"Darlington Nurses" vs County Durham and Darlington NHS Trust Tribunal Thread 3

[AuthorisedCat]

Link to Thread 1, 7-Oct to 23-Oct; pre-hearing discussion, evidence from KD (Day 1) and BH (Day 2).

Link to Thread 2
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5432103-darlington-nurses-vs-county-durham-and-darlington-nhs-trust-tribunal-thread-2

Five nurses working at Darlington Memorial Hospital have filed a legal case suing their employer, an NHS trust, for sexual harassment and sex discrimination. The nurses object to sharing the women’s changing facilities with a male colleague, Rose, who identifies as female. The NHS trust’s HR department dismissed the nurses’ concerns, stating they should “broaden their mindset” and “be educated”. More details can be found at Sex Matters and at Christian Concern who are supporting the nurses via the CLC.
The hearing started on October 20th, with evidence starting on October 22nd and is scheduled to last 3 weeks. To view the hearing online, requests for access had to be made by October 17th. The hearing is being live tweeted by Tribunal Tweets who have background to this case on their substack. An alternative to X is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets
The Judge made clear at the start of the public hearing on Day 1 that only TT or press have permission to tweet. If online observers see/hear something in the court that isn’t reported by TT, we don’t mention it until the next time there’s a break. This is a very cautious approach to avoid any accusations of “live reporting” on MN. Commentary on the content of TT tweets is fine as soon as they’re posted on X.
Key people:
C/Ns - Claimants, the Darlington nurses
R/T/Trust - Respondent, County Durham and Darlington NHS Foundation Trust
J/EJ – Judge/Employment Judge
NF - Niazi Fetto KC, barrister for claimants
SC - Simon Cheetham, KC, barrister for respondents
RH - Rose Henderson, trans identifying nurse
CG – Clare Gregory, ward manager
KD – Karen Danson, first claimant to give evidence.
BH – Bethany Hutchison, second claimant to give evidence
AH – Alistair Hutchison, husband of Bethany
Other abbreviations:
WFTCHTJ – Waiting For The Conference Host To Join
ET - Employment Tribunal
DMH/H – Hospital, Darlington Memorial Hospital
CR/CF - changing room or facilities
IX - internal investigation
XX – cross examination

From TT

TA - Yes I was concerned about the impact, concerns about the letter, concerned generally by the situation
NF - and the scale if it meant that urgent action was needed?
TA - Yes we needed to address the matter and thats why I went straight back after easter to try to understand

NF - We'll stop there for the day
J - back tomorrow at 10 [J reminds TA not to discuss case with anyone]

[Hearing ends. Resumes tomorrow at 10am]

TT's 2nd afternoon tweets

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1983557475891867902.html

Slippery is correct it must be in these peoples job description.

It helps them none that this level of inertia existed/exists and is exposed for all to see.

What's TA's job title? I'm going to look for some job descriptions.

What a load of corporate wank speak.

ARRRRRRRGHHH

Oh goodness she rushed back after Easter so she could gain an understanding

<Bangs head on desk>

She was concerned donchaknow?!

Being concerned about concerns is the mark of a true HR professional.

Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5435420-darlington-nurses-vs-county-durham-and-darlington-nhs-trust-tribunal-thread-4

Please fill up this one first - I need to do some work so I trust all the training from nauticant in the Peggie threads will pay off.

⚽And it's Atkinson now...she to Moore, Moore plays the ball back to Atkinson and it's a clever little backheel there by Atkinson to Bailey, who holds the ball, waiting for someone to show and now it's Robinson, coming deep to take the ball, passes it back to Moore to Atkinson to Watson, and a long ball now towards Smedley who links with Gregory who thinks about making a run into the box but decides instead on a back pass to Atkinson, who puts the ball out of play...⚽
Do your own Match of the Day music😁

Glad I wasn't listening to that pile of slippery corporate shite. Will be interesting to see what was the legal avenue they did or didn't go down.

Surely the concerns of the many outweighed the wants of the one?

Did it really come down to sexism and misogyny, because it was only 300 women users of the changing room and they don't count against a single man - or was it simply incompetence and disinterest?

Surely it was premier league “pass the hot potato” they were playing. Perhaps even “pass the parcel” but they had had worked out somehow that all that was wrapped up in the centre was a steaming heap of shit.

TA appears to me to be the HR equivalent of a support animal.

She may see her job as supporting managers but not the staff under them.

( my experience with an HR person in a Employment Tribunal i was involved with)

Gah what a frustrating afternoon. My take from reading the thread is that a lot of people were doing a lot of not a lot. Passing the buck, hoping that someone else was going to step up and do something.

This springs to mind:

"There was an important job to be done and Everybody was sure that Somebody would do it.

Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it.

Somebody got angry about that because it was Everybody’s job.

Everybody thought that Anybody could do it, but Nobody realized that Everybody wouldn’t do it.

It ended up that Everybody blamed Somebody when Nobody did what Anybody could have done."

I think that NF has done a good job of exposing the lack of response from those that should have stepped up and actually, you know, managed the situation.

Bit she's not supporting the managers, as she's not helping to fix the issue.

I've been up a ladder all afternoon with a paintbrush and the volume turned up to 11 so not giving it full attention. My impression is that TA spent a lot of time being very 'concerned' but did fuck all. Fair?

I think TA was much more aware of what was going on but managed to keep herself distanced from it most of the time and largely off the record. If she did that in anticipation of an ET that would have been very canny indeed.

I don't think she was concerned, just knew that there were concerns, but didn't understand the concerns, or investigate the concerns, after all it's not her job to be concerned.

But yes, she did fuck all.

Is this actually what TA and AT do all day?

@MarieDeGournay Well put i had an image of rugby myself, ending in a scrum

Well now. There are some interesting job descriptions on line for current vacancies. For those who are interested the JDs do highlight accountabilities and responsibilities … maybe the ET participants need to read their own JDs.

https://beta.jobs.nhs.uk/candidate/jobadvert/C9439-25-0201

I like the description in the URL: beta.jobs

Would love to know how normal this is for an employment tribunal. Any employment lawyers on here? I mean if we separate out the lunacy of allowing men in female CR, if there’s a dispute between 2 groups of workers does it usually just hang around like a bad smell with no one actually taking the lead on resolving it?

Will the judge be sympathetic to the nurses going to the press because nothing was happening? Or is this all totally normal????