Good Law Project's latest claim - fact check?

[teawamutu]

I'm sure there must be some arrant bollocks in here somewhere, because Jolyon.

But is there anything worrying in this?

goodlawproject.org/ehrc-backs-down-on-single-sex-toilets/

It is absolutely devastating. You can't see this because you lack understanding and empathy.

"Mandora"?
Shall I report this?

Funnily enough I expect they will decide that fighting against women's rights is a better use of their time and resources.

But they shouldn't have included male people if they were designated for female people. This should never have been permitted, and this has now been rectified by the recent ruling.

The world will keep turning now that people have to use the appropriate and designated facility for their sex or else a unisex or third space.

What are you going to do? A quick chromosome swab? Whip down the pants and flash us the genitals? Whip out the birth certificate?

Are you confusing sex and gender again? They're asking how you would keep men out in your scenario with your definition of "men". For which none of that is relevant.

(On our definition of men, we keep men out because they're clearly obviously men, using this superpower called eyesight. I'm interested what your superpower for detecting non-sex-based "men" is)

For what? Calling a male poster a male?

Has anyone been able to replicate Layla Moran's mystic ability to see the female soul of a penis person?

I'm sure you're right you're right. A better response would have been to express concern that Tandora appears to be suggesting that trans folk are incapable of obeying the law, adhering to the social contract and respecting the rights of women and girls who don't wish to be undressed in the presence of men claiming to be women.

These services have historically included trans women

Only if your understanding is that “historically” means the last couple of decades, and that the inclusion of transwomen was not a result of asking women if it was OK.
It’s also worth noting that many women’s services are of relatively recent origin and were set up for women by women -sometimes with difficulty and against opposition - well before trans became a thing. It’s a phenomenon that’s grown incredibly fast in a very short time despite much effort to persuade us otherwise.

tandora yes or no - do you believe that sex and gender identity are different things?

The recent guidance has merely provided clarity on what was always the casee. It has not created a new law. What had happened previously was that lobby groups and activists had misrepresented the equalities act and had lobbied to have access to whatever they wanted to validate their identities.

It was the protections and rights of women and girls that had been violated and dismissed.

You keep saying the same things......none of it changes the reality of sex and what constitutes 'single sex' in law, or in everyday life.

Ohhhh you’re going to use the power of your eyesight. Good one. So I guess you will be the person harrassing GNC people in toilets then. Meanwhile your rule will fail to be enforced since trans people who pass will be a-ok.

Here Tandora demonstrates a clear understanding that birth sex and acquired legal gender (certificated by GRC) are indeed different. 👌

Anyway as usual this conversation is in the absolute gutter.

And there we have it.

The real victims of banning male people who wear skirts and makeup from women's toilets will be female people who have short hair and wear no makeup, because it's so easy to get these two groups of people mixed up.

How many trans people do you think pass as the opposite sex?

Astonishing that anyone claiming to be a trans advocate would even hesitate to answer this, so I guess that speaks for itself. No conviction.

I think that would be you, as you are (from what you have posted) making judgements about other people’s gender.

You just haven’t explained how.

I have empathy for genuine suffering, but that does not mean that women and girls must cede their legal rights and protections to men.

What is so 'devastating' about having to use a facility for your sex or else a neutral third one? 'Devastating' is a very strong word. Maybe what you mean is the fantasy of of being another sex has been destroyed by the clear light of day, and by this legal ruling?

This is the problem with an identity based on an illusion or 'a feeling'. it is deeply susceptible to destruction - because of its fragile nature. But people and the world cannot be expected to cater to people with fragile mental health by giving them access to whatever it is they want.

We've all faced loss and grief. It is not unique to people with trans identities.

This many.

I can understand that some people might fear the psychological consequences of going to the gents and not being challenged.

If you want clarity about the requirement for buildings to have, in the first place, single sex toilets, with 'universal' toilets as an optional extra, or as an alternative if there is insufficient space for segregated toilets, you [and arguably the GLP] need to read a bit more widely - workplace rules, equality legislation, health and safety directives, building regs etc.

Doing a textual analysis of the EHRC's wording is not the ideal way to get the clarity you seek about toilet provision, it's always best to go back to the primary sources.

Would it be helpful if I posted again that link I posted for you a while ago to the HM Government Requirement T1: Toilet accommodation document?

We don't lack understanding or empathy, we are just sick of these things being demanded from us and never reciprocated.

I'd like to see trans people show some understanding and empathy for women.

@Tandora read my post at 15.00
Can you see the problem men have created by going into women’s toilets? The recent knee-jerk solution has been to make individual cubicles more private. Including in schools which has led to some horrendous situations. But now, because of the Supreme Court judgement, everyone will be much more willing and confident to call men out. We can prioritise safety again 😍in design.

We are all safer if we stick to public toilets for our own sex.

But safety is also the reason young boys should accompany their mums into toilets too. And practically every woman has no problem with that.

I would like you to respond with your solution.

.. perhaps, but some of us are looking at the literal stars