Glinner Bullseye comment on X

[Thatcatsaflippingnightmare]

Always trying to explain Glinner to DH, today he showed me on X JD Vance defending murder of the woman by ICE. Glinner had replied something like 'bullseye', as in agreement. I tried to comprehend with "satire?" but he said no he's on Liz truss show these days. I said well he's always been about protecting women and children, he's not suddenly supporting femicide, but the post convinced DH otherwise. Any insights? I'm not on social media

I thought Victoria Coren was his sister in law? Did I make that up? Apologies if I did.

You seem unable to understand what I’ve said and to be deliberately making out that I’m saying the opposite of what I’m saying.

“I'm not the one urging people to see things from their perspective, or writing about their carmaradarie as if there were bravely carrying on a noble struggle behind enemy lines.”

If this is what you got from me explaining what I’ve experienced in the past when being regularly intimidated, forced into compliance, and demeaned by armed soldiers and policemen who viewed me as their enemy, your reading comprehension is questionable.

I'm not on X so can't read what he wrote about this incident.
If you are accusing him of something, you should include a quote from him so we can see what you are referring to at the very least.

What do you know about checkpoints?

No, she isn’t. She has publicly requested that he leave her alone, however. And that he seeks help.
I’m disgusted by this latest development and whatever residual support I’ve had for him has vanished. I suppose he sees his future as being in the US but shameless toadying like this….he can get to fuck.
I championed his battle about gender issues, bought his book etc but unease did set in with the relentless substack cap in hand when it appeared women were doing the majority of the work for him. This has no ambiguity to it, it’s a cheap, misogynistic ‘win’ in his own mind.

He’s way beyond tactless. Take a look at the tweets he’s been posting and reposting recently, they’re hideous.

My understanding was that the dispute happened because the car blocked the road. I didn’t think there was a checkpoint.

Are checkpoints now common in the US?

Even in the parts of the UK that had sectarianism (Glasgow, Liverpool, South Tyneside), we never had roadblocks. I'm glad all that seems to be over, touch wood.

I'm ignoring the bunfight that is the rest of this thread.

What checkpoint? There was no checkpoint in this week’s event.

I think most people on here recognize this was a tragedy for the woman who was shot and her family but especially for her children - two of whom live with their father, her first husband. Her second husband and father of her youngest child passed away 2 years ago, so he is now an orphan at just six years of age.

This appears to be a protest gone wrong.
Good appears to have deliberately stopped her SUV perpendicular to traffic on a one-way street in an attempt to block armed ICE officers going about their business.

Her partner then got out of the car and started filming and taunting the ICE officers - not a smart move by any standard. Then an ICE agent ordered Good to get out of the car and tried to open the door but it was locked. She refused to do as instructed by law enforcement and her partner shouted at her to "drive baby drive" - the worst possible advice anyone could have given her in that moment. Good then reversed her car so that she could drive forward on a one-way street and into the path of another ICE officer who pulled out his gun and shot her.

Should he have shot her? No.
Did he think she would run him over? Possibly.
Someone else did six months ago which almost certainly resulted in his split-second decision to shoot.

It doesn't make it right but this is not the first time someone in the US has been shot for failing to obey an armed officer.

I was stopped by an armed officer in the US years ago for speeding while driving through a pitch-black nature reserve while trying to make my way back to the hotel after a day trip. I stopped as soon as I heard the siren and did exactly what the officer told me to because anything else would have been courting danger.

In situations like this when you or your car is surrounded by armed men, and they feel you aren’t co-operating, you’ll be asked for your driving license/ID, they’ll run your numberplate through databases, they’ll ask you questions about who you are, where you’re going, what you’re doing. They’ll want you to get out of the vehicle to search it and search you. It’s effectively an ad hoc checkpoint. And it’s very intimidating and unpleasant.

These people aren't your everyday law enforcement officers with legitimacy, they are armed thugs who are terrorising US citizens in their own country.

From the perspective of republicans living in Northern Ireland:

The Royal Ulster Constabulary and British Army aren't your everyday law enforcement officers with legitimacy, they are an occupying force composed of armed thugs who are terrorising Irish citizens in their own country.

And they don't reliably know the difference between unionists and republicans, so the people from both factions were at risk of being shot at by the RUC and British Army.

That is what @UtopiaPlanitia grew up with, in what was a de facto war zone. Stop dismissing her experiences as somehow irrelevant and stop misrepresenting her as sympathising with ICE. She is describing a pragmatic approach to surviving an encounter with armed men who have the State's backing.

