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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

International Olympic Committee announcement today! Will it be regarding female sports?

370 replies

Helleofabore · 26/03/2026 12:41

The IOC is making an announcement today. Here is the Youtube link for the live stream.

15.15 UK time. Let's hope it is the speculated announcement that they have decided to exclude any male person who has undergone androgenisation at puberty.

https://t.co/rm06rZDB0u

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Thread gallery
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Needspaceforlego · 29/03/2026 02:26

SinnerBoy · 29/03/2026 02:06

I couldn't name a single gold medal winning boxer, in either the male or female classes, other than him and Lin Yu-Ting.

Muhammed Ali?

😂

Did Muhammad Ali compete in Olympics or other amateur level events?

All the boxers I can think of are from professional boxing, Muhammad Ali, Frank Bruno, Barry McGuigan, Mike Tyson.

MyAmpleSheep · 29/03/2026 02:30

Needspaceforlego · 29/03/2026 02:26

Did Muhammad Ali compete in Olympics or other amateur level events?

All the boxers I can think of are from professional boxing, Muhammad Ali, Frank Bruno, Barry McGuigan, Mike Tyson.

He won gold at the 1960 Olympics in Rome, apparently. He had not yet changed his name from Clay.

climbintheback · 29/03/2026 02:51

There’s loads of em - we are good at it. Remember Nicola Adams!

Helleofabore · 29/03/2026 08:52

viques · 28/03/2026 14:45

And of course, some people might say that if a 12 year old potential female athlete failed a buccal swab test then further investigation would be appropriate to uncover the reasons why, which might lead to hitherto unrecognised issues. After all , who knows what the outcome would have been had Semanya and others been tested at 12 and their DSD recorded.

And I very much doubt that that would necessitate the scaremongering and ridiculous physical examinations that KM describes so lavishly.

This man is a grandfather as he so proudly points out. It is very disturbing to see his posts.

Not only because of the misinformation but also because of the description.

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SinnerBoy · 29/03/2026 10:49

Needspaceforlego · 29/03/2026 02:26

Did Muhammad Ali compete in Olympics or other amateur level events?

All the boxers I can think of are from professional boxing, Muhammad Ali, Frank Bruno, Barry McGuigan, Mike Tyson.

Muhammed Ali had about 200 amateur fights and won gold at the Olympics.

viques · 29/03/2026 11:13

Helleofabore · 27/03/2026 22:57

Other background on him is that he gets abusive when women point out that no over 45- 50 year old women are playing in teams with 20 something women and still playing season after season. The very fact he was playing in that team at that age was a significant indicator of his sex category.

Partly because female players above 45 ish are more prone to injury, also they are slower and may not bounce back from a tackle to continue playing the entire season. (I once saw stats for female player injury rate by age bracket and it is clear to me that 45 plus year old women are more likely to spend time out of the season with injury than the lower age brackets)

He has been abusive to women who are experts in sports and point out the contradictory statements he makes.

The science of sports injuries to women is unfortunately not seen as a huge priority, there is some evidence that injuries are linked to a woman’s hormonal cycle, one theory is to do with ligaments becoming looser during part of a menstrual cycle leading to increased risk of injury, but I expect that there are many other ways our menstrual cycle fosters injury that have yet to be investigated. It’s like many other issues, medication, sports shoe design, ergonomic seat design, car safety features etc etc, the model used is a male body, not a female body so size, weight, hormones and subtle fluctuations are not accounted for properly.

So in sports, as well as the obvious physical advantages male bodies that have experienced male puberty have over female bodies there is also the distinct disadvantages female bodies have because the actual way our bodies work is not factored into the mix. So double whammy when the two are seen as competing on an equal basis.

SabrinaThwaite · 29/03/2026 12:18

I remember hearing an article on the radio about women footballers having to use children’s or small sized men’s boots which were the wrong shape for female feet and had the wrong stud patterns resulting in higher injury risk, because the boot manufacturers didn’t have boots designed for women. And this still was in the last couple of years.

lcakethereforeIam · 29/03/2026 12:26

I've seen an ad on YouTube tube, a woman footballer saying she had to buy child sized boots so she set up a company to make women's boots. Obviously an ad, but seems plausible.

