “in error”. Disagreement is not persecution. Women defending their boundaries is not abuse.

Edited

And again you are incorrect.

Seriously, you seem like the sort of person who'd write vexatious letters to schools who didn't conform to your ideological stance!

Try re-reading my posts, carefully this time.

I have not attacked 'women' at all; I have responded - directly and forthrightly - to the specific ideological group - the GC cult - who lurk in places like MN and begin to seethe at the merest suggestion that trans-women might, after all, be women and be worthy of basic rights.

OP posts:
EmpressaurusKitty · 28/04/2026 11:20

TheWickerFan · 28/04/2026 11:15

Must have missed all of the rape and death threats on here.

Also the number of times TRAs have had to keep a venue secret or change it at the last minute to avoid sabotage in whatever form.

TheWickerFan · 28/04/2026 11:22

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:20

And again you are incorrect.

Seriously, you seem like the sort of person who'd write vexatious letters to schools who didn't conform to your ideological stance!

Try re-reading my posts, carefully this time.

I have not attacked 'women' at all; I have responded - directly and forthrightly - to the specific ideological group - the GC cult - who lurk in places like MN and begin to seethe at the merest suggestion that trans-women might, after all, be women and be worthy of basic rights.

What basic rights do you not have as a transwoman? No one wants to deny you your rights, and we don't, but you are not and never will be a woman. In fact, it's you who wants to deny women their rights, is it not? The right to single-sex space, for instance.

Iatethelastbiscuit · 28/04/2026 11:22

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:14

Not for the first time, you are in error.

People are, very clearly, attacked on this board - on a regular basis - for their beliefs; it's almost as bad as Reddit, tbh.

It’s not as bad as Reddit because MN allows freedom of speech. Reddit does not. It doesn’t even allow you to pose a reasonable question, free from any one-sided opinion on the r/asktransgender board. I posed a respectful question on that board once, asking why many TRAs seem unwilling to discuss the issues around the trans debate and seem more eager to shut down any discussion about it from people who may not agree with them. It got deleted before it even went up and I was banned from the board!…which just proved my point entirely

MarieDeGournay · 28/04/2026 11:23

To 'howling and screeching' add 'lurking and seething'.
Your choice of words to describe women you disagree with belies your claim to the high moral ground, HazelLemur !

BackToLurk · 28/04/2026 11:23

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:20

And again you are incorrect.

Seriously, you seem like the sort of person who'd write vexatious letters to schools who didn't conform to your ideological stance!

Try re-reading my posts, carefully this time.

I have not attacked 'women' at all; I have responded - directly and forthrightly - to the specific ideological group - the GC cult - who lurk in places like MN and begin to seethe at the merest suggestion that trans-women might, after all, be women and be worthy of basic rights.

Why do you have no issue with @IggyPopsPlasticTrousers position that TW shouldn't be in many, if not most, women-only spaces?

(Nice of you to get up so early to be here though)

Helleofabore · 28/04/2026 11:23

MarieDeGournay · 28/04/2026 11:23

To 'howling and screeching' add 'lurking and seething'.
Your choice of words to describe women you disagree with belies your claim to the high moral ground, HazelLemur !

The misogyny is there for all to see.

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 28/04/2026 11:23

Iatethelastbiscuit · 28/04/2026 11:22

It’s not as bad as Reddit because MN allows freedom of speech. Reddit does not. It doesn’t even allow you to pose a reasonable question, free from any one-sided opinion on the r/asktransgender board. I posed a respectful question on that board once, asking why many TRAs seem unwilling to discuss the issues around the trans debate and seem more eager to shut down any discussion about it from people who may not agree with them. It got deleted before it even went up and I was banned from the board!…which just proved my point entirely

Notably I do not see anyones posts on this thread being deleted....or downvoted into oblivion.

5128gap · 28/04/2026 11:24

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 28/04/2026 10:37

I'm not arrogant, or disingenuous. I'm just so, so tired of having this exact same debate and getting nowhere with it.

