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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
spannasaurus · 27/03/2026 08:35

As several UN independent experts have noted, binary definitions of sex reinforce harmful stereotypes and erode progress toward substantive gender equality.

How does recognising that there are only two sexes reinforce stereotypes? I want journalists to start asking these experts to explain what they mean when they say this kind of stuff.

soupycustard · 27/03/2026 08:40

Obviously there are no comments open on the article because then the Graun would have to delete most of them.
I completely resent the years of membership fees I paid to that stupid woman-hating rag. It's just as corrupt as all the other rags it claims to be better than.

Evolutionarygoals · 27/03/2026 08:41

@spannasaurus yes, that line particularly infuriated me too. They never expand on what that means, and it's so easy for non-thinking folk to just nod along "oh yes, stereotypes, bad things, must be a terrible decision then". There's also a bit about the weightlifter (Hubbard?) failing to win any medals, like that's some sort of gotcha. Allowing men to compete against women would have been such an obviously terrible idea not that long ago. I still don't understand how people's thinking has become so skewed in such a short period of time!

Tootingbec · 27/03/2026 08:43

The AOC says they will comply but this this issue is “complex and challenging”

In what way AOC is it complex and challenging? The obfuscation is so rife. There is nothing complex about it - men should not be competing in women’s sports.

And all the hand wringing about “women of colour” being discriminated against because of how they look. What a load of old bollocks. You test everyone once with a cheek swab and then deal with the infinitesimal small number of athletes who don’t fit into XX or XY with respect and sensitivity. Everyone else can crack on with their day.

MsGreying · 27/03/2026 08:45

soupycustard · 27/03/2026 08:40

Obviously there are no comments open on the article because then the Graun would have to delete most of them.
I completely resent the years of membership fees I paid to that stupid woman-hating rag. It's just as corrupt as all the other rags it claims to be better than.

Write and tell them

Editor @.

Evolutionarygoals · 27/03/2026 08:45

Oh, and then they bring racism into it! Yes, women of colour suffer more from judgements about looking feminine enough, but they won't be targeted more if everyone is doing the same test. The whole thing has noting to do with judging women on their femininety, and everything to do with correctly categorising people as male or female. Looks don't come into it in the slightest.

nauticant · 27/03/2026 08:49

If you want to know the position some very senior people at the UN have on this matter, Alexandra Xanthaki, Special Rapporteur, was interviewed on Radio 4 last night, from about 9 minutes 40 seconds:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002t2w6

It was even worse than you might have imagined.

Evolutionarygoals · 27/03/2026 08:50

@Tootingbec You put this far better than I did, thank you.
I'm really fucking cross about this. I know I can't expect any better from the guardian, but their article yesterday was quite free of hand wringing about the poor overlooked menz, so that I think I was lulled into a false sense of security. Thankfully I start work soon, and I block chrome on my phone so I'm not distracted so I won't be tempeted to raise my blood pressure any further.

soupycustard · 27/03/2026 08:54

@MsGreying I used to be a serial complainer but now there are so many battles, I try to pick and choose! Maybe I should re-start my complaints to the Graun though!

HelenaWaiting · 27/03/2026 08:57

Tootingbec · 27/03/2026 08:43

The AOC says they will comply but this this issue is “complex and challenging”

In what way AOC is it complex and challenging? The obfuscation is so rife. There is nothing complex about it - men should not be competing in women’s sports.

And all the hand wringing about “women of colour” being discriminated against because of how they look. What a load of old bollocks. You test everyone once with a cheek swab and then deal with the infinitesimal small number of athletes who don’t fit into XX or XY with respect and sensitivity. Everyone else can crack on with their day.

As a woman of colour I find that particular bogus strawman utterly infuriating and profoundly racist. It is demonstrably untrue that women of colour look like men and, in any case, this was never about how people look.

OP posts:
senua · 27/03/2026 08:59

I'm not reading the article, I'm not giving the Graun any clicks. But I can see the opening remark "Over 100 human rights, sports and scientific groups have criticised ..." I hope somebody is keeping receipts.

senua · 27/03/2026 08:59

soupycustard · 27/03/2026 08:54

@MsGreying I used to be a serial complainer but now there are so many battles, I try to pick and choose! Maybe I should re-start my complaints to the Graun though!

