Teen threw out Harry Potter books. Help me form points for discussion please

[ItsPeggyOlson]

Please help me with points about how JKR is not a monster to put to my young teen who grew up with her books but has had head turned by friends/school. I’m also looking for a primer in basic GC points. I think there must be an existing thread but I can’t find it so would be happy if someone could link it.

In past talks I thought I had made convincing enough points about people not being able to change sex but haven’t discussed the topic in a good while and clearly others have now radicalised my child and it’s very upsetting. My muddled peri brain is making it hard to form coherent points but I would like to have a calm conversation after I initially flew off the handle when I first realised what had happened with the books. Thanks for any guidance.

I would put it back on her and ask what JKR has said which is transphobic.

Thanks, that’s a good start.

This brainwashing is truly terrifying. One of my children who lived her books growing up is so vitriolic about her it’s really upsetting.

I would just leave it, let your children make their own decisions about things. If you try to change their mind you could alienate yourself from them further

Get the original essay so they can see its refering to single sex spaces in particular vulnerable circumstances not saying its all evil.

And big up her philanthropic work.

I would ask your teen to read JKR’s essay on the subject, and have a respectful discussion about it.

I’ve passed this on to a few people I know who had joined the bandwagon of JKR hate without even knowing what she’d said. All responded with “Oh, was that it?”

That’s what I do sadly. I just can’t cope with the aggravation and upset.

No one listens to someone who has not listened to them and understood them.

You need to sit down snd really listen to their point of view. And listen to really understand it and take it seriously. Ask clarifying questions to show you are really seeking to understand. Summarize their view to show you are checking their understanding. Find the areas you have common ground with your child’s view. Only then can you gently start to ask questions to get them to question their own thinking.

At the end of the day, they are entitled to their own point of view. And as teens, acceptance by their peers and ‘fitting in’ will be their main driver. Trying to get them to hold adopt at view that is actively opposed by their friendship group, and could get them kicked out of it is a big ask. being friendless and ostracized and bullied at that age is very damaging. its a big ask to go against your peers at that age.

You could even try a different angle and have conversations about how to handle it of you have different views from your peers ( I’ve told my eldest to just keep quiet about his sex realist views, unless his friends express similar views. He can choose to go his own path when he is older)

Yes, ask them what JKR has said or done which makes her transphobic; ask them whether they have read her essay. Show that you are very willing to have a grown up conversation about this but equally that you expect DC to show that they have done an appropriate level of critical thinking of their own on the subject and haven’t just hopped on to a bandwagon without doing their own research. I can respect a well considered, well researched and well supported point of view but have no time for the “because TikTok says so” shite.

JKR’s recent response to Emma Watson is also worth considering: it’s very easy for privileged young women to have a position like Watson’s on this topic because their needs for single sex spaces are well protected.

I hope your teen paid for the books they have thrown out? Because otherwise, on a practical level, that would be an issue for me!

Teen rebels against parent. Standard behavior.
She is forming her own views as a young adult , she may or may not continue to hold those views, but you didn't need to convince her otherwise , she's growing up.
Me and my teenagers held very different views as teenagers in many different issues, not so much now they're adults

From another angle, I would make the point about separating the artist from their work.

I'd ignore it

Most tweens/teens have grown out of hp by the time they get to secondary education, it's widely regarded as cringe

Oh bloomin heck… no teen wants a “points of discussion” chat with their parent

just say you’re pissed at the waste as it could have gone to charity

I would read very carefully as your relationship is the most precious thing here. It is all about tone which is difficult to express in words on a page. I would try to express it as ‘You absolutely loved those books. It is horrible to feel someone we admired is less than we thought they were. But I think she has been a bit maligned - let’s look at what she said and why she said it’. But very gently.

Point 1 ‘of discussion’:

‘You can go and fish those books out of the bin now.’

Throwing out books, ffs.

Would it help to make it into a more general conversation about critical thinking?

You don't say whether you have a younger or older teen, but with our DC we tried to instil the view that they could have whatever opinions they wanted (as long as not offensive) but we expected them to have considered both sides of the argument using fact based sources, have thought about them properly and to be able to explain why they had come to the opinion they had. "I saw something on TikTok" really didn't wash.

So the response to "I think JKR is transphobic" is "why do you think that?". Let them explain. If they don't have an explanation, challenge them to go away and find one - and to also look at opposing views. They might not change their mind overnight (or actually bother to find anything), but hopefully it will spark something.

Agree, it’s not ok to destroy books. If he doesn’t want them any more they can be donated.

then I’d ask him to read the essay and say what he disagrees with

Just ask them to clarify what's so transphobic about JKR's position. And if they have no evidence, why are they accepting this judgement of her blindly?

Has she asked for a discussion?

I'd ask her not to throw out books but to pass them on. If I wanted my own copies, I'd have them. But as PP said, teenagers often clear out childhood books anyway, and return to them as adults.

I'd be ready to discuss if she raises it, but otherwise hesitant to impose that discussion on a teenager. It's likely to be counter-productive. But you can make it clear if it ever comes up that you disagree and would be happy to explain your perspective at some point if she's interested.

I wouldn’t bother. Not worth risking the relationship. I actually think some young people have leapt on this point of difference between generations as a way of generating conflict because on most other topics Gen X and their teens agree on.

Also how old is she? Anecdotally this is definitely a stage most seem to move on from. Both mine and their friends now older teens gently eye rolled at the “they/thems” as they call them, support single sex spaces and have zero issues with jkr. This seems to be the majority view.

I agree with throwing out books, just give them to someone else. And learning to separate art from the artists. Trust me, there isn’t that much art left to enjoy once you know about the artists lives, especially non modern ones.

As for the whole trans ideology, males in womens sports was the hill I was prepared to die on and that one worked with my eldest brainwashed child. That and the transgirl at school who was a major creep that used trans ideology to guilt trip lesbian girls into dating him.

There is a 1 million pound prize for anyone who can find anything that JKR has said or written that is transphobic. Looking for something might get her reading.

Then Karen White.

This. Otherwise leave her alone and let her come to her senses in her own time. Teens do not appreciate being told what to think by old people.

I'd rip her a new one for throwing away books - any books.

My DD and I several years ago had to agree never to raise the issue of JKR, trans women etc etc again with each other. She was in her early 20s and was spouting frankly shit. We were both in tears with our last conversation about it.

Since then she has matured and had several experiences which has made her question and change her beliefs. She gets it now. We've never had to talk about why her beliefs have changed and I have never said I told you so 😬.

So I would bide my time frankly.