This lawyer knows the DC police Chief was brought before Congress for manipulating crime data.
https://oversight.house.gov/release/oversight-committee-releases-bombshell-report-revealing-d-c-s-police-chief-deliberately-manipulated-crime-data/
And yes the DC murder rate is down
https://www.city-journal.org/article/new-york-times-trump-crime-national-guard
I saw plenty of black DC residents on x thrilled
and thanking the Guard.

I've heard some conflicting things about the car blocking the road. I've heard that it was an informal checkpoint, in the sense of it was set up temporarily not permanently.

However, if she had set up her car to block the road and the officers approached her then, it comes to the same thing in terms of managing the scene. The main difference would be that instead of thinking she was probably just a nice lady on her way somewhere, she was in fact a political protester. Who might be harmless, but also could be looking to do something more extreme. It weighs the calculation more towards it being a risky situation.

I don't know if checkpoints are common in the US, aside from border areas where they are set up permanently.

But presumably the women who died didn't grow up in those conditions either. And if it's comparable then ICE officers are also
an occupying force composed of armed thugs who are terrorising Irish citizens in their own country

Surely that means the public outcry should be worse? And makes the people excusing the officers actions by trying to smear her or suggesting she was at fault for not acting like the men with guns were a hostile occupying force worse. It makes people spreading smears about her worse not better.

This.

It doesn't matter if people think there is some kind of philosophic legitimacy to the government sending out ICE groups. They have the legal authority to ask people to do things.

This.

I think maybe the point was the British were not in fact an illegal occupying force...

I'm still confused why the conversation has turned to checkpoints. Was this a checkpoint? Were they stopping all traffic? Were the people in the car under investigation for something? Suspects in a crime?

The two women used their vehicle to block a one-way street where ICE officers were carrying out their duties. Good's new partner, Becca Good, said that they had whistles which suggests that they were using them to alert whoever the ICE agents were looking to arrest so that they could get away presumably.
Based on anything I've read, the pair appeared to be obstructing ICE officers doing their job in the belief that they had the moral high-ground.

Good's son attended a "social justice kindergarten" where the school administration actively encouraged staff to inform them of any ICE interventions.
That sounds like they were activists to me at least - I've never heard of a "social justice kindergarten" and I would never send a child to one.

What happened to that woman was horrific and an almost inevitable consequence of the state giving its agents the ability to use lethal force. Something always goes wrong in these types of situations, so reducing the ways that state agents can harm citizens is sensible - I think policing by consent, by police who can’t deploy lethal force is the ideal.

When you are surrounded by men with guns, no matter how much you loathe them or vehemently disagree with them or consider them to be an imposition on your rights as a citizen or you hate them for terrifying you, you are more likely to get out of the situation alive and intact if you comply with their orders. They have all the power in that situation and they WILL use it against if you give them cause to claim they had no other choice open to them.

This has been my experience in interactions with both armed police officers, with armed soldiers and with armed paramilitaries.

My DS1 married an American and went to live in the US. The first thing his new FIL told him, to help him settle in to his new life, was 'If law enforcement pull you over: 1. turn off the engine 2. put your hands on the steering wheel where they can see them'.

He knew DS1 was at a dangerous disadvantage by not having been born into the US gun culture.

This event is a tragedy for everyone involved.

Back when I travelled for my job I had "security" training which involved, among other things, the correct way to interact with armed guards/soldiers/rebels at checkpoints and other situations. It was very useful and I absolutely agree it's good to know how to stay safe. But it's also very sad that the techniques I was advised to use when travelling to "bad" countries also apparently applies to American citizens in her own country. I actually think "speak respectfully to armed men and never get involved in any protests" is a good idea when travelling especially in dangerous or politically unstable countries. It's quite dangerous when politicians start saying that about their own countries because getting involved in protests for example is an important right, you lose that right if it excuses violent actions against you.

Plus, while I know the hands on the wheel advice is standard, presumably that doesn't apply anymore. Since having your hands on the wheel can also be a threat of violence.

Plus, while I know the hands on the wheel advice is standard, presumably that doesn't apply anymore. Since having your hands on the wheel can also be a threat of violence.

That's why #1 is Turn the Engine off

That wooshing noise you heard over your head was my point.

When the State arms men and gives them a licence to shoot people, you do not do not do not provoke those men. Whether or not ICE agents are "everyday law enforcement officers with legitimacy" in your opinion or not, the State has given them guns and said they can use them. I raised the example of the RUC in NI, and how republicans regard them as an illegitimate occupying force, to try to illustrate how whether you agree with their legitimacy is completely irrelevant. If they feel like it, they can still kill you with near-impunity because it will probably be covered up.

Utopia has lived experience of this. So do all Americans, because their police are armed.

You don't challenge them to make a point. Defiance will get you killed. If you want to fight back, do it through the courts.