I told the OP that I thought they were patronising and confrontational. I stand by that.

But there's loads of patronising behaviour from the other side on this thread too. In particular a sense that I would come round to your point of view if I only thought about it / read the literature / considered women and girls more.

Well, I have thought about it. I have read the literature. I have considered women and girls. I am a woman. I'm 54. This is not my first rodeo, as they say.

I've just reached a different conclusion. And so have many, many other women. I'm not alone in this.

You can disagree with me all you like. I expect nothing different. But don't tell me that I haven't considered your argument properly, just because I don't agree with you all.

And now, I really am done with this. Hope you all have a good day.

I'm not asking you to have the same debate. I'm just questioning your position.
Because I can understand people who believe that some male people are women. I dont need to agree in order to accept thats what they believe, and understand that belief will underpin their stance in the debate. They see no reason why TW shouldn't be in women's spaces because TWAW. Got it.
And I can understand people who believe that a male person can never be a woman so there is no justification for allowing a few of them in women's spaces. Undertood.
But I genuinely can't understand people like you who claim to believe TWAW, yet obviously don't really. Who does that help?
Because to me it just sets TW up to have false expectations of you, that will hit very hard when they discover that their 'womanhood' is conditional. At least with the TERFS they know where they stand.
I don't see an end to this debate as everything hinges on the binary TWAW versus TWAM. So unless you think you'll be able to get TW round to your idea that they're only a type of honorary woman who will be included as and when you see fit, and convince all women that some men should be afforded honorary women status and be allowed in their toilets to be kind, then I don't see your position achieving much.

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 28/04/2026 11:26

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:20

And again you are incorrect.

Seriously, you seem like the sort of person who'd write vexatious letters to schools who didn't conform to your ideological stance!

Try re-reading my posts, carefully this time.

I have not attacked 'women' at all; I have responded - directly and forthrightly - to the specific ideological group - the GC cult - who lurk in places like MN and begin to seethe at the merest suggestion that trans-women might, after all, be women and be worthy of basic rights.

So your reply to “people are challenged for arguments, not beliefs” is to call me vexatious and make a sneering reference to parents writing to schools.

That rather proves the point.

Parents are entitled to raise safeguarding concerns. Girls are entitled to single-sex privacy. Schools are not above scrutiny because some people dislike the complaint.

I have not written “vexatious letters”. I have raised lawful, serious safeguarding and sex-based rights concerns about girls’ privacy, dignity and safety.

And if a school ignores those concerns, refuses proper process, and fails to protect female pupils, then of course it should be challenged.

And I am going to win.

On to your actions...

“I have not attacked women, only the GC cult” is not the clever distinction you think it is. On this board, the people you are calling a “cult” are overwhelmingly women defending safeguarding, privacy and single-sex spaces.

You can relabel those women as an “ideological group” if you like. It does not change what you are doing.

The question remains simple:

If female spaces are for females, on what grounds should male people who identify as trans be admitted?

Calling women “cultists” for asking that is not forthright. It is misogyny in progressive language.

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:29

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 28/04/2026 11:26

So your reply to “people are challenged for arguments, not beliefs” is to call me vexatious and make a sneering reference to parents writing to schools.

That rather proves the point.

Parents are entitled to raise safeguarding concerns. Girls are entitled to single-sex privacy. Schools are not above scrutiny because some people dislike the complaint.

I have not written “vexatious letters”. I have raised lawful, serious safeguarding and sex-based rights concerns about girls’ privacy, dignity and safety.

And if a school ignores those concerns, refuses proper process, and fails to protect female pupils, then of course it should be challenged.

And I am going to win.

On to your actions...

“I have not attacked women, only the GC cult” is not the clever distinction you think it is. On this board, the people you are calling a “cult” are overwhelmingly women defending safeguarding, privacy and single-sex spaces.

