Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Update on the National Library of Scotland debacle.

185 replies

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · 15/10/2025 21:17

After the NLS removed The Women Who Wouldn’t Wheesht from the Dear Library Exhibition they received so many complaints The Library commissioned an independent review of the process leading up to the decision not to include the book.

This reviewer, an advocate and independent member of the Scottish Bar, was asked to investigate:

  • The process for the public nomination
  • The initial selection of items for the exhibition
  • The decision to review the initial selection
  • Whether appropriate corporate governance processes, including equality impacts assessments were followed throughout
  • What influencing factors may have contributed to the decision.

As one of the many people who lodge a complaint, I received an email today with the finds of the investigation. I can’t link to it, because it’s just a document, and I couldn’t find a copy of it on the NLS’s website, although it due to be posted there. I thought I'd post this in case anyone was wondering how it all turned out

Investigator's Summary
The process for public nomination and selection of books to be included in The Book That Shaped Me was reasonable and appropriate. The LGBT Staff Network and allies raised concerns that 'The Women Who Wouldn't Wheesht' had been selected, because members considered it was discriminatory and exclusionary and involved a risk of serious harm to staff and visitors. Those concerns were appropriately escalated, and the National Librarian ultimately assumed responsibility for deciding whether the book should be included. She decided it should not, and that was supported by the Chair of the Board. That decision was based on inadequate risk assessment, informed by inadequate evidence and consultation. The decision did not uphold the aims set out in the Library's Equality, Diversity, and Inclusion policy.

By my reading of the report, it’s clear that the CEO and the Chair of the Board caved to pressure from the alphabettie Staff Action Group.
The investigated didn’t buy any of the sorry excuses that the staff gave for it being withdrawn, the report corrected a couple of what I would call lies, but the investigator didn’t, that were put forward in an attempt to justify the action.

The 2 main reason’s the Staff Group gave were the book contravened the NLS EDL policy, and that having in the exhibition would be a threat to the safety of staff.

The report points out that excluding a book written by gender critical women was not inclusive, and that by pulling the book the NLS were the ones who contravened their own EDI policy. It also stated that neither the CEO nor Chair made any attempt to risk assess the alleged threat to staff.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
13
InSlovakiaTheCapitalOfCourseIsBratislava · 28/11/2025 18:39

My first boss once told me I was very like Tiffany Aching. I don’t think it was a compliment 😅

wee Free men is good and stand alone but the later ones, it is better to know more about the witches. I stand by Wyrd Sisters

WaterThyme · 28/11/2025 18:39

Equal Rites. That’s when Pratchett starts exploring the world he set up in The Colour of Magic and The Light Fantastic, books 1&2 of Discworld.

WaterThyme · 28/11/2025 18:40

And the Witches first appear

InSlovakiaTheCapitalOfCourseIsBratislava · 28/11/2025 18:42

Equal Rites is also a good place to start. It is the first one of the Witches series within the series if that consoles the twitchiness @ArabellaSaurus ?

Colour of Magic and the Light Fantastic are more sword, sandals and sorcery spoofs and not fully in the discworld groove, and I think it’s harder to get into the series from them

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 28/11/2025 18:52

InSlovakiaTheCapitalOfCourseIsBratislava · 28/11/2025 18:39

My first boss once told me I was very like Tiffany Aching. I don’t think it was a compliment 😅

wee Free men is good and stand alone but the later ones, it is better to know more about the witches. I stand by Wyrd Sisters

Oh, to me that would have been a total compliment! If your boss intended it otherwise, they did not understand Tiffany Aching.

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 28/11/2025 18:56

InSlovakiaTheCapitalOfCourseIsBratislava · 28/11/2025 18:39

My first boss once told me I was very like Tiffany Aching. I don’t think it was a compliment 😅

wee Free men is good and stand alone but the later ones, it is better to know more about the witches. I stand by Wyrd Sisters

And until v recently I had only read the Tiffany series, and I don’t feel like I was missing anything witchy. Of course, I obviously don’t know what I don’t know, so I may be missing everything, but I stand by my suggestion. I don’t love the last Tiffany book - think the posthumous editing leaned too much into the moralising (Pratchett never hit you over the head with his morals), but I still re-read the series regularly.

NotAtMyAge · 28/11/2025 19:35

WaterThyme · 28/11/2025 18:39

Equal Rites. That’s when Pratchett starts exploring the world he set up in The Colour of Magic and The Light Fantastic, books 1&2 of Discworld.

That's the first I read because it was Woman's Hour book of the week back in the late 1980s and hearing just one episode hooked me. The rest is history.

SidewaysOtter · 28/11/2025 19:45

I’d also agree with Equal Rites and the rest of the Witches series, including the Tiffany Aching books. Colour of Magic/the Wizards series is good, but I think it benefits from the reader being at least a bit familiar with the bizarreness of the Discworld already.

Witches Abroad is my absolute favourite!

SidewaysOtter · 28/11/2025 19:52

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 28/11/2025 18:56

And until v recently I had only read the Tiffany series, and I don’t feel like I was missing anything witchy. Of course, I obviously don’t know what I don’t know, so I may be missing everything, but I stand by my suggestion. I don’t love the last Tiffany book - think the posthumous editing leaned too much into the moralising (Pratchett never hit you over the head with his morals), but I still re-read the series regularly.

I don’t think it comes out quite as much in the Tiffany Aching books but I love Pratchett’s depiction of witching in the Witches series, particularly different attitudes towards it - there’s Magrat with her full range of colour coded ritual athames, whereas Granny just uses a bread knife because it fulfils the same magical purpose AND you can cut bread with it. He covers the morals of/need for respect for witchcraft too.

