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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Well, hello Emma Watson

884 replies

crumpet · 24/09/2025 22:11

www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-15130209/Harry-Potter-Emma-Watson-treasures-J-K-Rowling-trans-rights.html

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31
ThatCyanCat · 25/09/2025 09:06

TWAW is pretty much ubiquitous in the thespian world. I suppose you can see how it happens among people who make a living out of pretending to be something they're not. They should realise they're only pretending, though. Even when you do some gender bending in casting, like deciding to make Prospero a woman called Prospera and cast Judi Dench, you still need to know Prospero was originally written as a man and that Dench is a woman. Actors do tend to be a bit mad though.

usedtobeaylis · 25/09/2025 09:09

Butchyrestingface · 25/09/2025 09:03

I read an interview with Tom Burke of Strike fame, where he revealed he asked for media training from the BBC on how to handle enquiries about JKR and the trans issue.

He was resolutely a-political in his answers on the GC versus trans debate. Which made me think hope he's secretly GC and just too afraid to nail his colours to the mast.

Same, TRAs never put that much thought into diplomacy.

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:10

NameinVane · 25/09/2025 01:43

In some ways I’m heartened by this, in general I think it’s a good thing to be able to fundamentally disagree with someone about something but still respect and love them and it should be encouraged in this very black and white world we seem to live in.

I also don’t presume to know anything about JKR and EWs friendship (if that’s what it was) but I do remember when it all unfolded back in 2020 and JKR did her tweet and her essay in which she explained in very personal terms why she felt the way she did. I remember being quite shocked to see the glib EW tweet of “TWAW & TMAM and so sad for my trans fans and also donate to Mermaids”
shortly afterwards. It seemed a very odd and fairly cruel public response from a colleague/friend who positioned herself as a feminist to someone who was apparently close to her and had laid themselves bare in terms of detailing precisely why the abuse she had suffered from men meant that she thought self id was a bad idea and single sex spaces were important.

Fair enough if EW disagreed but she had the option of not saying anything given that JKRs views had absolutely nothing to do with her or even saying something along the lines of “I don’t agree but obviously she has the right to an opinion based on her own life experience”.

The what felt forced responses of the HP actors to JKR in 2020 when, on the face of it, there was no need for any of them to say anything at all, brought home to me how deeply this stuff was embedded and how powerful the forces were that were promoting it. Genuinely interested to know what the HP actors really think now and also why they all felt they had to put out public statements in response to what a woman who wrote the books that were made into films that they starred in years before as children said on Twitter.

Edited

I remember being quite shocked to see the glib EW tweet of “TWAW & TMAM and so sad for my trans fans and also donate to Mermaids”
shortly afterwards. It seemed a very odd and fairly cruel public response from a colleague/friend who positioned herself as a feminist to someone who was apparently close to her and had laid themselves bare in terms of detailing precisely why the abuse she had suffered from men meant that she thought self id was a bad idea and single sex spaces were important.
Fair enough if EW disagreed but she had the option of not saying anything given that JKRs views had absolutely nothing to do with her or even saying something along the lines of “I don’t agree but obviously she has the right to an opinion based on her own life experience”.

That's exactly how I felt, too. EW knew JK had been through domestic violence. So what she said felt extra cruel. EW could have realised JK is a wiser, older adult, maybe she as an elder knew more than her, and kept her mouth shut, instead of attacking her and really giving the misogynists an excuse to say "see! Not even her own actors agree with her!" It felt extra cruel. EW in her privileged position of money, never being poor, not needing to use public facilities - unlike JK, shitting on a woman who had went through so much. No, EW is a vile spoilt hateful bitch. I will never, ever, ever forgive her for what she said. Time can't remove that hateful cruelty.

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:12

mathanxiety · 25/09/2025 02:00

The only reason she had the platform she had was JKR.

She turned around and bit the hand that fed her, and never uttered a peep about "agreeing to disagree" when JKR was vilified in the most appalling way by people she sided with, and whose opinions she promoted on the platform she acquired due to JKR...

So I personally think it's malign in the extreme to breeze in and publicly thrust JKR into the role of "being the bigger person", with no accountability whatsoever on EW's part.