You can relabel those women as an “ideological group” if you like. It does not change what you are doing.

The question remains simple:

If female spaces are for females, on what grounds should male people who identify as trans be admitted?

Calling women “cultists” for asking that is not forthright. It is misogyny in progressive language.

"I have not written “vexatious letters”. I have raised lawful, serious safeguarding and sex-based rights concerns about girls’ privacy, dignity and safety."

Ahhh, so you are that person. Suspected as much. 😉

OP posts:
Helleofabore · 28/04/2026 11:30

READER'S NOTE:

I suspect that this might be one of those studies that the OP believes support's his case.

Differences in transwomen's brains have been found, but they do not align neatly with women's or men's brains.

"Our results support the hypothesis that brain structure in TW differs from brain structure of their biological sex (male) as well as their perceived gender (female)."

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41386-020-0666-3

The TW brain structures were not in the 'female' range at all. They were fully within the male range.

Studies like the one mentioned above compare trans people's brains with those of heterosexual people. This is an important drawback, because differences in the brains of heterosexual and homosexual people have been observed.

The following study compared the brains of trans people with a set of non-transpeople that included both heterosexual people and homosexual people.

"After controlling for sexual orientation, the transgender groups showed sex-typical FA-values. The only exception was the right inferior fronto-occipital tract, connecting parietal and frontal brain areas that mediate own body perception. Our findings suggest that the neuroanatomical signature of transgenderism is related to brain areas processing the perception of self and body ownership,"

www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-17352-8

We have not seen one paper that shows male people with transgender identities have brains 'almost identical' to female people's brains.

Structural connections in the brain in relation to gender identity and sexual orientation - Scientific Reports

Both transgenderism and homosexuality are facets of human biology, believed to derive from different sexual differentiation of the brain. The two phenomena are, however, fundamentally unalike, despite an increased prevalence of homosexuality among tran...

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-17352-8?error=cookies_not_supported&code=9ae89774-bd99-465e-88e2-57c3d96eb48e

SingleSexSpacesInSchools · 28/04/2026 11:31

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:29

"I have not written “vexatious letters”. I have raised lawful, serious safeguarding and sex-based rights concerns about girls’ privacy, dignity and safety."

Ahhh, so you are that person. Suspected as much. 😉

Yes, I am a parent standing up for women and girls, and I am proud of that.

I am challenging this because girls’ privacy, dignity and safety matter. I fully expect to win, because the law, safeguarding principles and basic reality are not on your side.

And still, you have not answered the point.

You have dodged, sneered, winked, personalised and tried to make this about me. But the question remains exactly where it was:

If female spaces are for females, on what grounds should males be admitted?

Your refusal to answer that makes your position look very weak indeed.

GarlicFind · 28/04/2026 11:35

... women on the inside?

Let's see. On my inside there is an ovary (used to be two), two fallopian tubes, a uterus, a cervix and a vaginal canal which is a muscular tube, not a bag. There's a wide, shallow pelvic bone with a broad opening in the middle. There are muscles with more Type 1 fibres than Type 2.

There are approx 30 trillion cells containing X chromosomes but no Y chromosomes. There is no prostate gland, no seminal vesicles, ejaculatory ducts, no testes or penile tissues.

I am a woman on the inside. If you're unsure whether you are, a pelvic ultrasound or a blood test will help you find out. (If you have a DSD you may need both, to make certain.)

Leavesandthings · 28/04/2026 11:35

@HazelLemur

Please provide your sources that trans women brains are "identical" to women's brains.

It appears to be the crux of your argument but you haven't responded to requests to source it.

EdithStourton · 28/04/2026 11:36

This particular area of the MN swamp has a reputation for a reason.
Suddenly all the posts about crocs make perfect sense.

borntobequiet · 28/04/2026 11:38

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:29

"I have not written “vexatious letters”. I have raised lawful, serious safeguarding and sex-based rights concerns about girls’ privacy, dignity and safety."