How about the 100 groups instead?Smile

Definitelyrandom · 27/03/2026 09:02

On the positive side, Sean Ingle has followed up his original, sensible article yesterday in the Guardian with an equally sensible analysis piece.

loislovesstewie · 27/03/2026 09:03

Some of the reasons given fir not wanting sex testing are just beyond belief.
Stereotypes for example. The people who prance around larping as women aren't really behaving as a stereotype are they?!
Secondly if everyone is having a test to determine sex, then how is that racist to black women? It's a universal test, not based on looks.
I feel that it's a desperate move to bring racism into the argument.
And as for how the test isn't scientific? That really is beyond me.

Chersfrozenface · 27/03/2026 09:04

senua · 27/03/2026 08:59

I'm not reading the article, I'm not giving the Graun any clicks. But I can see the opening remark "Over 100 human rights, sports and scientific groups have criticised ..." I hope somebody is keeping receipts.

I would love to know how many members each of those "human rights, sports and scientific groups" has.

I'm betting single figures in many cases.

soupycustard · 27/03/2026 09:05

senua · 27/03/2026 08:59

How about the 100 groups instead?Smile

I've never heard of that. What is it please?

Apollo441 · 27/03/2026 09:07

Fucking NOBODY is being tested for how feminine they are. They are being tested for the presence of the SRY gene. It's a once in a lifetime test. By cheek swab. How is it 'complicated'? I like to console myself that these are the dying contortions of this post modernist crap as we flush it down the toilet forever but I know we are goiing to have to be eternally vigilent to prevent it gaining sway again.

TheSmallAssassin · 27/03/2026 09:07

spannasaurus · 27/03/2026 08:35

As several UN independent experts have noted, binary definitions of sex reinforce harmful stereotypes and erode progress toward substantive gender equality.

How does recognising that there are only two sexes reinforce stereotypes? I want journalists to start asking these experts to explain what they mean when they say this kind of stuff.

This drives me bonkers! Sirely insisting that if you don't behave/dress in the socially accepted way for your sex you must pretend to be the other one is the ultimate in enforcing stereotypes! Just let people be, rather than making them fit into boxes.

Mochudubh · 27/03/2026 09:08

@Evolutionarygoals

On the other hand, I think that little clip on the BBC news of Hubbard, looking like the absolute male unit that he is, moobs and all, being referred to as "she" will be a peak "WTF" moment for a lot of people who previously thought it was all a fuss about nothing.

Helleofabore · 27/03/2026 09:08

here is an archive link

https://archive.is/j7dGr

Helleofabore · 27/03/2026 09:08

It is important to note that this is an Australian article.

MassiveWordSalad · 27/03/2026 09:11

Oh for fuck’s sake. These people are basically saying that women’s rights are not human rights. Way to go, dickheads.

I bet there are thousands of female athletes who can’t wait to have a simple, reliable cheek swab that will result in them not getting beaten by men.

MassiveWordSalad · 27/03/2026 09:13

HelenaWaiting · 27/03/2026 08:57

As a woman of colour I find that particular bogus strawman utterly infuriating and profoundly racist. It is demonstrably untrue that women of colour look like men and, in any case, this was never about how people look.

Hear, hear

Helleofabore · 27/03/2026 09:15

There are one good thing mentioned in the article. Another exceptional female athlete has supported it, well done Anna Mears!!

However, the huge fucking elephant in the room in the Australian Parliament House is… how is the legislation that is the Anti-discrimination Act going to work with this policy for the 2032 Brisbane Olympics!

Considering the controversy of the Commonwealth Games decision in Victoria, I cannot believe that the federal government is about to allow an Olympic Games become a major issue while the IOC policy is contradictory to the Anti-discrimination Act.

I wonder what they will do.

Either way, even the discussions will shine a beacon on the issue in the public sphere.

Floisme · 27/03/2026 09:16

Definitelyrandom · 27/03/2026 09:02

On the positive side, Sean Ingle has followed up his original, sensible article yesterday in the Guardian with an equally sensible analysis piece.

Yes, and I'm choosing Sean's article over that other piece of nonsense. Sean has always been sound on this issue and he's one of the few writers left at the Guardian who can still get me to click occasionally.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2026/mar/26/why-olympics-u-turned-gender-rules-sex-testing

From Laurel Hubbard to sex testing in five years: why the Olympics U-turned on transgender rules | Sean Ingle

The IOC’s shift in position on trans women in elite sports is seismic, but new president Kirsty Coventry is reflecting a changed political climate

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2026/mar/26/why-olympics-u-turned-gender-rules-sex-testing