My employer has just removed single sexed toilets to be more inclusive!

[Dhama]

In light of the SC ruling. Wtaf

Previously we had men, women and a unisex accessible toilet. They have now, in the guise of being inclusive, removed all signage and all are mixed sex.

The toilets are all individual, lockable with washing facilities included but that’s not the point. I hate using a toilet after men have been in there fgs.

We are a LA so unsure what the provisions are in other offices across the county.

I have emailed the head of facilities but not sure if I can do anything else.

am so cross

This is why I wish people would stop complaining about toilets as I knew this would happen. I'd rather the occasional trans use the toilet (which I think has happened once to me) than always have to use unisex ones which are always a disgusting mess. Unisex toilets have been on the increase for years now and I hate them.

You’d have to be Mr Magoo to miss it 99.999% of the time.

You do know the judgment was about the definition of sex, woman and man throughout the equality act?

thats not what the judgment was.... it was about the use of the word "woman" when in context of equality act related provision. There is not one mention of "men" in this context in their 6 page press release summary judgment and so few in the 88 page judgment that i cant remember any (but couldnt swear that there isnt)

the judgment was about whether quotas for women on public boards in scotland could include trans women. That was the case, that was the appeal.

Got quite far in there before a ‘women do it too!’ comment popped up.

Yeah I’ve been in a single sex toilet that’s been left in a mess but they are in no way comparable to mixed sex/used by men toilets. I absolutely hate using gender neutral toilets. The last one I checked about 3 before I found one that didn’t have the seat left up (Talisker distillery even though you didn’t ask).

those defending. Mixed sex loos need to research what men do in them. It's not just leaving the seat up. It's masturbating and ejaculating knowing full well ( and being turned on ) by knowing women use the loo as well. And going down the sanitary towel bins.
As soon as I started looking into this issue I would never use a mixed sex loo again. I don't think a lot of the be kind/ I have a gender neutral loo in my home/ it's only a loo: you are a pearl clutcher brigade have any comprehension of the depravity of the male sexual psyche fuelled as the modern man is with extreme porn/ misogynist influencers.

"I have a gender neutral loo in my home/ it's only a loo: you are a pearl clutcher brigade have any comprehension of the depravity of the male sexual psyche fuelled as the modern man is with extreme porn/ misogynist influencer

Rampant misandry.

Guess you refuse to use a single toilet in a cafe ; a man might have been in there ...

Tell the men to complain I bet it will be changed quietly back

Where does one research this? Whilst I'm sure some men do this, I'm also sure a majority don't.

Thanks all, I will have a look at those links provided.

I have a response that says there are single sex facilities on another level, in another part of the building.

I have gone back and asked to see a copy of their EIA and Risk assessment that formed these decisions, I have also raised about those with disabilities that may mean accessing stairs and those who may need urgent access are likely to be facing indirect discrimination.

Shockingly (not) there is a lack of sanitary provision in all of the unisex toilets so I have raised how this is also against Workplace Regulations

I don’t expect them to change it tbh but they can bloody well explain their justification and reasoning.

Thanks again for all the advice and solidarity

I don't know what point you think you are making but this, from the summary, could not be any clearer:

The Supreme Court unanimously allows the appeal. It holds that the terms “man”, “woman” and “sex” in the EA 2010 refer to biological sex. Lord Hodge, Lady Rose and Lady Simler give a joint judgment, with which the other Justices agree.

(BTW, I counted 11 uses of the word 'man' in that summary)

The point I was making to the pp was that we are not in this situation because of people 'complaining about toilets'. The judgment secures all our sex based rights as laid out in the EA. Not just toilets but changing rooms, hospital wards, hostel accommodation, refuges, prisons, same sex care, single sex associations, equality monitoring, positive action, as well as suitable comparators for discrimination cases. It also secures the rights of those with the PCs of sexual orientation and pregnancy and maternity.

Do you honestly think we would have collectively raised thousands and thousands of pounds and supported these fearless women through a legal battle lasting seven years, all the way up to the supreme court, if this was only about equality monitoring on public boards in Scotland? Or only about toilets? Do you think we are stupid?

Perhaps that pp would prefer the judgment to have said:

The Supreme Court unanimously allows the appeal. It holds that the terms “man”, “woman” and “sex” in the EA 2010 refer to biological sex. Except for toilets. Do what you want all the time regarding toilets.

