Glinner Bullseye comment on X

[Thatcatsaflippingnightmare]

Always trying to explain Glinner to DH, today he showed me on X JD Vance defending murder of the woman by ICE. Glinner had replied something like 'bullseye', as in agreement. I tried to comprehend with "satire?" but he said no he's on Liz truss show these days. I said well he's always been about protecting women and children, he's not suddenly supporting femicide, but the post convinced DH otherwise. Any insights? I'm not on social media

From what I have seen of the footage, it doesn't look as though she was driving at him, or at a speed that would have made it impossible for him to simply move away. However, I accept that my knowledge is limited, and I sincerely hope that the authorities are able to do a proper investigation.

The most Vance needed to say was

'I am not going to be drawn into making a statement before I know the details. Loss of life is a tragedy, and I ask for everyone to be patient and allow [whoever investigates this kind of thing in the US] to investigate what happened'.

From what I understand some of these agents have only had six week's training. I am open to the idea that things go wrong and that the police have to act quickly in difficult circumstances, but it's insane for Vance and Trump to have made the comments they did before they could possibly have adequate information.

I think that is more concerning than the incident itself (which is awful and tragic but limited to the people involved), because this is the most powerful government in the world, and they are not even making a pretence that they have an ethical responsibility to their citizens.

'I am not going to be drawn into making a statement before I know the details. Loss of life is a tragedy, and I ask for everyone to be patient and allow [whoever investigates this kind of thing in the US] to investigate what happened'.

Exactly - and before Trump was elected, this is what any president or vice-president, Democrat or Republican, would have said. That was considered the normal and acceptable way to respond to these matters. You don't take sides and you try and dial down the anger. It's not the way these people operate, unfortunately. They will lie quite brazenly and they enjoy whipping up their base into frenzied expressions of hate. We live in terrifying times.

That's a false equivalence.

The ICE agent did not kill her because she was a woman but because she refused an instruction to step out of her vehicle and then tried to drive away.
They would have done the same to a man in the same scenario and have done as we all know.

I don't agree with the agent shooting her but it is America and that is how they train their law enforcement officers because most civilians have guns which thankfully is not the case here. It's the main reason I would not live there, too many troubled people with guns. Also, the leading cause of death by gunshot in the USA is suicide, usually by men.

I think 'Gender Critical' has a specific meaning - people who criticise societal expectations of how a man or woman should behave, whether that it is by imposing gender identity or insisting that pink toys are for girls.

However I agree that it is used far too widely, and a woman who doesn't want to share a hospital ward with a man is not expressing a view on gender. She just doesn't want to share a hospital ward with a man.

The idea that an enforcement officer can kill someone because they disobeyed an order not to drive away is the sign of an out-of-control authoritarian state. The US is supposed to be a liberal democracy.

lifelong US conservative and lesbian I notice that people on the left have a simplistic view of humanity, dividing the world into the good and the bad. People are complex.
Glinner is great about trans and I personally don't like him. So what. Birdie Rose is such a strong woman and wonderful artist and she's against immigration, likes Tommy Robinson So what. You can agree to disagree and respect one another.
Being liberal-left does not make you a 'good' person and right-conservatives 'bad.' It's childish.

Now, I was a lawyer. In the US it's a federal offense to interfere with Federal law enforcement officers carrying out their duties. ICE posted this on X too. You don't follow ICE officers all day in your car and box them in. Why? Because if you're boxed in in a tense situation you are vulnerable. The Minn police refused to help.
So now when the armed Fed agent tells you to get out of your car; you do it!
You don't refuse and drive, hitting the officer with your vehicle. That's manslaughter.
By the way, that Fed officer previously had been hit by a protestor's car and got 33 stitches. So he had every reason to shoot.
America isn't Britain, people want law and order. And we understand you need force to maintain it; sometimes deadly force.

You've misunderstood my point, it's not one about sexism - rape just happened to be a useful comparison as the "asking for it" attitude is well known.

Yes he probably would have shot her if she were a man but that would have been wrong too, because "refusing an instruction to step out of her vehicle and then trying to drive away" SHOULD NOT BE A CAPITAL OFFENCE.*

There's one situation where it's appropriate to use lethal force and that's where there is a perceived danger to life, which was not the case here. (I note you implicitly accept this in saying she tried to drive "away", not to drive "at him" like many others are pretending to think.)

If it's an offence to disobey an instruction or drive off, they had ample video of her and her registration number, and could easily have had her picked up by police later. Instead that man chose to kill her in cold blood.

• I wouldn't be surprised if her femaleness was actually a factor, in that his ego was affronted by a woman having the audacity to disobey him, but that's a different discussion and I don't want to derail.

Not really though. Glinner making unpleasant comments is not the heart of the overall situation.

The truth is the heart of this. No one can change sex. Men are not women. Men and women have the right to single sex spaces and the law agrees.

No one would be particularly interested in Glinners view on this terrible incident if he hadn’t also expressed support for women’s rights. It’s just another means for the trans activists to attack us.

It's a country where nearly everyone has a gun.
That's the core issue and it's unlikely to change as the majority of Americans have been brought up to support gun ownership.

Knowing this, I do not understand why anyone living there would not follow an officer's instruction.

Even without guns I always follow a police officer's instruction if there is a speed control etc. I would also never argue with a police officer because you are in the wrong from the get go legally.

I think we should defer to Graham on this, he's a professional journalist with a lot more expertise than any of us and can look at it much more objectively.