Tyra Banks Mic Drop GIF by Allure

Quite! And fuck anyone expecting JK, after all she went through, to be the 'bigger person' and EW to be allowed to get away with her hateful cruelty without being called to account.

Citrusbergamia · 25/09/2025 09:14

Hellohelga · 25/09/2025 08:53

What are you on about? Don’t understand a word of that.

So glad someone else said that...I thought exactly the same! 🤔

AngelinaFibres · 25/09/2025 09:18

WimbledonWhites · 24/09/2025 22:51

Everything in that article showcases perfectly how living such a privileged, cosseted life leads you to luxury beliefs like TWAW.

And to be a twat in repeatedly speeding in your car to the extent that you are banned for 6 months. Pathetic.Presumably travelling at a speed that means you might not kill someone else who happens to also live in Oxford is just too tricky for a film star.

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:19

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 04:33

Whilst it's true that those are JKR's views & those views are mainstream, the issue is how those views are framed which for many constitute dehumanising demonising dog whistles that by their very nature provide convenient plausible deniability. Whilst we can never know what is truly in JKR's heart, we can know that she not only supports many who are explicitly using such language as do her supporters but doesn't disavow it as Sex Matters does on their website to their credit. Of course she is not required to disavow what she must know is going on to prove her innocence but it certainly smells like complicity when she doesn't given the huge influence she wields.

Demonising? She has never demonised anyone. This, is demonising. This, is the vile, demonising, dehumanising, disgusting and despicable side you support. THIS, is demonising:

Well, hello Emma Watson
Well, hello Emma Watson
Well, hello Emma Watson
Well, hello Emma Watson
Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:20

YourBrickTiger · 25/09/2025 08:59

I don't agree. I've seen interviews with her and her behaviour at an awards ceremony and she seemed downright nasty and a bit of a bully tbh.

Look, It well could be that EW has decided to put her own ill feelings aside (that she may still harbour) in favour of the interests of trans people because JKR'S influence is so powerful.

Peace is made in such ways…

teawamutu · 25/09/2025 09:21

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:20

Look, It well could be that EW has decided to put her own ill feelings aside (that she may still harbour) in favour of the interests of trans people because JKR'S influence is so powerful.

Peace is made in such ways…

What ill feelings? Again, you're not making any sense. Please explain?

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:22

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 04:44

"when she was slammed for "liking" a tweet that referred to trans women as "men in dresses.”

-Supporting a dog whistle for ‘deluded’/mentally ill

Months later, Rowling came under fire again for coming to the defense of Maya Forstater. At the time, the researcher had been waging an employment discrimination battle, as her contract with a think tank wasn't renewed after she made a series of anti-trans statements. These statements included that people should not be "compelled to play along with literal delusions like 'transwomen are women,'" and she referred to a gender-fluid person as a "man who likes to dress in women's clothes.”

-Supporting those who explicitly call trans people ‘deluded’/mentally ill

"Rowling revealed she is a survivor of domestic abuse and sexual assault and said this led her to sympathize with women who had "concerns around single-sex spaces." She argued against throwing "open the doors of bathrooms and changing rooms to any man who believes or feels he's a woman.”

-Dog whistle for trans people as deluded predatory sex abusers

"Rowling published a new novel titled "Troubled Blood" under the pseudonym Robert Galbraith. The book, which revolved around a male serial killer who dresses like a woman, was accused of being anti-trans.
It was disappointing that Rowling was propagating a "long-standing and hurtful presentation of trans women as a threat," a spokesperson for Mermaids, a charity that supports trans children, said to CNN. Rowling, meanwhile, said the book "was loosely based" on real killers."

-Dog whistle for trans people as mentally ill abusers of women

"When Scotland's new Hate Crime and Public Order Act went into effect in April, Rowling tried to bait them into arresting her with posts online. The law criminalizes "stirring up hatred" against people based on their race, religion, disability, sexuality or gender identity. By passing the law, Scotland "placed higher value on the feelings of men performing their idea of femaleness, however misogynistically or opportunistically, than on the rights and freedoms of actual women and girls," Rowling said in the thread on X. If anything she wrote qualified as an offense under the new law, "I look forward to being arrested when I return to the birthplace of the Scottish Enlightenment," Rowling said."

