High Court rules that a trans man......

[theilltemperedmaggotintheheartofthelaw]

...... cannot be denied a gender recognition certificate because he is trying to conceive, in an important win supported by Good Law Project.

https://goodlawproject.org/win-victory-in-landmark-case-on-gender-recognition/

Apologies for the source, but it's currently the only free one.

Sex registered at birth? As in sex assigned at birth? As in a penis makes you male & a vagina makes you female?

See where this is going? 😂

Caster, Imane & post op trans women will be relieved….

That seems reasonable. This judgement has also served to further emasculate (for want of a better word) the GRA and further separate the concept of gender identity from sex which makes absolute sense given that it’s the Gender Recognition Act.

Therefore a GRC can’t be used for any sex affected or related purposes.

Mental illness is not logical. Poor woman has probably not thought through this: I am really a man, I want to have children, I have a womb, I can have a baby and become a father...because I am a man. Logic not in it.

Love the way our male visitors get schooled on this site. And yet back they come for more education. Almost embarrassing.

Yes. Although we need to stop the GERA allowing falsification of the birth certificate. That is utterly nonsensical and so open to fraud.

Yes.

Get a certificate to say you're immortal ruler of the universe if you wish: it changes nothing.

The recent exchange about "female" and "feminine" suggests that a certain poster has very poor reading comprehension.

I think some men enjoy the attention. 🙄

Comprehension fail indeed.

What part of "most female thing you can do" seems like an action & not being?
Context matters...

Well, yes. Biological sex is just a shorter way of saying what external genitalia the individual had at birth (and therefore irrelevant to a man who has his genitalia surgically altered later on).

A very few people (fewer than 2 in 10,000) are born with external genitalia that are (ambiguous or) don't match their gonads. An even smaller subset will go on to develop secondary sex characteristics that don't match their external genitalia. Of those, any that don't elect feminising treatment are entitled, in the UK, to correct their birth registration with retroactive effect.

In the UK, Khelif and Semenya would be:

Legally biologically female, but:

Entitled to correct their birth registrations to male if they want to: and

Not entitled to use women's single-sex services under Schedule 3 of the Equality Act, as a derogation from the ban on perceptive sex discrimination.

And of course any individual who's been through male puberty, as they have, can be excluded from female sports, just by writing it into the rules. There's no need for a philosophical debate, just one about safety and fairness.

One thing I think everyone on this board will agree on - we don't have the foggiest idea what is meant by 'CIS female'. Is it an action? An adjective? An adverb? Who knows?

This whole situation is odd. Why is she undergoing IVF at age 21? Normally fertility issues aren’t diagnosed until after several years of trying for a baby, much less jumping straight to the very expensive IVF,

She appears to have been taking testosterone - I’m guessing that has messed with her ovulation but two miscarriages is a concern - has the testosterone damaged her reproductive system so she can’t carry a baby to term?

Why is such a young woman so focused on having a baby that she is going to such lengths despite serious mental issues and no partner? Where did the GLP find her? Was she groomed into this by activists?

Ignoring the grammatically incorrect statement that "femininity" is an action - it's a noun, not a verb - I think we're coming to a consensus here:

Yes, it's a performance. A series of behaviours that can be performed or enacted in a particularly way.

(Feminine = adjective. A word to describe a noun

Femininity = noun)

The concept of living as a woman or man is ridiculous and should be dispensed with. The problem with the GNC however is that it is used maliciously to efface biological sex and access services and spaces not intended for the holder. The current TRA gambit is simply to not comply with the law and use ambiguity and mas-disobedience to disestablish sex a meaningful category. In that the GNC plays a critical role.

So, the unfortunate situation is that the judge ruled correctly but it does indeed play into the TRAs' hands.

Well said - this is the key issue, not the derailing about a man's insistence on accessing the women's toilets.

This is yet another example of how mentally vulnerable the young women caught up in all this are. Presumably she's got the money (or access to the powerful with money) to pursue this court case.

But every time these cases come up, they expose just how unwell so many of these young women are - and how easy it is for them to be exploited by others.

Aha! The DSD gotcha moment....

