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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Nottingham Die-In on 16 August

180 replies

Greyskybluesky · 13/08/2025 16:15

Anybody?

This movement really does feed off itself in the most unhealthy way, creating paranoia, fearfulness and division.

OP posts:
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StellaAndCrow · 17/08/2025 13:31

BetweenTwoFerns · 17/08/2025 08:48

There’s already signs up in some shops and restaurants in Nottingham saying they won’t adhere to single sex toilets and changing rooms. There’s one in the window of Lucy and Yak.

Lucy and Yak!!!!! Oh yes, natural home of the most marginalised in society!😆

Keeptoiletssafe · 17/08/2025 15:39

Regarding preventing deaths in toilets:

The people most likely to die in toilets are those who have medical problems (11% of cardiac arrests are on the loo), drug users and people who want to end their lives.

The biggest way to prevent more people dying in toilets is not to have gender neutral or mixed sex toilets and for everyone to stick to the toilet for their sex. In that way, toilets designs can get back to having door gaps.
Then anyone at their most vulnerable has the best chance of being rescued because they will be seen through the door gaps that are allowed in single sex toilets when there’s a single sex area in front of them. I know because that’s how I saved a young woman who I saw had collapsed in her cubicle as soon as I entered the ladies. In two recent more publicised events of toilet deaths outside the home, one man was found after 6 days and one woman after 3 days. No one knew they were there.

Privacy is why a lot of deaths (and assaults) happen in disabled toilets too. Children are led into these toilets, women are pushed back into them. Thats why there should be an exemption for children to go into single sex toilets of the sex of their carer.

For a death risk example, a quote from academic US research: ‘Public restrooms are often used as drug consumption sites because of the privacy they offer. However, it is this inherent privacy, especially with single-user restrooms, that invites solitary consumption. And that is also what makes it so dangerous: With no one nearby to call for emergency assistance or administer naloxone, individuals are at a higher risk for death should an overdose occur.’

What should happen is there should be single sex accessible (disabled) toilets so these toilets have the same benefits of single sex design.

If there is really no way someone wants to use a toilet with male or female on it then the mixed sex toilet should be really closely monitored. In my research, this isn’t practical and isn’t liked. But it is why it ‘works’ better (say) in a cafe that has only one toilet space available.

I started looking at toilet safety because of the risks of medically vulnerable people dying in toilets that were private designs. These private designs are said to be ‘inclusive’ and have their origins to transactivists in New York nightclubs. This is not transphobic, it’s just facts that anyone can look up and I have worked back to from researching toilet safety for the last few years. It’s also not anti-men to say that men like having sex in toilets more than women. In fact, it was argued in Parliament it was discrimination against men to make it illegal to have sex in a public toilet (it has been since 2003). It’s not anti-sex to say the conditions that make a toilet cubicle good to have consensual sex in are the conditions that non-consensual sex will happen in (read Rod Liddle’s account of the BBC toilets in the Spectator).

Privacy comes at the cost of health and safety for all at our most vulnerable. It also comes at a cost for any provision at all: the more toilets are misused, the more they cost to maintain and the more likely there are to be shut. It even stops people using an area (such as shops) at all as the area gets a reputation and the ‘good people’ avoid it.

What you think you want and what you need can be two different things.

I have written a lengthy post because I hope the group will look at it and start thinking about what they need. I think it should be their safety (and health). If they really want to be radical and campaign for mixed sex toilets to have door gaps in them to be as safe as the single sex designs then I can help with my research. I am happy to discuss. But I don’t think society is really ready for that. It’s going against building regs too.

SidewaysOtter · 17/08/2025 15:51

ItsCoolForCats · 17/08/2025 09:09

🤣🤣🤣

People who wear Lucy and Yak are just the sort to hold luxury beliefs

Wearers of Lucy and Yak dungarees remind me of Georgia Tennant and her "You are loved" Instagram posts about trans kids <rolls eyes>

EmpressaurusKitty · 17/08/2025 16:06

That’s a really informative post, @Keeptoiletssafe. Thank you.

cariadlet · 17/08/2025 17:30

EmpressaurusKitty · 17/08/2025 16:06

That’s a really informative post, @Keeptoiletssafe. Thank you.

Agreed. Very interesting and useful.

DomesticatedZombie · 17/08/2025 21:01

StellaAndCrow · 17/08/2025 13:29

I think I've missed the point of this protest.

Why are trans people dying?

Because men aren't allowed in womens loos.

JanesLittleGirl · 17/08/2025 22:53

DomesticatedZombie · 17/08/2025 21:01

Because men aren't allowed in womens loos.

Almost. It's because men will die unless they are allowed in women's loos.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 17/08/2025 23:17

SidewaysOtter · 17/08/2025 15:51

Wearers of Lucy and Yak dungarees remind me of Georgia Tennant and her "You are loved" Instagram posts about trans kids <rolls eyes>

And the baby shouters at LWS Brighton, one of them was staff to Loyd Russell-Moyle MP, as he was then.