AccordingToWhom · 29/03/2026 13:02

RedToothBrush · 28/03/2026 10:00

They still get attention and fawning.

It's all about that.

And getting one over on women.

Lots of men like getting one over on women because they hate women.

It certainly sounds like Semenya does

GriseldaandMike · 29/03/2026 15:22

AccordingToWhom · 29/03/2026 13:02

It certainly sounds like Semenya does

Women don't sit like that - its called man-spreading for a reason.

Needspaceforlego · 29/03/2026 16:05

GriseldaandMike · 29/03/2026 15:22

Women don't sit like that - its called man-spreading for a reason.

There is nothing female about him. Disgusting he has been able to manipulate women's athletics for so long.
10 years at least 10 long years!

Almost makes you wonder what dirt does he have on who?

Helleofabore · 30/03/2026 08:38

Jon Pike has pointed this out.

This, from the actual IOC policy document is somewhat pointed:

"Human rights experts, including UN Special Rapporteurs, disagree on the legitimacy of sex-based eligibility rules in competitive sports. Some hold that they violate the rights of XY individuals who identify as women. Others also consider the rights of XX individuals."*

https://x.com/runthinkwrite/status/2038390009409962210?s=46

Someone in the comments pointed out a good description of perhaps how some of us feel- rationalist fatigue.

Jon Pike (@runthinkwrite) on X

This, from the actual IOC policy document is somewhat pointed: "Human rights experts, including UN Special Rapporteurs, disagree on the legitimacy of sex-based eligibility rules in competitive sports. Some hold that they violate the rights of XY indi...

https://x.com/runthinkwrite/status/2038390009409962210?s=46

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SternJoyousBeev2 · 30/03/2026 09:45

Others also consider the rights of XX individuals.

👏👏👏

GriseldaandMike · 30/03/2026 11:41

Funny how those who find sex based eligibility rules 'illegitimate' aren't calling for the cancellation of the women's category and saying 'hey sorry ladies but equestrian events and some gymnastics disciplines will give you, 50% of the population the chance of a few of medals per games'. They want a men's category (knowing that whatever women do they can't compete v men in almost all sports) and a women and some men category open to those men who find elite level male competition a little too competitive.

No N.O. spells no. Women's events are for women.

Its tragic that some males are incorrectly identified as females as babies but the vast, vast majority of those with DSD are aware that they aren't female before they hit the heights of elite sport (and they should leave all female sport regardless of level as soon as they are aware). As for men with lady feelz. Tough you are not female and never will be, your male physical advantage remains just like your bloody entitlement.

The path to elite sporting success is paved with the hopes and dreams of those who didn't make it, illness, injury, lack of funding/opportunity, early promise that doesn't quite progress to the fully fledged article. 1000s of young people that dedicate their youth to training and development ultimately don't make the final step, or the penultimate step or the one before that. Elite sport is brutal, no one else get the rules rewritten for them if they can't achieve they have to face up to that reality however sad ot makes them.

A few years ago I read a piece in a magazine about the England under 16s football team 10 years on. Just 1 of the team was playing professional football. The rest were semi pro or out of the game completely. The cream of a generation who had represented their country at end of their school days and only one became a pro.

Needspaceforlego · 30/03/2026 13:20

Even for boys it is really difficult to make it as a full-time footballer. And I guess that is the same in all sports.

Scotland Under 16s were robbed in the World Cup Final against Saudi Arabia.
Out of that whole squad of players only 1 or 2 made it to top division football. I don't think any made it to the international team.

(I say robbed it is widely suspected the Saudi Under 16s were a wee bit older than 16)

ParmaVioletTea · 30/03/2026 13:29

The path to elite sporting success is paved with the hopes and dreams of those who didn't make it, illness, injury, lack of funding/opportunity, early promise that doesn't quite progress to the fully fledged article. 1000s of young people that dedicate their youth to training and development ultimately don't make the final step, or the penultimate step or the one before that. Elite sport is brutal, no one else get the rules rewritten for them if they can't achieve they have to face up to that reality however sad ot makes them.

Women like Riley Gaines, and many cyclists & runners, were told they need to "train harder."