Plus I love Granny, she’s my hero!

InSlovakiaTheCapitalOfCourseIsBratislava · 28/11/2025 20:10

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 28/11/2025 18:52

Oh, to me that would have been a total compliment! If your boss intended it otherwise, they did not understand Tiffany Aching.

I am the kind of person who would definitely say ‘ah I see the moon is gibbous tonight’

i love the witches. Definitely lots of life can be dealt with by saying ‘ how would granny weatherwax sort this ‘

SidewaysOtter · 28/11/2025 20:20

InSlovakiaTheCapitalOfCourseIsBratislava · 28/11/2025 20:10

I am the kind of person who would definitely say ‘ah I see the moon is gibbous tonight’

i love the witches. Definitely lots of life can be dealt with by saying ‘ how would granny weatherwax sort this ‘

And a good dollop of Nanny Ogg's advice (“Always get the young man’s name and address”).

NoBinturongsHereMate · 28/11/2025 22:59

I agree Equal Rites is the place to start. Can't be doing with Colour of Magic and Light Fantastic, despite the Luggage, although the wizards later develop into a good thing. Rincewind needs dilution by the rest of the faculty.

BendoftheBeginning · 29/11/2025 08:44

ArabellaSaurus · 27/11/2025 09:51

Yes. Board meeting is today, I hope that they will be reviewing all of these events and the serious issues they throw light on.

How are things looking since the meeting? I can’t believe the library is STILL being ordered to censor such an innocuous book.

I hope someone has mentioned the BBC bias debacle to the board, it’s useful to consider alongside the demands of this latest letter.

VenusEnvyXX · 29/11/2025 16:14

ArabellaSaurus · 07/11/2025 08:10

Sorry, she also asked me to pass on her thanks for everyone's support and concern.

I'm glad she's in touch with you and getting support, Arabella.

The Articles Book group is on on Friday 5th, 2-4pm in the library. If she happens to be on duty and fancies chatting with people who'd like to thank her then we'll be at the side of the staircase.

All welcome, so if you are in Edinburgh next Friday please do come along, get some excellent coffee or cake, bring a book you have read and share it with the group. Any genre. Aggressive marauding optional.

Here's a thread about The Articles Book Group

Elaine Miller | Venus Envy (@GussieGrips) on X

Would you like to join me at 2pm on Friday 5th September at Scotland's National Library for my new book group, "The Articles"? The format is a bit different from usual book groups - everyone reads a book they already own, and tells the group about it...

https://x.com/GussieGrips/status/1962896715259769023?s=20

ArabellaSaurus · 29/11/2025 17:36

That looks absolutely brilliant, Venus. I think Vole is popping on now and again, so will hopefully see the message. I'd love to come, maybe next year if you keep it going!

Board meeting minutes not up on the website yet, I expect they may take a little bit.

Chrysanthemum5 · 29/11/2025 17:43

@VenusEnvyXX is the book club every month? It sounds brilliant but I'm not sure I can make this Friday

VenusEnvyXX · 29/11/2025 18:44

yes, first friday of the month, 2-4pm. The plan was to do it while the exhibition is on, we can check that The Women Who Wouldn't Wheesht book remains in its rightful place - but it's going really well and so I expect we'll just keep meeting!

SirChenjins · 29/11/2025 19:04

Damn my full time job - wish I could join you. Any plans to extend this online?

Seriestwo · 29/11/2025 22:16

I’d join online too. It sounds great

BingBongSong · 30/11/2025 09:28

Late to the Pratchett discussion but I'd wholeheartedly agree with starting with the witches. Every book is an absolute joy and Granny Weatherwax is also my hero. I adore Nanny Ogg too. I also love the Death books and enjoyed reading them with my son.

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 30/11/2025 09:43

VenusEnvyXX · 29/11/2025 16:14

I'm glad she's in touch with you and getting support, Arabella.

The Articles Book group is on on Friday 5th, 2-4pm in the library. If she happens to be on duty and fancies chatting with people who'd like to thank her then we'll be at the side of the staircase.

All welcome, so if you are in Edinburgh next Friday please do come along, get some excellent coffee or cake, bring a book you have read and share it with the group. Any genre. Aggressive marauding optional.

Here's a thread about The Articles Book Group

I am so sorry I wont be able to come along on Friday - but if there's another meeting at at the start of January I will make every effort to join you all! Have a great time.

VenusEnvyXX · 01/12/2025 10:44

SirChenjins · 29/11/2025 19:04

Damn my full time job - wish I could join you. Any plans to extend this online?

It would work online - I'd just need to learn how to do it...

VenusEnvyXX · 01/12/2025 10:46

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 30/11/2025 09:43

I am so sorry I wont be able to come along on Friday - but if there's another meeting at at the start of January I will make every effort to join you all! Have a great time.

First Friday of January is the 2nd, which is a public holiday in Scotland. We could do the 9th - I'll let you know. I'll set up a separate thread and stop hijacking this one!

VoleForceOne · 02/12/2025 15:56

VenusEnvyXX · 29/11/2025 18:44

yes, first friday of the month, 2-4pm. The plan was to do it while the exhibition is on, we can check that The Women Who Wouldn't Wheesht book remains in its rightful place - but it's going really well and so I expect we'll just keep meeting!

I checked yesterday and someone had put it back in the shelf bit amongst the other books so it was hard to spot. I put it back on top of the display with the cover displayed so would be worth checking it’s still there.

Swipe left for the next trending thread