My employer has just removed single sexed toilets to be more inclusive!

[Dhama]

In light of the SC ruling. Wtaf

Previously we had men, women and a unisex accessible toilet. They have now, in the guise of being inclusive, removed all signage and all are mixed sex.

The toilets are all individual, lockable with washing facilities included but that’s not the point. I hate using a toilet after men have been in there fgs.

We are a LA so unsure what the provisions are in other offices across the county.

I have emailed the head of facilities but not sure if I can do anything else.

am so cross

They are 3 fully enclosed toilets with handwashing facilities.

They don’t need to be sexed.

They’re 3 unisex toilets.

an individual toilet is a single sex space. As it can only be used by a single person at a time.

so you would foul a single enclosed toilet with blood.

maybe that’s what the men smearing are trying to achieve.

We’re NOT just talking about the trans community. We are talking about MEN.

This has been said time and time again. And the fact the trans community is small is more - not less - reason to ensure their wants do not trump the needs of women and girls.

Women and girls are at massively higher risk in mixed sex changing soacea and toilets. That’s evidenced by official statistics and is not something any thinking person can credibly argue against. Letting men in makes women and girls more vulnerable. Fact.

Why do you think the wants of men should be prioritised above the safety of women? What’s wrong with trans women using a third space? Or the men’s?

My issue is that they have removed single sex provision to mixed sex, therefore I may have to use the toilets that men use. It’s not just about transwomen it’s about all men

My experience, and that of my colleagues I have spoken to, is that men are quite grim, leave the seat up etc. We don’t want to have to clean a toilet to use it.

There was no reason to change it, my LA quoted they are changing facilities to be inclusive; we already had ‘inclusive’ facilities so making more wasn’t needed, and not at the expense of women.

I appreciate not all men are gross, I understand that some women don’t mind sharing facilities, I understand that some people prefer it. I don’t, neither do my colleagues, my colleague who can’t walk upstairs in now being made to share the toilets with men.

Its not great.

There are many lovely men in my life, who are absolutely safe around women - well I say that, I'm sure many other women have and then later been shocked, but my belief is that they truly are lovely people -

and I do not want to get undressed with, or share a toilet space with, or a shower with, or have intimate care from any of them. And they would be equally embarrassed and think it inappropriate, because they are decent people who understand the issues and do not wish to make others uncomfortable and unhappy, or affect their access.

And if I did insist that other women had to cope with my lovely Nigels men friends and relations because it's so silly and pearl clutchy and other shaming terms for women to have boundaries and feelings that I don't personally, and I mostly want to enable my men friends... not only would I be insensitive, lack empathy and consideration, and be quite staggeringly 'all about me' self centred - I'd also be actively excluding many women from the women's space to shoehorn my lovely friends in.

Women with trauma I don't understand because I haven't experienced it. Some women with disabilities. Some women with faiths and cultures I won't sneer at because I dont believe my own beliefs and cultures are the only right ones and everyone else should get over their backward little ways and be like me.

No men.

Third spaces are the answer. Women who wish to can undress and shower with men all day, I wish them all a lovely time. And we can all respect the equality of need and access for the women who do not wish to.

Why do you guys think a transwomen would stand to piss. They would sit and tuck.

if they are trying to live as a woman it would be counterintuitive to stand a wee.

This, absolutely. What I’ve partially been trying to say but in a very cack-handed way.

As a biological woman and no spring chicken anymore, I hate communal lavatories with cubicles next to each other and shared washing facilities, for personal reasons there’s no need to go into.

I far, far prefer an individual facility with complete privacy. Who uses it before or after me makes absolutely no difference to me. When I’m using it, it’s single sex.

Exactly. How many men put the seat back down.

They should ask women what they prefer op.

No one is going to be undressing or showering in a mixed sex toilet cubicle?
The occupant is in there by themself?
Really, why does it matter who uses it before or after you?

Mess and men leaving the seat up.

They can keep their own cubicle for that.

We seem to have descended into characterising most men as closet sex pervert who can’t help wank or smear faeces as soon as they’re left to their own devices.

arguing for safe single sex spaces is fine.

But why are we suddenly decided that all men are uncontrollable antisocial sex pests. Toilets in the park don’t even have poo smeared in the walls.

it’s such hysteria and not helpful to anyone

I don't want to use a toilet covered in trans identified men's seed, what's so hard to understand about that?