-Dog whistle for trans people as deluded/mentally ill predatory abusers of women

"Rowling posted a photo from the fight, accusing Khelif of being a man who was "enjoying the distress of a woman he's just punched in the head."

-Dog whistle for mentally ill trans person who enjoys abusing of women

https://theweek.com/feature/1020838/jk-rowlings-transphobia-controversy-a-complete-timeline

Oh look: yet another link to a site that is a third hand source that REINTURPRETS JK's words and intentions in able to tell us what she "really thinks".

Strange how none of these links ever seem to call out TRA violence, behaviour, death threats, rape threats, beating up 72 year old women, and pulling out their cocks and urinating all over feminist statues. Strange how you never post links to accounts, even third hand accounts of that. Just the polite, non-violent DV survivor saying NO to men.

AngelinaFibres · 25/09/2025 09:23

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:20

Look, It well could be that EW has decided to put her own ill feelings aside (that she may still harbour) in favour of the interests of trans people because JKR'S influence is so powerful.

Peace is made in such ways…

There are men and there are women. Acceptance of that scientific fact brings peace. You can dress as you wish and call yourself Jessica, even though you have a penis and were named Jeffrey at birth. You cannot use female only spaces and you will never become an actual woman.

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:24

teawamutu · 25/09/2025 09:21

What ill feelings? Again, you're not making any sense. Please explain?

Regarding their differences in opinion.

wintergolds · 25/09/2025 09:24

Not sure who Jay Shetty is but I just got his interview with her (from 18hrs ago) in my suggested YT videos.

She’s self promoting atm, I guess.
It’s a shame they can’t give her exposure without bringing up her trans views/ stance on JKR views.

Christinapple · 25/09/2025 09:24

She probably has to pretend to like Jo to prevent receiving abuse.

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:24

WeeGeeBored · 25/09/2025 06:16

it sounds as though she wants to halt hostilities but you want (need?) to
keep them going.

The aggressor does not get the right to ask for hostilities to be stopped.

Christinapple · 25/09/2025 09:26

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:24

The aggressor does not get the right to ask for hostilities to be stopped.

"aggressor"?

She said she supported LGBT people several years ago.

DialSquare · 25/09/2025 09:26

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:20

Look, It well could be that EW has decided to put her own ill feelings aside (that she may still harbour) in favour of the interests of trans people because JKR'S influence is so powerful.

Peace is made in such ways…

LOL

Peace? She can peace off. She had no interest in peace when she was smugly mentioning “all the witches” in her speech. JKR has already said she will never forgive the celebrities who championed gender ideology and rightly so.

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:26

TheBeaTgoeson1 · 25/09/2025 06:32

I think we need to move away from this idea that if a child has cast in a film, at 10 or 11 years old, they have to then go onto agree with everything the author of the book which was optioned to make the films say years later.

To call someone ungrateful brat because they don’t agree with somebody is really unreasonable. Surely you can see that. she is an adult woman, with a right to her opinions.

But when those opinions besmirch a wise elder and domestic violence survivor, for the sole crime of simply wanting the female sex to have the most basic civil rights, especially when that aggressor has no real experience in life, then it does make her an ungrateful brat, and I'd say far worse than that.

ThePoshUns · 25/09/2025 09:26

My guess is that EW is setting her sights on becoming a writer, and maybe the publishing world isn’t so enthralled to the TWAW and she is realising that bitching about the worlds best selling author isn’t a good tactic to get on in that world.

teawamutu · 25/09/2025 09:27

Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:24

Regarding their differences in opinion.

Do you mean that Emma Watson is pretending she no longer harbours ill-feelings towards JKR, despite still being a passionate and committed handmaiden on the inside, because her net worth of <checks notes> £50 million-plus leaves her vulnerable to the evil billionaire's evil?

In which case:

  1. Gosh, she's a pretty worthless ally then, isn't she?
  2. Why didn't you just say so?
Howseitgoin · 25/09/2025 09:28

DialSquare · 25/09/2025 09:26

LOL

Peace? She can peace off. She had no interest in peace when she was smugly mentioning “all the witches” in her speech. JKR has already said she will never forgive the celebrities who championed gender ideology and rightly so.