Ahhh, so you are that person. Suspected as much. 😉

Not a difficult deduction seeing as SSSIS has posted extensively about this on here.

Helleofabore · 28/04/2026 11:38

READER'S NOTE:

People with differences in sex development can be categorised as either male or female, thanks to modern technology. That testing goes further than testing for chromosomes, although chromosomes are part of those tests.

Either a person has a body formed around the production of small or large gametes regardless of the production status (ie. Whether the body has ever or will ever produce those gametes). No person has ever had a body proven to produce both small and large gametes.

It is offensive to use a group of people’s medical condition as a means to falsely destabilise the binary nature of sexed human bodies. It is also meaningless. That discussion does nothing to explain a group of male people's belief in their subjective reality that they are in any way female.

Humans have many variations of bodies within each sex category. It is not just about ‘chromosomes’ and very few people who discuss the need for single sex provisions refer to chromosomes. However, chromosomes are a fairly reliable predictor, hence they are used often as a shorthand description .

The only way to be a woman is to be an adult female human which is the type of human that has a body formed around the production of large gametes. This is regardless of whether those gametes are being produced, have been produced or ever will be.

TheKeatingFive · 28/04/2026 11:41

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:20

And again you are incorrect.

Seriously, you seem like the sort of person who'd write vexatious letters to schools who didn't conform to your ideological stance!

Try re-reading my posts, carefully this time.

I have not attacked 'women' at all; I have responded - directly and forthrightly - to the specific ideological group - the GC cult - who lurk in places like MN and begin to seethe at the merest suggestion that trans-women might, after all, be women and be worthy of basic rights.

Transwomen obviously aren't women. They are men. Everyone knows that, including you.

Amd what rights do they lack?

DialSquare · 28/04/2026 11:42

DARVO, projection and irony. It’s all they’ve got.

MoistVonL · 28/04/2026 11:43

The breathtaking misogyny from the OP - just wow. The dehumanising language, the conflation of rebuttal with attack, the arrogance of posting absolute drivel that's been debunked years ago as if it were new or credible...

If we needed proof the OP is a man he's provided it in spades.

RoyalCorgi · 28/04/2026 11:43

Isn't the OP just Christinapple under another name? There have been several TRA posters who use a similar naming convention, ie a female name followed by an object (apple, lemur, and I've forgotten the rest). They are all, surely, the same person.

DialSquare · 28/04/2026 11:45

RoyalCorgi · 28/04/2026 11:43

Isn't the OP just Christinapple under another name? There have been several TRA posters who use a similar naming convention, ie a female name followed by an object (apple, lemur, and I've forgotten the rest). They are all, surely, the same person.

I was thinking he sounds more like Butterfly.

MarieDeGournay · 28/04/2026 11:49

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 11:29

"I have not written “vexatious letters”. I have raised lawful, serious safeguarding and sex-based rights concerns about girls’ privacy, dignity and safety."

Ahhh, so you are that person. Suspected as much. 😉

Ahhh, so you are that person. Suspected as much.

I'm not sure how 'suspicion' comes into it, and it doesn't make you Sherlock Holmes, it implies that you haven't a very good awareness of other discussions on this board if it took you this long to associate SingleSexSpacesInSchools with the regular poster SingleSexSpacesInSchools, who posts about single sex spaces in schools, under the username SingleSexSpacesInSchools.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 28/04/2026 11:50

MarieDeGournay · 28/04/2026 11:49

Ahhh, so you are that person. Suspected as much.

I'm not sure how 'suspicion' comes into it, and it doesn't make you Sherlock Holmes, it implies that you haven't a very good awareness of other discussions on this board if it took you this long to associate SingleSexSpacesInSchools with the regular poster SingleSexSpacesInSchools, who posts about single sex spaces in schools, under the username SingleSexSpacesInSchools.

😂😂

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