We should just tell the men who think they're women, that they should just "train harder" to grow those ovaries, cervix, uterus, as well as the female endocrine system and skeleton. They're just not trying hard enough to be women athletes.

ThatCyanCat · 30/03/2026 13:37

Riley Gaines has also been roundly abused (and still is) because she "only" came fifth in her league, so she apparently doesn't have a right to fair sport and it doesn't matter if men enter with her.

Leaving aside that all women have a right to fair sport wherever they rank, and of course the fact that Lia Thomas, the man who tied for fifth with her is very very low ranking among other male swimmers (between 89 and 554 depending on the contest, I think), the absolute rank sexism is disgusting. The man who ranks fifth in the league or country or world in golf, football, running, tennis or anything else is unquestionably accepted as elite (because he is). Nobody suggests he's not that good and his achievements and rights to fairness don't matter. It's only because Gaines is a woman that coming fifth is sneered at and used as a reason to deny her fairness.

They always know who the women are.

viques · 30/03/2026 15:00

SternJoyousBeev2 · 30/03/2026 09:45

Others also consider the rights of XX individuals.

👏👏👏

Oh those pesky XX individuals. Honestly the blumming noise they make about their blumming rights you would think they were 50% of the world’s population or something. Just be quiet and stand back if you don’t mind, there are a few other people here who need everyone’s care and consideration to be their true selves.

Helleofabore · 30/03/2026 21:18

This is very clear from Ross Tucker.

His video about pushing back on the weak arguments that we have seen for years but which have cycled around so much over the past few days.

https://x.com/scienceofsport/status/2038606531386634714?s=46

’The sky is falling as women are harmed - so say various Human Rights groups & people in response to the IOC's Policy to protect women's sport. Their views are misguided, uninformed & false. In this 15 min video, I explain what they get wrong & ignore:’

Ross Tucker (@Scienceofsport) on X

The sky is falling as women are harmed - so say various Human Rights groups & people in response to the IOC's Policy to protect women's sport. Their views are misguided, uninformed & false. In this 15 min video, I explain what they get wrong &a...

https://x.com/scienceofsport/status/2038606531386634714?s=46

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moto748e · 30/03/2026 21:20

Just putting this here, I came across it on SM. Comprehensive survey of sports and how they are shaping up in complying with the law, or not, as the case may be. Pleased but not surprised to see my sport get a gold star. ⭐😀

www.womensrights.network/sporting-body-policies

moto748e · 30/03/2026 22:10

Just watched the Ross Tucker video. Yes, very good, he makes his points very well. Not that he's arguing with intellectual titans, though! 😁Even though they is professors...

RunningforSam · 30/03/2026 22:15

In Ross Tucker’s latest video he is very clear that he thinks all athletes with CAIS should be included in the female category and those with PAIS excluded. He suggests there is lot of room for misdiagnosis in either direction resulting in the wrong people potentially being wrongly included or excluded. He urges the IOC to properly codify the testing process (after screening) to avoid controversy arising from miscategorising CAIS and PAIS.

Helleofabore · 30/03/2026 22:28

Then there is this video from Ross about testing for CAIS.

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/YRUIHCTscW4

The IOC Policy, like those of other sports, says "No males in women's sport". But they make an exception - a condition called CAIS. This creates potential confusion, and even the possibility of a loophole that sports must be aware of to defend the integrity of women's sport. In this video, Ross explains how the SRY-screen would work, and how the test for advantage has to be held to a very high, rigorous and transparent standard, with a transparent technical document. He implores sports leaders to get this right, for the sake of the overall concept.

YouTube

https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/YRUIHCTscW4

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Helleofabore · 30/03/2026 22:30

RunningforSam · 30/03/2026 22:15

In Ross Tucker’s latest video he is very clear that he thinks all athletes with CAIS should be included in the female category and those with PAIS excluded. He suggests there is lot of room for misdiagnosis in either direction resulting in the wrong people potentially being wrongly included or excluded. He urges the IOC to properly codify the testing process (after screening) to avoid controversy arising from miscategorising CAIS and PAIS.

I think it is more accurate to say he supports athletes with CAIS being included in the female category for as long as they, as a group, are not found to have competitive advantage over female athletes.

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