Yikes! She sounds exactly like Trump at Charlie Kirk's funeral…😬

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 25/09/2025 09:29

DoinFineIThink · 25/09/2025 00:53

Exactly, where does it say she's changed her mind?
Have people actually read the article?
It just says that she hopes people can still get on even if they don't always share the same opinions, which sounds grounded and sensible seeing as they knew each other and got on before all the "trans differences" between them.
It also says where JK apparently said earlier that she "could never forgive her" (for her views and saying she can't agree with her?!)
I know who sounds the most reasonable and it's not JK

Evanna Lynch: "I think it's irresponsible to discuss such a delicate topic over Twitter through fragmented thoughts and I wish Jo wouldn't. That said, as a friend and admirer of Jo I can't forget what a generous and loving person she is."

Tom Felton: "I'm not really that attuned [to the trans debate]. The only thing I always remind myself is that I've been lucky enough to travel the world. Here I am in New York. And I have not seen anything bring the world together more than Potter, and she's responsible for that. So I'm incredibly grateful."

Ralph Fiennes: "I can't understand the vitriol directed at her. I can understand the heat of an argument, but I find this age of accusation and the need to condemn irrational. I find the level of hatred that people express about views that differ from theirs, and the violence of language towards others, disturbing."

Helena Bonham Carter: "She's allowed her opinion, particularly if she's suffered abuse. Everybody carries their own history of trauma and forms their opinions from that trauma and you have to respect where people come from and their pain. You don't all have to agree on everything - that would be insane and boring. She's not meaning it aggressively, she's just saying something out of her own experience."

Or even Nick Frost: "She's allowed her opinion and I'm allowed mine, they just don't align in any way, shape or form."

Or how about Miriam Margolyes: "I think everybody can be criticised, I think that's fair enough, but everybody's so horrid and nasty and unkind and I don't like that. I don't want to be unkind about trans...I mean, I'm a gay woman myself and you just have to put up with it. I don't know if [Rowling] has been badly treated but I think it was wrong that she wasn't invited to the celebrations for Harry Potter. You know, she created the whole thing. She may be wrong about some things. And women's bodies are tremendously important - I love my body, even though it's fat and misshapen, and I wouldn't be a man for anything. But trans - who cares? Let's be kind, let's be inclusive. I think there's an awful lot of nonsense talked about it. [...] I salute her as a very great writer and I think I like the detective stories best."

It should be noted that Miriam Margolyes (despite having a role in the films) apparently doesn't know JKR and has never met her. But she was still able to say something positive about her, something more nuanced than Watson, Radcliffe, Grint et al, who owe their entire careers to JKR.

These are examples of how you can disagree with someone, or decline to get involved, without putting the boot into someone.

So many other Harry Potter cast members have managed not to be awful about JK Rowling. But Emma Watson has been awful.

And let's not forget that she directly responded to JK Rowling's blog post by tweeting to the world that she donates to Mermaids and urging her followers to do the same. Who knows how many binders were secretly supplied to teenage girls without their parents' knowledge, or how many children were fast tracked onto puberty blockers thanks to the spike in donations that Emma's tweet may have generated?

OK she may not have referred directly to JKR in that tweet, but the timing was not coincidental. It was in direct response to JKR's statements. And in the intervening five years she has made many sly little digs.

So what's caused this change? She's finally seen the way the wind is blowing and realised that most people in the real world agree with JKR? She can see the iceberg looming and is scrambling for the life boats? Yeah, very classy. Unfortunately for her, the internet never forgets.

DialSquare · 25/09/2025 09:29

I wouldn’t go so far as saying she sounded exactly like Trump but she was extremely smug.

ThatBlackCat · 25/09/2025 09:30

Newsenmum · 25/09/2025 06:55

Good on her. I dont think people realise how she will be treated for this.

I have NO mercy for her! None whatsoever. What she did to JK was beyond abhorrently cruel. She deserves everything that's coming her way.

anyolddinosaur · 25/09/2025 09:30

Actress who has not had an acting job for 7 years realises that biting the hand that fed you does not endear you to other potential employers.

could have been child finally develops adult brain but the way she talks about driving = not yet.

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