Or perhaps she doesn't care about any of those other rights either.

I’m confident that if I was a chronic unisex toilet masturbator that I probably wouldn’t tell researchers.

I understand that some men might have lower standards of personal hygiene, but that whole post feels like a mighty stretch. Toilets are for pissing and shitting in, they were never going to be very nice places. As long as they aren’t in there doing it with me, I don’t spend a lot of time worrying about what other people do in there.

Not weighing in on the debate at all. But these type of toilets have existed for a long time - within rhe property industry they’re referred to as “super loos” because the loo, basin etc is fully enclosed and therefore anyone can use them privately.
They stem from taking up an overall less amount of space than you would having male and females toilets, hence developers putting them in

You don’t think men do this?? Wow. Where have you been?

They only take up less overall space because there are fewer of them. This doesn't benefit the actual users. They're also less safe.

@Dhama The toilets are all individual, lockable with washing facilities included but that’s not the point. I hate using a toilet after men have been in there fgs.

Unisex facilities that are individual, lockable with washing facilities included are a perfectly legal provision for safety, privacy and decency. If all facilities were cubicles in a larger room, with gaps around the cubicle partitions and communal washing facilities, it would be illegal to make those all unisex.

Your issue is misdirected. The solution is not to designate one individual, lockable room to be for men and the other for women. The issue is that one or more of your colleagues is a smelly and antisocial buffoon who doesn't know how to leave a toilet cubicle in a fit state for the next person. Some of your male colleagues who are perfectly well house-trained find it just as unpleasant to use the room after buffoon, and they have no fewer rights than you.

This isn't a trans issue or a privacy, safety and decency issue. It's just one more bit of patriarchy that there are men who think that keeping the facilities in a reasonable state to be used by the next person is not their problem because men shouldn't have to care about such things. Don't fight it by fighting for separate facilities. Fight it by calling for the patriarchal buffoons to be educated, as publicly and stridently as necessary.

Dread to think what sort of men you mix with and where you hang out.

With the notable exceptions of my father and brother, who both abused me in various ways I have been treated with nothing but respect and civility by all of the men in my life.
I have encountered, to my knowledge, 3 trans women in my lifetime who again have been respectful and I have never used a mixed sex public facility with faeces smeared on walls or any sign whatsoever of countless men masturbating.
In desperation sometimes, I’ve used men’s loos in theatres, etc. Other than urinals, which make the room smell a bit more, they have been in pretty much the same condition as the women’s.
Really don’t understand how some posters on these threads seem to be tripping over trans women everywhere they go.

Or puts the seat up first??

The majority don’t need to. Enough post photos of themselves and describe their own behaviour to make us aware that it is indeed a thing.

The guy photographing himself in fetish gear, masturbating in the NSPCC toilets leaps to mind… bring your whole self to work? Please don’t. Leave your fetishes and other antisocial behaviour at home, cheers.

Well I would hope any hoverer has the common decency to clean the toilet seat of their own piss. How bloody ironic that someone scared of sitting on a toilet seat that another human beings thighs have touched is quite happy to leave their own urine for someone else to deal with.

Dread to think what sort of men you mix with and where you hang out.

Come on, really? Does this sort of comment become you? It sounds like my 9 year old.

Not sure why you're quite so scathing about women being concerned for their safety? Why does it make you cross that we are concerned with protecting women and girls?

It's (very clearly) not about who I hang out with 🙄. It's about what some men do. Obviously. If you've never heard of men doing things like this, then I'm happy you've never had to experience it, but surprised you are so naive as to disbelieve that it happens. An idle Google will inform you.

And as has been pointed out ad nauseam on this board for years, it's not that we are 'anti-trans' it's that we are concerned about the risks posed by men. Which includes trans women. Those risks are not imaginings plucked from our backsides. They are documented risks evidenced by official statistics from the ONS, amongst other credible sources.

"Come on, really? Does this sort of comment become you? It sounds like my 9 year old."

This is ironic, given your previous posts....

And mastubate, they can't help themselves once they're in women's toilets and some unfortunate minimum wage worker has to clear up their mess off the walls and floor.

Yes, at 61, it does become me.

Why on earth would I google that? It’s not something I have ever encountered in real life so I’ve no interest in looking for it online.

I’m not looking for something to get angry about, though.

Most men masturbate in women’s toilets?

That’s just ridiculous.