I don’t and would completely agree with you about communal areas where people are undressing. Sports facilities and swimming pools, etc. I don’t believe that trans women (or men for that matter) should be able to compete in sport competitions against anyone other than those of the same biological sex as their own, either.

Isn’t this thread just about mixed sex toilet cubicles, though? Genuinely don’t understand why it matters who has used the cubicle before or after you? Really can’t understand the panic and necessary scaremongering about this particular issue.

I accept that others feel it, though. Doesn’t make them right, though, any more than it does me. It’s personal preference. Not quite sure why me disagreeing is met with derision.

As they say in the ads, here’s the science bit:

If you feel nauseous or ill you are likely to head to the toilet. If you collapse, you are more likely to survive, or avoid suffering long-term damage, if someone notices and rescues you in time.

There are known medical reasons for a disproportionally high frequency of cardiac arrests and strokes while an individual is in the toilet room. There are no UK statistics that list where people collapse. However, it is known there are around 100,000 hospital admissions due to heart attacks in this country, equating to one every five minutes. It is estimated there are 400,000 people in the U.K. with undiagnosed heart failure. There are also around 100,000 strokes in this country, equating to one every five minutes. Around 1% of people in this country have epilepsy and around 80 people are diagnosed with epilepsy each day. There are many other conditions that lead to collapse where you need to be noticed and accessed quickly eg. diabetes and asthma.

In addition theres the Bath University study to discuss children have collapsed and stopped breathing due to 1 in 6 vapes they used being spiked. Where do they go to vape? The toilets. ‘Luckily’ the multiple children that have collapsed, have done so visibly in playgrounds, cooridors etc. so cpr has saved them. The new standard school toilet is enclosed.

You should design your toilets around health and safety. Which isn’t mixed sex private enclosed toilets.

I have got some sexual assault statistics too because unisex toilets being private and mixed sex creates the ideal opportunity for this. It’s more than I thought. Even the uk school stats run at 1 rape per school day (all locations not given but examples are mixed sex private toilet and a store cupboard).

Maybe that’s part of the reason I don’t get the issue. Men in my family don’t make mess and leave the seat up.

Yes, it is.

Trans identified men’s seed?

Oh fgs. A perfect example of what @beAsensible1 just said.

I’ve been told many times now - and accept, my initial misunderstanding - that this thread isn’t about trans men but men in general so why the need to resort to such an outlandish statement’s.

Its just that sort of thing that makes lots of people not take any genuine concerns seriously.

To get back to the issue raised by the OP - the very first, and very clear, requirement in building regs is for single sex toilets, unless there isn't enough room:
The objective of this requirement is to require toilet accommodation in non-residential buildings to be separate single-sex toilets, with single-sex shared or individual hand-washing facilities. Universal toilets can be provided in addition to single-sex provision and where space allows.
Toilet accommodation: Approved Document T

In this case, and in the case of the Barbican, there clearly was enough room for the single-sex toilets required by building regs, because they used to exist, so removing them would appear to be going against building regs.

But women lift the seat to hover and not get wee on the toilet seat.

it is already single sex loo. Unless it’s a yrinal a toilet facilities is not sexed! It human waste receptacle.

it far more efficient for 3 single use unisex loos that can work for whoever needs them at the time than it is to have them separated by sex

especially if you are not trying to run afoul of changes in law.

@MrsSkylerWhite you are not in a more vulnerable category for toilet design. You haven’t eliminated risk but from your posts it sounds like you are healthy and affluent. If you are heterosexual man too you would be in the least risk category for harm coming to you in a toilet outside your home.

Does someone’s economic situation impact on the likelihood of them being attacked in a public facility, @Keeptoiletssafe?

If so, that’s interesting.

Because you do not have the right to say men cannot use a single person toilet.

sorry but that is absurd. Yes group single sex spaces are fine.

you might as well start arguing for sex segregation In the public sphere if we are going to imply that anytime a man is alone in with a closed door he is going to wank.

is this really what you all think of the men you know?

Spotless public toilets only exist where people are employed to inspect and clean them, perhaps hourly or more often. This rarely happens in small workplaces.

Did you not see all the protests after the supreme court ruling? Plenty of transwomen standing to pee on display there

I'm not talking about all men, I'm referring to the men who dress in frocks to gain access to women's toilets so as to practise their onanism.