Except it's not a gotcha at all.

Semenya and others with the DSD known as 45 XY 5ARD were incorrectly observed to be female at birth, because their penis didn't grow until puberty. External genital development is the final stage of reproductive development in the fetus and, with this particular DSD, it's in this final stage that fetal development goes off track from the norm. The additional surge in testosterone that males get during puberty is enough to allow the penis to grow, but by then the incorrect observation that they were female was then recorded on their birth certificate.

By contrast, the transman in this thread was correctly observed to be and recorded as female at birth. How do I know this?

1. this person has female reproductive organs. The first evidence of this would have been starting menstruation. Without menstruation having started, it would be impossible to become pregnant - and this case is about someone who expects to be pregnant (I'm going to assume the transman in question is correct that this would be physically possible, and isn't just a man bringing Loretta's wish for the right for men to give birth out of Monty Python and into real life)
2. a GRC has been requested to make a change from female to male in the public record. The only reason for this request is if the public record currently says that this person is female.

This ⬆️

"because HE is trying to conceive"

He is just wasting his and everyone esle's time thern.

Perhaps he is expecting a miracle birth

I suspect she may be thinking that once she has children, then she can fully be a man and this will fix the issues that are distressing her.

Many young people I work with create narratives whereby all of the issues they have are because they are not the sex they should be and transitioning will fix this. Of course it doesn’t and the issues carry forward.

It is very concerning that this young women is planning on being a single parent. The demands of looking after an infant on your own, especially the sleep deprivation, is a risk factor for poor mental health.

I fear that if she does have a baby, she will really struggle. If she doesn’t struggle, and finds motherhood rewarding, she may well find her gender distress reduces considerably.

Thank you.

I hope we can all ignore the desperate attempts to derail.

It is also very concerning that a 21 yr old has already had a single mastectomy which obviously precludes breastfeeding yet now is desperate to conceive.

If you were if sound mind and planning to have a baby, amputation of your breasts to remove the healthiest food source for baby should not have been considered.

Education and indoctrination-wise, she will have been at school at the height of the activism and lies in schools. Schools actively incentivising trans identities by giving celebration assemblies, activist teachers seemingly trying to encourage trans identification to burnish their cool Stonewall credentials (that’s all gone a bit quiet now, I wonder how many schools are still proud ‘gold standard allies’ or whatever the prize was).

In the kindest possible way, I hope her fertility journey is not yet successful. She does not sound remotely mentally ready for the huge responsibility of a child.

The patience some of the regular posters here never fails to astound me.

You are honestly amazing.

Are any of you teachers or in education? You should be!
Teaching requires herculean levels of patience, due to being faced with obstinate little people who make it their mission to argue the toss even though they know deep down they are wrong, and the main purpose of their contrariness is just to wind you up.

I think a particular poster may still be locked in this stage of development.

I fear that if she does have a baby, she will really struggle. If she doesn’t struggle, and finds motherhood rewarding, she may well find her gender distress reduces considerably.

Agreed, however I’m sure you would agree that a baby should not be used an attempt to improve her mental health. It’s a very high risk strategy for her and the baby. I guess in this case, it’s not actually being used to improve her mental health as everyone egging her on is pretending she hasn’t got mental health issues?

Who are these medical ghouls helping this girl harm herself so much?

This provides an opportunity for a moment of light relief.

"It's every man's right to have babies if he wants them"...

Yikes! It didn’t cross my mind that anyone would think having a baby would improve someone’s mental health!!

The only info I have read about pregnancy and transmen has been how challenging being pregnant is for their gender dysphoria.

My guess is that this young women feels overwhelmed with the ‘loss’ that would accompany the bottom surgery ‘needed’ to treat her gender distress. The simple solution to this is to have children and then bottom surgery!

In terms of those supporting her, wealthy parents have skin in the game if they want to have grandchildren and/or postpone further physical intervention in the hope that she stops believing her issues arise from having a female body. Gender ideologues will support her because it aligns with their thinking that sexual reproduction has nothing to do with one’s sex.

No, it's for you. That you don't understand that it's for you is why you you have come to fallacious conclusion you have