You're ignoring the fact that nearly everyone has a gun in the USA.
That creates a climate of fear, including / especially for law enforcement agents.
They are people who are putting their lives on the line on a regular basis and may have lost colleagues in the past.

I don't agree with this setup but that is how it is and always has been in the USA. For this to no longer be a risk would require removing all /most civilian guns and that is simply not realistic.

I think the two women were unbelievably naive to have interfered with the ICE agents doing their job.

But ICE are now an arm of Trump's authorianism. They are made up of literal criminals who were convicted of attempting a coup and then pardoned so they could become part of this force. They are being sent into areas that support his political opponents in order to quell dissent. Without due process they are dragging US citizens from their cars and homes because of their skin colour or accent and detaining them without trial god knows where.

You think people who don't just go along with them are in the wrong? Did you think the same of people who stood against the Gestapo and the Stasi - that it would have been better for everyone if they'd just followed instructions?

EDIT: I've just seen your other post which says "They are people who are putting their lives on the line on a regular basis and may have lost colleagues in the past."
You say this about the current ICE thugs who killed this woman in cold blood? Please ignore my question about the Gestapo - you've already answered it.

I never once proposed it only goes one way.

"Sophia" is not a child, nor a female, nor a victim. "Sophia" needs to learn to leave other people alone and not film people without their consent by shoving phones in their faces. FAFO.

tealdreamers sarcastic any?

I think you've misunderstood my point. Of course the trans activists are using glinner's views to attack us. My point is that men on the right and men on the left both seem to hate women. They just manifest that hatred in different ways.

Things posted on social media are not "in the public domain", fwiw. That's a different thing from being viewable by the public. Doubly so when it involves minors. Whether or not you agree with the reason for their use.

Ask any photographer who's had their work used by the Daily Mail without permission, accreditation or payment, and taken them through the small claims court as a result of not understanding how copyright law works.

I'm disregarding the batshit latest 'be kind' attempt by TRAs earlier on this thread because ain't no-one got time for that so I might have missed something, but I've cancelled my Glinner substack. Kept it a long time due to residual feeling of loyalty for what he'd lost, but I can't do this any more.

I've only heard snippets about this incident on the radio in passing.

I've read about it in detail this morning on the BBC news website; the BBC article has included a video clip. The article details how the woman's car was blocking the road, an agent approached on the driver's side and said: "Get out of the car." The agent filming the clip moves in front of the car as the driver reverses and in a chaotic couple of seconds, she turns the wheel to the right and pulls forwards (quoted entirely from the BBC article).

The loss of life is tragic. I'm not going to offer an opinion beyond that, my only observation is that one could be forgiven for thinking this thread was about an entirely different incident.

On the contrary, gender ideology is an incredibly right wing belief, asserting as it does that individual desires should override anyone else's rights. It's the ultimate capitalist, free market proposition.

I think you might be confusing 'gender critical' and 'gender conservative'.

Gender Critical: Sex exists and women's rights depend on it's recognition in law and policy. Gender is a social construct that oppresses women.
Gender Ideology: We can ignore sex and women's right. Gender is innate and who cares if it oppresses women?
Gender Conservative: Sex exists - do you think we are stupid? Gender is innate and who cares if it oppresses women?

The movement is primarily funded by American evangelicals, particularly anti-abortion extremists who don't believe women deserve control of their own bodies.

Nope. British Gender Critical feminists were talking about this issue long before American Republicans noticed that their political opponents were promoting the crazy idea that people could change sex, and they could use this to their advantage. It is true that people have found it easier to ignore Gender Critical feminists. Perhaps you just prefer to listen to Matt Walsh?

its gender non conforming females that are going to be victimised over and over by rightwing men who feel entitled to try and look at our parts under the guise of 'helping us'.

Why would gender non conforming females be any more likely to be victimised than they have at any other point in history? Is your assumption that people think they are men? The complete failure of gender non conforming females to acquire male privilege, rather suggests that nobody is unclear about their sex.

I find I care far more about the much higher percentage of females getting attacked and assaulted for looking 'too manly' than I care about preventing the odd male in a dress quietly using a cubicle.

This implies that you understand that women who get attacked and assaulted for 'looking too manly' are the victims of homophobia and misogyny, not mistaken identity. I don't know why you think a man who identifies as a woman should wear a dress, given that women are under no obligation to do so, but if you think toilets should be mixed sex, campaign for that. There is absolutely no logic behind having single sex toilets that can be used by anyone of either sex.

Why did so many people in this movement react with pure glee at a teenagers brutal murder because the child was on 'the wrong side of the movement' I dont know.

Are you spending a lot of time on X? My impression was that there was huge sympathy and respect for Brianna Ghey's mother, but I suppose it depends who you follow.

I'm sorry you're too stupid to see what's in front of your eyes and support men who kill women in cold blood

I really didn't like Charlie Kirk at all but I wouldn't personally retweet things celebrating his death - much less jokes trivialising an incident where someone is shot in front of their loved ones - and it makes me sad that someone like Glinner, who I have admired long before his GC era, would choose to do so here, presumably because it was the death of someone he himself would disagree with politically.

That's my line on the issue. It's nothing at all to do with where you stand on the trans debate or what someone may have done or said regarding those things, it's simply a matter of not conducting yourself as a cunt.

America isn't Britain, people want law and order. And we understand you need force to maintain it; sometimes deadly force.

America doesn't have more 'law and order' than the UK. Just many, many guns floating around, which means that people are often shot in chaotic circumstances.