Needapadlockonmyfridge · 18/08/2025 07:23

Honestly, you couldn't make it up, could you.

EmpressaurusKitty · 18/08/2025 07:29

Are Lucy and Yak (or Run and Fly) the closest they can get to adult rompers?

borntobequiet · 18/08/2025 07:53

For some reason I thought Lucy and Yak was a pet food company, perhaps because yak is approximately the sound my cats make when they throw up.

RedToothBrush · 18/08/2025 09:56

Do Lucy and Yak exist beyond the city centre limits of a select number of cities? Do they deliver to places beyond the likes of Didsbury? Like Grimsby?

roseyposey · 18/08/2025 11:36

RedToothBrush · 18/08/2025 09:56

Do Lucy and Yak exist beyond the city centre limits of a select number of cities? Do they deliver to places beyond the likes of Didsbury? Like Grimsby?

No. Lucy and Yak do not make clothes for people who shop in economically and socially deprived areas of the UK.

borntobequiet · 19/08/2025 06:57

Well, if I go to Nottingham I’ll know which businesses to avoid now.

SidewaysOtter · 19/08/2025 07:05

There are some national chains on that list, including Brewdog, Pitcher and Piano and Broadway cinemas.

Ones to add to the boycott list?

StormyPotatoes · 19/08/2025 07:32

I don’t quite get what the campaign actually is though. ‘Your spaces too’ just sounds like establishments won’t discriminate against trans people (rightly so), but I don’t think it follows it anyway that they’ll be breaking any laws.

Just as an aside on the topic of the ‘Rainbow Quarter’, I note there are several brands in Hockley that aren’t on the list. How do they feel about being considered a ‘rainbow’ venue on virtual of their location? Did anyone ask them I wonder? I seem to recall Sexy Mamas got in some hot bother a couple of years ago when the owner said trans women are men (or something to that effect). They cant be the only brand not thrilled about being forced included.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/08/2025 07:49

Interesting seeing businesses openly stating that they'll defy the law and discriminate against women by allowing men to share changing rooms, toilets etc.
Tanya de Grunwald (an HR commentator) has some excellent podcasts exploring this and looking at why HR has generally lost the plot and have been encouraging businesses to behave in a way that causes actual harm to themselves by pandering to trans extremism. One example with Maya F here:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jt3v3Uy0SEA

BetweenTwoFerns · 19/08/2025 08:11

StormyPotatoes · 19/08/2025 07:32

I don’t quite get what the campaign actually is though. ‘Your spaces too’ just sounds like establishments won’t discriminate against trans people (rightly so), but I don’t think it follows it anyway that they’ll be breaking any laws.

Just as an aside on the topic of the ‘Rainbow Quarter’, I note there are several brands in Hockley that aren’t on the list. How do they feel about being considered a ‘rainbow’ venue on virtual of their location? Did anyone ask them I wonder? I seem to recall Sexy Mamas got in some hot bother a couple of years ago when the owner said trans women are men (or something to that effect). They cant be the only brand not thrilled about being forced included.

It’s ’more than alleyship’. It would be great if it was just that they wo t discriminate against trans people. I think that’s something that everyone wants but it isn’t just that apparently. That’s something they want to make very clear.

Nottingham Die-In on 16 August
Nottingham Die-In on 16 August
Nottingham Die-In on 16 August
EmpressaurusKitty · 19/08/2025 08:15

I see they mention that it’s not legal advice, but it would be very easy to miss that bit.

StormyPotatoes · 19/08/2025 08:23

Oh dear! I assumed some of these businesses would know better. I’d be interested to see what happens to complete allyship if one of the 100 was to be sued.

SidewaysOtter · 19/08/2025 09:00

EmpressaurusKitty · 19/08/2025 08:15

I see they mention that it’s not legal advice, but it would be very easy to miss that bit.

Ah, the Stonewall caveat.

“We advise you to do this but if you get sued it’s not our fault.”

DomesticatedZombie · 19/08/2025 09:01

Handy.

RedToothBrush · 19/08/2025 09:07

SidewaysOtter · 19/08/2025 09:00

Ah, the Stonewall caveat.

“We advise you to do this but if you get sued it’s not our fault.”

Wait until 'but Stonewall made me do it' mania starts to hit.

CinnamonCinnabar · 19/08/2025 09:49

Lins77 · 16/08/2025 19:25

On the disability thing, I knew a very severely disabled (from birth) young person- able to do very little independently, requiring a very high level of care - who had adopted a trans identity and was taking female hormones. It seemed clear to me that this young person could control so little about their own body, that "trans" was one thing they could exert some control over. It was really sad.

For someone who sounds like they have limited mobility taking oestrogen is worrying - increases the risk of blood clots (which will already be higher due to reduced mobility).

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